The Instigator
InsertNameHere
Con (against)
Winning
27 Points
The Contender
TheWheel
Pro (for)
Losing
4 Points

A virgin should not be allowed to have an opinion on abortion.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 7 votes the winner is...
InsertNameHere
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/15/2010 Category: Health
Updated: 7 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 3,077 times Debate No: 12061
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (12)
Votes (7)

 

InsertNameHere

Con

This debate idea is based off another argument I was involved in on facebook where my opponents stated that because a virgin is not directly involved, abortion is an issue that doesn't concern them. I thank people there for inspiration. :) I'll be arguing that a virgin can indeed have an opinion on abortion as abortion is not a matter of sex, but a matter of life.

Now a few definitions:

Virgin- a person who has never had sexual intercourse.
http://dictionary.reference.com...

Abortion- Also called voluntary abortion. the removal of an embryo or fetus from the uterus in order to end a pregnancy, any of various surgical methods for terminating a pregnancy, esp. during the first six months.
http://dictionary.reference.com...

I'll begin my argument by stating that although a virgin may not direct experience an abortion she may be emotionally affected by somebody else's abortion. For example, somebody's close friend or relative could be pregnant and decide to have an abortion. This is a difficult experience for the mother as evidence shows that she can begin developing maternal bonds to the child pre-birth. http://jama.ama-assn.org... It's quite possible that anybody else in close contact with the pregnant woman could develop similar bonds regardless of whether they're a virgin or not. Wouldn't somebody be upset if their potential sibling, cousin, niece, or nephew was aborted?

Also, as stated in my opening statement, abortion is a matter of life. This debate will not be about whether a fetus is a human being or not(so please try to stay away from that), but about whether all humans should have a say on sparing a life.

Another point I'll like to address is whether you should be able to have an opinion on something if you have never experienced it yourself. Should heterosexuals be able to have an opinion on gay rights? Should the common working person be able to have an opinion on Capitalism when they don't own a business? Lastly, should a virgin be able to have an opinion on abortion? As these things all effect society as a whole I think they should be able to.

I'll now hand this over to my opponent to make their opening statements. Good luck to both of us! :)
TheWheel

Pro

I accept the resolution, and therefore Affirm: A virgin should not be allowed to have an opinion on abortion.

I thank my opponent, and gratefully accept their definitions.

My arguments stand as

1) Abortion is a matter that correlates to a couple who openly decide to have sexual intercourse, and want to prevent the child. Since abortion requires sexual intercourse, a virgin therefore, one who has NEVER had sexual intercourse, may not have an opinion because there is no way they may understand what the parents go through.

2) A virgin, if given the right to an opinion, could ruin the poor girls' lives by convincing them with their so-called "opinion" to not abortion. A recent study shows that many woman in the US alone die due to child-birth. http://www.msnbc.msn.com... There can be a great chance, though, not 100% proven, from not getting abortions.

A) The first effect of their opinion would be destroying the lives of the unprepared, or unwanting mother. The inexperienced virgin, not understanding what their doing, could cause this onto the mother willingly. This could later turn and effect the friend, or family members of the mother.

B) The second, and other effect is death. As the above warrant tells, women die often due to the child birth. Also, as a well-known fact, women are at a greater susceptibility to death in a limited period of time after the child birth.

Rebuttal:
1- The "emotion" argument cannot stand, because even though they have emotions, they have no logical right to an opinion. I can have an emotion of sadness when hearing of abortion, but I do not require a single opinion on it. And as argued in my contentions, they are inexperienced, and will not understand this. 2- The "bonds" simply don't matter; I can have a bond with my best friend, or even my parents, but that means nothing. That gives me no right to have an opinion on sexual intercourse, nor a reason why I should have one.

Next, to answer the questions.
- Yes, to the "Gay Rights," simply because they can understand why or why not they deserve them. I myself am for Gay Rights, because I, like everyone, can see Heterosexual rights. If I can see it, without being it, I can easily compare them, due to what we have.
- Please re-word the "Capitalism" question.
- The last question has an obvious answer: no.

To wrap up my Round ("1") speech, I'd simply like to ask a few questions.
- Do you have any opinion on the Physically handicapped?
- Why must people have an opinion on something they don't know, or have, entirely?
- Can you define the word "Virgin" in your own words?

Thank you, and good luck.
Debate Round No. 1
InsertNameHere

Con

I'll like to thank my opponent for interesting opening arguments.

Although a virgin may not have direct experience with childbirth or sexual intercourse, they can still hear about other people's experiences and be around pregnant women. This can give them knowledge of the issues around childbirth. Also, a virgin might happen to be trained as a nurse or doctor and work in a maternity ward. Surely these people, having direct experience with handling infants and giving birth can have an opinion. They know about the different effects a fetus or infant's health(or lack of) can have so they would be expert advice on whether the mother should get an abortion or not. My opponent failed to address this important point, that doctors and nurses, regardless of whether they're virgins or not, would know what's best for the mother.

Secondly, my opponent points out that many US women die in childbirth. While this is probably true, the causes are listed as maternal obesity and Caesarean sections. Both of those have little to do with abortion so a virgin's opinion would be irrelevant at that point. However, it would be different if a virgin was trying to convince the mother not to get a Caesarean section or not to lose weight, but that is not what this debate is about.

Thirdly, my opponent tackles the "emotion" argument. He states that another person's emotions are meaningless. However, he fails to address the fact that anybody he has an emotional attachment to could die. How would one feel if their best friend died? Their sister? Their mother? Anybody else? That fetus developing inside the mother could potentially be somebody's best friend, sister, mother, or anybody else so anybody should be able to have an opinion on whether to abort it or not.

I see that my opponent attempted to answer my hypothetical questions I asked at the end of my first argument. I'll like to address those next. A virgin isn't pregnant and a straight person isn't gay so why should one group be able to have an opinion about the issue that doesn't directly affect them while the other group can't? As for the "Capitalism" question it is now irrelevant to the rest of the debate so I will move on to my opponent's last request for me to define the word "virgin" in my own words.

Virgin: A person who has never experienced any form of sexual intercourse.

Lastly, I would like to say I may not be physically handicapped myself, but just like a virgin can have an opinion on abortion and a straight person on gay rights, a non-handicapped person can have an opinion on the physically handicapped.

Now I'll hand this over to my opponent. I look forward to interesting and intriguing rebuttals. Good luck! :)
TheWheel

Pro

I thank my opponent for their counter-arguments, and shall respond to them in order.

1- All Doctor's job is to tell them what the effects are. Whose job is it to choose whether the woman, aka the mother, has it or not? Is it the doctor who is having the abortion? No. The mother has it, and does not need any comments, or opinions from their doctor.

2- Of course, I would feel bad if someone I knew had died. My opponent's argument does state, in no way, how it should be an opinion of a virgin. These opinions of "anybody" could literally be non-virgins, so how can we go on the argument which doesn't state specifics. We can't. I'll answer this though as if it was specific on virgins: how would they know? Do you know when you're in the womb which other baby is going to be your best friend? No. We're no future-tellers, or Mind-readers. Again, opinions can hurt the mother in negative ways, such as harm to their life, and causing death in certain situations. My opponent disregarded this attack, so you can extend it.

I end my rebuttals, and look forward to my opponent's 2nd Rebuttal, as soon my own.
Debate Round No. 2
InsertNameHere

Con

I thank my opponent for a brief, to the point argument. I'll do my best to appropriately address all the points made.

First off, my opponent talks about people working in the medical field and states that it's ultimately not their decision whether a mother gets an abortion or not. While this is true, my opponent made a major contradictory argument. Going back to my opponent's first source, it states that the maternal morality rate in the United States is 13 deaths per 100,000 births(http://www.msnbc.msn.com...). As a doctor can give expert advice it's very possible that some of these deaths could have been prevented if the mother took the doctor's advice and aborted if the pregnancy was a threat to her life. This doctor, as mentioned earlier, could very well be a virgin.

As for my opponent's second argument, he addresses the argument that we can't know if the developing child will be somebody's best friend as "we're not fortune tellers". This is correct. However, we can easily determine if that child is somebody's sibling, cousin, etc. Anybody is upset when they have a sibling or a cousin die and that developing child could easily be either to a virgin thus triggering an emotional response.

As this is the last round, I'll now like to thank my opponent for an interesting debate and I look forward to seeing the results. Please vote fairly and good luck to both of us!
TheWheel

Pro

TheWheel forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
12 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by shakiisueteen 7 years ago
shakiisueteen
Wouldn't that kind of comment get on every body's nerves?... :l
Posted by InsertNameHere 7 years ago
InsertNameHere
Yea, exactly. That's why this comment really got on my nerves thus inspired this debate.
Posted by CrysisPillar 7 years ago
CrysisPillar
How can you not be allowed to have an opnion? You can't really stop someone from having an opinion or taking a side on a controversial topic.
Posted by Puck 7 years ago
Puck
I shouldn't have an opinion of marriage till I am married too?
Posted by Kinesis 7 years ago
Kinesis
So, you think it isn't a dumb proposal to limit freedom of speech for people who don't know what they're talking about? We'd have to lock up 99.999 (rec) of America...
Posted by brian_eggleston 7 years ago
brian_eggleston
No, all I'm saying is that there are individuals - lots of them - who think people who do not have direct experience of something shouldn't be allowed to voice their opinions.

I don't think the debate premise is dumb in other words.
Posted by Zetsubou 7 years ago
Zetsubou
Experience does not equivalate to knowledge Brian.

Why "Not so dumb", are you Pro or just saving the argument?
Posted by brian_eggleston 7 years ago
brian_eggleston
Not so dumb.

Have you ever had a discussion about childcare issues and one of the group has turned round and said: "Do you have children yourself? No? Well you don't know what you're talking about then."
Posted by Zetsubou 7 years ago
Zetsubou
lol
Posted by Kinesis 7 years ago
Kinesis
Aww, I would have taken this and argued for a worldwide thought-control dictatorship.
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Atheism
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