The Instigator
Elliot2204
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
Philocat
Pro (for)
Winning
20 Points

Abortion is always wrong

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 3 votes the winner is...
Philocat
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/18/2015 Category: Religion
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 635 times Debate No: 70254
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (0)
Votes (3)

 

Elliot2204

Con

The claim by religious groups that "Abortion is always" is a too dangerously simple phrase to use, as every abortion situation is different and the fact that the Catholic church recognises the tragic situation women are in that want to have a abortion, does not show compassion and understanding, but instead shows quite the opposite. Knowing someone's suffering but not helping them is not a moral thing to do in my eyes. In fact in any religious persons' eyes it should be seen as failure to act morally, as all religions have the idea of the sanctity of life in some sort of from; human life is sacred and belongs to God. Surely, in concern to Catholics, the teaching of "love thou neighbour as you love yourself" is more than enough reason to allow abortion in situations which are justifiable and a "lesser of two evils" ; mother is a rape victim as an example. However this does not mean I am a Methodist because I don't see abortion as always evil because in my opinion life doesn't begin at conception but rather at the point the foetus gains consciousness because that is when we start to develop as a person. Furthermore the idea of a potential person being equal to a living wrong is fundamentally flawed; how can a acorn be the same worth as a oak tree (Peter Singer). So I urge any religious fanatic to reconsider the topic logically and put themselves in that situation instead of referring to a book written thousands of years ago when abortion procedure didn't exist, or even referring to a religious official, as they have no more authority on this as you do as a individual.
Philocat

Pro

I argue that abortion is always wrong, based on the fact that abortion is homicide and that homicide is wrong.




My argument is as follows:

1. Abortion is the direct killing of a human foetus by another
2. A human foetus is a human being
3. Homicide it the direct killing of a human being by another
Therefore, abortion is homicide.

4. Homicide is wrong
Therefore, abortion is wrong.

This argument is logically valid, insofar as the premises are correct.


  • 1 is self-evident.


  • 2 is justified because a human foetus is alive, an individual organism and human.

    Life is defined as the property of a being that produces negative entropy from consumption of free energy (1). In simpler terms, a being is alive if its internal entropy (disorder) is being decreased by consuming free energy (by respiration that leads to growth). Growth is the process in which we move from a disordered state to a more ordered state, so growth is evidence of life seeking to decrease its internal entropy).
    A foetus decreases its internal entropy as it grows and becomes less disordered, therefore it is alive.
    All living organisms are categorised into species according to likeness of DNA. For example, a cat is a cat insofar as it has cat DNA. A human foetus has human DNA, so it is therefore human.
    Finally, a human foetus is an individual organism because it has a distinct body that shares the form of ordinary human individuals. It has its own set of organs and its own body. In other words, it is not part of the body of another human being.

    Using these three facts, we can conclude that a foetus is indeed a human being.


  • 3 is supported by the dictionary (3)


  • 4 is self-evident (apart from cases of proportional self-defence). Utilitarianism, deontology, rights-theories and most other ethical theories agree that homicide is wrong.


  • Therefore, the proposition that abortion is wrong is proven.






My opponent states that we should allow abortion where it is 'the lesser of two evils'. Yet he gives no reason as to why this is ever the case. Abortion is not necessary, nor is it the lesser of the two evils in situations of pregnancy (obviously we could construe scenarios where abortion is the lesser of the two evils, but we only need to look at cases that could ordinarily arise in the real world).
He cites the cases of the mother being a rape victim as an example of abortion being the lesser of the two evils, although he does not actually say why this is the case. Abortion does not 'fix' the rape at all, it is simply a misguided form of retribution. It is punishing the rapist's child for the crime of the rapist - now that is an evil thing to do.

'in my opinion life doesn't begin at conception but rather at the point the foetus gains consciousness because that is when we start to develop as a person'

In many other opinions, life does begin at conception. Why should your opinion have any more weight than others'? Also, why should consciousness be the determining factor of life? If it was, then it would mean that unconscious people or comatose patients are not alive, which is absurd. Furthermore, abortion is proven to be wrong based on the premise that a foetus is a human being - we do not need to discuss personhood.

'Furthermore the idea of a potential person being equal to a living wrong is fundamentally flawed'

Of course a foetus is not equal to a living person, but that does not mean that a foetus does not have value as a human being. Both are valuable, just because a foetus is less valuable than a human foetus does not justify killing it.

'So I urge any religious fanatic to reconsider the topic logically and put themselves in that situation instead of referring to a book written thousands of years ago when abortion procedure didn't exist, or even referring to a religious official, as they have no more authority on this as you do as a individual.'

My opponent has the misguided view that abortion can only be opposed on religious grounds. However, I have argued using entirely secular concepts to prove that abortion is wrong. To dismiss pro-life people as religious fanatics is both factually incorrect as well as naively ignorant.




(1) https://letstalkaboutscience.wordpress.com...
(2) http://dictionary.reference.com...
Debate Round No. 1
Elliot2204

Con

Elliot2204 forfeited this round.
Philocat

Pro

Yet another pro-abortionist who appears unable to defend their position...

I extend all arguments.
Debate Round No. 2
Elliot2204

Con

Elliot2204 forfeited this round.
Philocat

Pro

Right, the debate has ended.
Debate Round No. 3
No comments have been posted on this debate.
3 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Vote Placed by Zarroette 2 years ago
Zarroette
Elliot2204PhilocatTied
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Total points awarded:06 
Reasons for voting decision: ff
Vote Placed by 1Credo 2 years ago
1Credo
Elliot2204PhilocatTied
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Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: Ff
Vote Placed by TheJuniorVarsityNovice 2 years ago
TheJuniorVarsityNovice
Elliot2204PhilocatTied
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Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: ff