The Instigator
rugbypro5
Pro (for)
Winning
7 Points
The Contender
the_untold
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points

Abortion Is Wrong

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
rugbypro5
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/4/2014 Category: Society
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 590 times Debate No: 64598
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (6)
Votes (2)

 

rugbypro5

Pro

I am taking the stance that abortion is wrong in all cases, except for when the mother's life is in danger. Feel free to make your first argument in the first round. Good luck, and let's have a good debate.
the_untold

Con

I accept this debate.All the best to my competitor.Lets have fun.

First of all I am going to concede that we don't know whether the unborn is alive or not.What I am going to argue is that even if the unborn is a person it is legitimate to remove the life of the person in order to stain a life of the women.
I am going to argue on two main points.
1. The physical pain due to pregnancy.
2. The emotional pain due to pregnancy.

1 Physical Pain.
Women have to face large amount of pain during the pregnancy .
a)Morning sickness (Nausea) occurs in about seventy percent of all pregnant women, and typically improves after the first trimester. Although described as "morning sickness", women can experience this nausea during afternoon, evening, and throughout the entire day.
b)the other discomforts being-
2 Back pain
3 Pelvic girdle pain
4 Carpal tunnel syndrome
5 Leg cramps
6 Constipation
7 Contractions
8 Dehydration
9 Edema
10 Regurgitation and heartburn
11 Varicose veins
12 Hemorrhoids
13 Pica
14 Round Ligament or Lower abdominal pain
15 Increased urinary frequency
16 Diastasis recti or abdominal separation
17 Striae gravidarum
I am not going in depth with each one of them you can read it by the following link
http://en.wikipedia.org...

I believe that when a women does mot wants to go in this pain she has every right not to .I believe that the women is in the best condition to decide whether she wants to go though this pain or not .
2 . Emotional pain
During pregnancy their are Hormonal changes in the women .This leads her to make choices which she wouldn't have other wise.She has to change her lifestyle in order to take care of the baby.She has to stop drinking even though she may not want to.She is forced to take care of the a child even if she doesn't want to. I don't think it is justified to do so .She has to put the child before her career.
Debate Round No. 1
rugbypro5

Pro

Thank you Pro for accepting, and I look forward to the debate.

I want to begin by proving the livelihood of the unborn (meaning they're alive) and their humanity. According to the Oxford Dictionary, life is defined as: The condition that distinguishes animals and plants from inorganic matter, including the capacity for growth, reproduction, functional activity, and continual change preceding death.

The unborn very clearly lie within that definition, they have the capacity for growth, reproduction and functional activity. And then they also are continually changing preceding their death, which hopefully, isn't while they're still inside the womb. So the unborn are alive.

Second, the unborn are human. Science has shown us this time and time again. In all the leading embryology textbooks, the authors admit that from the moment of conception, a zygote (which what is formed when a sperm and egg meet) is a distinct, living and whole human being. So the unborn are human as well as alive.

With this in mind, does it make sense to kill a human being, so that another human being doesn't go through pain? Certainly not. The unborn are alive and human, just as the mother is human. These two should have equal value in society's eyes. However, this is where your argument fails. Look at this like an equation. You have two variables, a mother and a child (the child being in the womb). You can add pain to the mother, and life to the child, or you can have the mother, and take the child out of the equation (abortion). You then are left with mother. Now we said the child and the mother are both worth the same, because they're both alive and human, correct? In that case, you can likewise have mother and child again, and either add pain to mother, and life to the child, or take the mother out of the equation (kill the mother) and you are just left with the child. One equation you are left with the mother; the other equation you are left with the child. But because the mother and child are both equally valuable, then both of those equations should be equally viable. However, we don't condone the killing of the mother so she doesn't have pain, because it's not right to kill for it. And that's what happens with abortion, you kill.

So no, it doesn't make sense to kill the child to gain comfort for the mother.
the_untold

Con

OK lets get started .Sorry for the delay.
My first argument was to prove that pregnancy if painful,potentially torturous for a women who doesn't want the child.My question is what right do you have to put that women in torture in order to save a life of a person who she does doesn't even care about .Doesn't the women have the right to decide whether she wants to go through this pain or no t.I believe a women should have control over her own body.

Imagine that you wake in the morning, you find yourself connected to a person .the person makes you sick ,the person makes you go through pain .But if you separate form him he will die .i don't think this is a sufficient reason to stay attached to that the person . It's definitely not a sufficient enough reason to force someone else to stay attached to that person.

EQUALITY
Suppose a women wants to put her career before having the child .She has to take maternity leave .She will get paid paid but wont develop wont get a promotion in that period .While her male counter part might get the promotion .
A teen getting pregnant can't put all her efforts into studies while the guy who got her pregnant can study.If she wants to study and be better than the rest she has the right to do so .Further if she thinks she is not ready to go through that pain she has every right not to .
Debate Round No. 2
rugbypro5

Pro

Before I get started, I want to make something clear: The unborn fetus is no different than you and me. They are alive and human, as I showed, and deserve every bit of respect and care that a 2 year old would get.

Now, with that in mind we can look at what you said with a clear mind. You said, "... what right do you have to put that women in torture in order to save a life of a person who she does doesn't even care about[?]" Well, if the fetus is the same as any other person, can we say that a woman has the right to kill anyone she doesn't care about, just because she'll be in pain? So no, the woman doesn't have the right to kill someone because she doesn't want to go through pain. Then you say, "I believe a women should have control over her own body." I agree. A woman should be able to choose her school, her husband, her education, where she works, where she doesn't work, what she says; she should be able to control her own body. But we've made it clear that the fetus inside of her is not her own body! No woman has 20 fingers and 20 toes, two hearts, 4 lungs, and 4 eyes. So what you really meant to say, I believe, is that she should be able to control the person who is inside of her. But she can't. We have laws against murder, just that our legislative system hasn't realized that this is.

To your story about having someone connected to me, you also need to keep in mind, that this person will only be connected to me for 9 months. For the first three, he's realatively unnoticable, for the next 6 he causes me to vomit in the morning and feel very sick all day. Then at the end he causes me an almost insurmountable amount of pain, then, he is brought into this world to get to enjoy life. In that very real story, I still wouldn't seperate myself from him, especially seeing the ways of 'separation'. In an abortion procedure, the fetus is torn apart by forceps. Then the skull is crushed so that it can slide out of the birth canal easier. That's one way, or another, where a chemical is injected through the stomach into the placenta and it burns the fetus for 1-2 hours until the baby dissolves. It's not so nice as the word 'abortion' makes it appear.

Lastly, a woman isn't allowed to kill somebody to further her education, get a promotion, study, or not go through pain. So she doesn't have the right stay away from pain if it costs someone else their life.
the_untold

Con

So what the pro has come and told me is that we all should donate all the money we have stored to cure other people who we have no relation to against our own will cause it saves a life.
"Before I get started, I want to make something clear: The unborn fetus is no different than you and me. They are alive and human, as I showed, and deserve every bit of respect and care that a 2 year old would get."
So does the women .Forcing her to change her priorities ,diminish her ambition is is not right.
She must have the option to decide.

"Now, with that in mind we can look at what you said with a clear mind. You said, "... what right do you have to put that women in torture in order to save a life of a person who she does doesn't even care about[?]" Well, if the fetus is the same as any other person, can we say that a woman has the right to kill anyone she doesn't care about, just because she'll be in pain? So no, the woman doesn't have the right to kill someone because she doesn't want to go through pain"

There is a difference between this killing and the other killings .The can't not leave without the support of the mother but the mother can certainly live without the child .I am not obliged to donate my money so that a person can live on a life-support. nor is the mother.
I will give you another example ,
suppose a terrorist organisation kidnaps a person .You don't know him ,but you still feel sad for him,you want him to survive . But than the terrorist organisation announces that they will free the person if you(out of nowhere) cut of your arms or give up your career if not that they will kill the person after torturing him for nights and days . Now you will not do that even if it saves the persons life(I don't know about you but most of us wont) . Now the government forces you to cut of your arms without even giving you a choice .I am saying that this choice is what matters most . Taking that away is not right.
, "I believe a women should have control over her own body." I agree. A woman should be able to choose her school, her husband, her education, where she works, where she doesn't work, what she says; she should be able to control her own body. But we've made it clear that the fetus inside of her is not her own body! No woman has 20 fingers and 20 toes, two hearts, 4 lungs, and 4 eyes."
You are right but the child is inside of her and she doesn't want it .
A stranger enter your house .You tell him to get out .but he says you have no control over him you only have control over your house .But don't you think you still have a right of who lives in your house and how it is used.

I will lastly put a point about the your statement about rape victims in the comments .It is not always that a victim move on with the life in a short period of time .Many a time the mere taught of the child (who is also the son of the person who raped her ) reminds her of the rape .This forbids her from moving on and trying to live a normal life .

WITH THIS I REST MY CASE.
Debate Round No. 3
6 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Posted by rugbypro5 2 years ago
rugbypro5
Yea, if you hurry up and post!!
Posted by the_untold 2 years ago
the_untold
do I get to post rebuttals in the 3rd round?
Posted by rugbypro5 2 years ago
rugbypro5
I have a very close friend of mine, her name is Jennifer; she was conceived in rape. I find it terrible to think about her mom deciding to have an abortion, and me never have getting to meet Jen. I think if we informed women on what abortion does, and how when they decide not to have one they save a life, they would find a deal of comfort, even those who were impregnated through rape, no matter how young. Now I know that many times, young women, say 14 or 15 years old, have much higher risks when giving birth, and I want to be clear: When the child threatens the mother's life, precautions should be taken to protect the mother first. That's only based on the logical side of things, that the mother has a higher chance of survival than does the fetus.
Posted by Erraven 2 years ago
Erraven
Even if the now mother-to-be is a very young child. I personallyhope to never face this personally and am against abortion in most cases (just so one might understand where my thoughts come from.) but I struggle to accept it should always be a no for every woman in a case like this. If you have a sister or close family/friend who is young say 14 or even younger it can happen would you want this fate for them? To even with help and support have to go threw this process after rape?
Not trying to offend anyone just stimulate new thoughts about the subject.
Posted by rugbypro5 2 years ago
rugbypro5
Erraven, rape is a difficult case to talk about, but I still don't think it's sufficient justification to kill the child. Let's be clear, the rapist should be punished to the full extent of the law, but the child should not be punished. The mother, I believe, should get support from therapists and her local church, and anyone else, but to add murder to the crime already committed isn't good sense.
Posted by Erraven 2 years ago
Erraven
I saw you state abortion is only right when the mothers life is in dangour but I want to know what you think when the woman was raped?
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by sengejuri 2 years ago
sengejuri
rugbypro5the_untoldTied
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Total points awarded:40 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro argued that a fetus is fully human and equal to an an adult human, and therefore killing it is wrong. Con did not effectively counter this argument. In fact, Con left open the possibility that even if a fetus is fully human, it doesnt deserve to live if the mother doesn't want it. However, con did not make a convincing argument as to why that should be ok. Con did not defeat Pro's main argument in my opinion, therefore Pro wins.
Vote Placed by dsjpk5 2 years ago
dsjpk5
rugbypro5the_untoldTied
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Total points awarded:30 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro did a good job of showing that it's worse to kill an innocent human life than for a mother to not have morning sickness. Con also admitted that abortion is a "killing".