The Instigator
HeWhoKnowsAll
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
libertarianmind
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

A good president would have us RECOVERED by now!

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 12/15/2012 Category: Politics
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 670 times Debate No: 28242
Debate Rounds (5)
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HeWhoKnowsAll

Pro

A good president would have had us recovered by now meaning; unemployment below 5%, debt below 10 trillion, less people on subsidies and welfare programs, a better job market, better GDP growth and less divided country!
libertarianmind

Con

Now, I do side partly with you (the Instigator of this debate).

A good president would have been more productive than Barack Obama has been; I hope his second term is more appealing. However, for the purpose of boosting debate skills and putting myself in the Democrats' shoes, I will be attempting to find reasoning on why Barack Obama has not lived up to our expectations as of yet. Truly, I believe he is failing, but I'm challenging myself to discuss the opposite.

I thank you for beginning this debate, and look forward to developing the conversation.
Debate Round No. 1
HeWhoKnowsAll

Pro

Thank you for accepting this debate libertarianmind. I was kind of hoping for one of the neo-liberals to accept but then I didn't know if I could handle their idiocy. It will be nice to debate with a more intelligent person.

We all know that obama has continually lied about inheriting the worst recession. The unemployment was lower, the inflation was lower, the banks and S&L companies were in better shape, no hangover from the oil crisis and there is no longer a cold war going on. Yes the Iraq war was essentially over and Afghanistan was still going on but they weren't the threat of the Soviet Union in 1981-1988.

The early 1980s recession was a severe recession in the United States which began in July 1981 and ended in November 1982.The primary cause of the recession was a contractionary monetary policy established by the Federal Reserve System to control high inflation.[4] In the wake of the 1973 oil crisis and the 1979 energy crisis, stagflation began to afflict the economy of the United States.

Unemployment had risen from 5.1% in January 1974 to a high of 9.0% in May 1975. Although it had gradually declined to 5.6% by May 1979, unemployment began rising again thereafter. It jumped sharply to 6.9% in April 1980 and to 7.5% in May 1980. A mild recession from January to July 1980 kept unemployment high, but despite economic recovery unemployment remained at historically high levels (about 7.5%) through the end of 1981.
The peak of the recession was in November and December 1982, when the nationwide unemployment rate was 10.8%, highest since The Great Depression. As of 2011, it is still the highest since the 1930s.

Inflation, which had averaged 3.2% annually in the post-war period, had more than doubled after the 1973 oil shock to a 7.7% annual rate. Inflation reached 9.1% in 1975, the highest rate since 1947. Inflation declined to 5.8% the following year, but then edged higher. By 1979, inflation reached a startling 11.3% and in 1980 soared to 13.5%. A brief recession occurred in 1980. Several key industries"including housing, steel manufacturing and automobile production"experienced a downturn from which they did not recover through the end of the next recession. Many of the economic sectors that supplied these basic industries were also hard-hit. Each period of high unemployment was caused by the Federal Reserve, as it substantially increased interest rates to reduce high inflation; each time, once inflation fell and interest rates were lowered, unemployment slowly fell.
Determined to wring inflation out of the economy, Federal Reserve chairman Paul Volcker slowed the rate of growth of the money supply and raised interest rates. The federal funds rate, which was about 11% in 1979, rose to 20% by June 1981. The prime interest rate, a highly important economic measure, eventually reached 21.5% in June 1982.

The recession came at a particularly bad time for banks due to a recent wave of deregulation. The Depository Institutions Deregulation and Monetary Control Act of 1980 (DIDMCA) had phased out a number of restrictions on banks' financial practices, broadened their lending powers, and raised the deposit insurance limit from $40,000 to $100,000 (raising the problem of moral hazard). Banks rushed into real estate lending, speculative lending, and other ventures just as the economy soured.
By mid-1982, the number of bank failures was rising steadily. Bank failures reached a post-depression high of 42 as the recession and high interest rates took their toll. By the end of the year, the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation (FDIC) had spent $870 million to purchase bad loans in an effort to keep various banks afloat.
The recession affected the banking industry long after the economic downturn technically ended in November 1982. In 1983, another 50 banks failed"easily beating the Great Depression record of 43 failures set in 1940. The Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation (FDIC) listed another 540 banks as "problem banks" on the verge of failure.

In 1980, there were approximately 4,590 state- and federally chartered savings and loan institutions (S&Ls) with total assets of $616 billion. Beginning in 1979, S&Ls began losing money due to spiraling interest rates. Net S&L income, which totaled $781 million in 1980, fell to a loss of $4.6 billion in 1981 and a loss of $4.1 billion in 1982. Tangible net worth for the entire S&L industry was virtually zero.

These were huge problems to deal with. Almost equal to the Great Depression. Reagan worked WITH the congress and was able to bring the recession under control by the last quarter of 1982 and in a full recovery in 1983. All this while still building our military and challenging the soviets to match us.

In July 1982, Congress enacted the Garn"St. Germain Depository Institutions Act of 1982 (Garn"St. Germain), which further deregulated banks as well as deregulating savings and loans. The Garn"St. Germain act authorized banks to begin offering money market accounts in an attempt to encourage deposit in-flows, removed additional statutory restrictions in real estate lending, and relaxed loans-to-one-borrower limits. The legislation encouraged a rapid expansion in real estate lending at a time when the real estate market was collapsing, increased the unhealthy competition between banks and savings and loans, and encouraged overbuilding of branches.

What has obama done other that put us 6.5 trillion further into debt, devalued our currency, divided the classes, divided the races, divided the sexes, helped the rich while letting the poor lose their houses and back the illegal push through of obamacare which as time goes on we are finding hurts more and more; doctors, health care facilities, corporations and small businesses and individual pocketbooks. The notion that this is to punish health care insurance companies and help the American people is ridiculous!!! The insurance companies will always pass the bill and make money. We had health care for all since Reagan signed the Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act in 1986. I will acknowledge that it wasn't the best medical act in the world but no matter how poor you were or what color your skin was, if you went to the emergency room with a headache and they found a tumor they would operate and remove it or give you chemo.
The constant finger pointing at bush, the republicans in congress, the right, the left, the middle, Romney and so on has not created any jobs. The only jobs created were in the private industry do to normal things like increase in demand of a product, stores hiring part time for holidays or people retiring and being replaced. Lending money to companies like solindra haven't created any jobs either nor has giving money to China to build wind and solar fields around the country created more than a handful of jobs 300 tops! I am an electrician and have been on solar jobs.
Every president before obama has dealt with some sort of recession and all dealt better with it than him. Even the second worst president FDR did better.

http://www.salon.com...
http://en.wikipedia.org...
libertarianmind

Con

libertarianmind forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2
HeWhoKnowsAll

Pro

I am disappointed. You did say you agreed though so I will let this round slide so as not to get too far ahead of you. I do hope you try to finish this even though we both know that A good president would have us RECOVERED by now!
libertarianmind

Con

libertarianmind forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
HeWhoKnowsAll

Pro

Even a supposed "mad man" did a better job than wilson, roosevelt and obama combined.

To deal with the massive unemployment and economic paralysis of the Great Depression, both the US and German governments launched innovative and ambitious programs. Although President Franklin Roosevelt"s "New Deal" measures helped only marginally, the Third Reich"s much more focused and comprehensive policies proved remarkably effective. Within three years unemployment was banished and Germany"s economy was flourishing. And while Roosevelt"s record in dealing with the Depression is pretty well known, the remarkable story of how Hitler tackled the crisis is not widely understood or appreciated.

Adolf Hitler became Chancellor of Germany on January 30, 1933. A few weeks later, on March 4, Franklin Roosevelt took office as President of the United States. Each man remained his country"s chief executive for the next twelve years -- until April 1945, shortly before the end of World War II in Europe. In early 1933 industrial production in each country had fallen to about half of what it had been in 1929. Each leader quickly launched bold new initiatives to tackle the terrible economic crisis, above all the scourge of mass unemployment. And although there are some striking similarities between the efforts of the two governments, the results were very different.

One of the most influential and widely read American economists of the twentieth century was John Kenneth Galbraith. He was an adviser to several presidents, and for a time served as US ambassador to India. He was the author of several dozen books, and for years taught economics at Harvard University. With regard to Germany"s record, Galbraith wrote: "" The elimination of unemployment in Germany during the Great Depression without inflation -- and with initial reliance on essential civilian activities -- was a signal accomplishment. It has rarely been praised and not much remarked. The notion that Hitler could do no good extends to his economics as it does, more plausibly, to all else."
libertarianmind

Con

libertarianmind forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
HeWhoKnowsAll

Pro

I think it is plain to see that with 47 recessions in our countries history and 22 since 1900, the only 2 that were brought out on a slow recovery were by FDR and obama. Being a likable guy is not a good requirement for a president. We need people in the white house who understand the economy and the way world trade works. In 25 days the liar and thief of the United States of America will have been seated in the oval office for 48 months and still has not helped bring us out of the recession. The American people have given us some hope by spending their saved money and some businesses are taking advantage of the low start up costs in a recession but obama has done nothing but pad the pockets of campaign contributors like solyndra. On January 21st 2013 the liar and thief of the USA will leave his legacy that I believe will only take 10 years to show him as the worst president ever in this great country. If a supposedly mad man such as Adolph Hitler can bring his country out of a worse depression in 2 years, than why couldn't a president with a super majority do it???
libertarianmind

Con

libertarianmind forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
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