The Instigator
Brandumful
Pro (for)
Winning
5 Points
The Contender
Viridiel
Con (against)
Losing
3 Points

Abortion is legalized murder

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
Brandumful
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/2/2015 Category: Society
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 820 times Debate No: 70926
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (8)
Votes (2)

 

Brandumful

Pro

Abortion is nothing more, than the disgusting legalization of murder. You are taking the life of an innocent baby for nothing more than your own selfishness, because you don't want to deal with the responsibility of a child, yet still continue to have sex without the use of contraceptives. I am 100% okay with the use of birth control, in any form, but abortion is an entirely different thing because you are committing murder against someone who can't help or defend itself. Its no different than killing a living human!
Viridiel

Con

Alright, I will accept your debate.
Before I start with a few questions I must say that I'm 50/50 on this topic.
I don't agree with the fact that there are people who literally abort because it was an accident / because they feel like it etc.
But, there are some reasonable reasons why some people kill their baby.

As first:
- What if the mother hears that her baby is born without no limbs, or what if the mother hears that her baby is born with a disease that will kill the child on her fourth year or what if the mother sees that her child will have Incurable and an immense pain that will last for the rest of her life?
How can you even let a human being go through all this? Isn't it better to end the baby life before he/she will feel the pain that will come with her life?

And as last:
- What if the mother is seventeen, has no support of their parents and has no money to take care of her child. Or what if the mother is an addict to alot of bad things such as smoking, drugs etc. ?

Goodluck with the debate. :)
Debate Round No. 1
Brandumful

Pro

Hello Viridiel! :)
I understand where you are coming from, and you make some reasonable arguments for the opposition, though I still don't feel that any of them could make killing a baby, okay.

If the child is going to be born with a terrible physical disability, you shouldn't kill it just cause you don't think its even worth getting to live. Take Stephan Hawking for example, a man who has a horrible physical disability and cannot use any of his extremities and is permanently confound to a wheel chair, yet he is now the greatest mind on the planet, making discoveries that sent us in a huge leap to the future.
And if the baby will be born with an illness that may kill it, its better that we let the baby live, so we could discover what may have caused it, so that we could prevent this illness in the future, rather than just seeing that a baby has a strange illness so we better kill it.

Finally, if a mother is to young or not well off enough to take care of a child, adoption is always an option, as two of my closest friends were, in fact, adopted. There were the baby in that scenario, where the mother could not take care of the baby so she gave it for adoption, I wouldn't know what I would do with out them, and to think that they could have just been killed off for no better reason other than, they don't want to take care of a baby.

Goodluck to you as well my friend :)
Viridiel

Con

Ah thank you for answering my questions, but it seems still cruel to me that you would let a child live while he knows he or she is going to die in a year or two. But if a child has no limbs, is blind and deaf all at the same time, what is life for him/her then? He/she just sits there and wait for his life to end.

Your second argument: Adoption isn't that easy my friend. It takes years (Or you must be really lucky) to find parents who want to adopt a child. They would be living in a Orphanage, and the stories I've heard from there: It isn't really as fun as you might think. And ofcourse there are actually families who force the child to keep her baby instead of giving it up for adoption.

But after all, like I said earlier: "What if the mother sees that her child will have Incurable and an immense pain that will last for the rest of her life?"

At last: Abortion has his good things aswell.
Embryonic stem cell research uses a human embryo, and is thought to be able to cure up to 70 major diseases and has actually been proved to cure cancer. If for every baby aborted we cured a dying cancer patient, there would actually be a bit of an equilibrium; no lives added, no lives taken away.

Instead of having a child live for 4 years and then die just to have a really slight chance of finding a cure for the disease that he/she might have, you'll have a great chance of curing a human being who still has a long life to live. They have families, and people love him/her.

I think this is personally better, that a human who has a family that loves him has a great chance of surviving a disease in cost of a child that has only four years to live. Because the mother put four+ years in him/her. She has feelings for her child that no-one can describe. And she'll be heartbroken after she hears the disease has killed her child.
Debate Round No. 2
Brandumful

Pro

While steam cell research has been linked to many illness cures, whether or not it cures cancer is an entirely different debate.
As for addressing someone who is sick and killing a baby could save him, what makes that's persons life more valuable than the baby's life?

-How is murdering an innocent baby in anyway less cruel then letting it live with a deformity? How can we just say, "Oh, well there's another baby with that illness, lets kill it" rather than letting it live and discovering what cause such an illness and curing that problem for the rest of the world? So now if someone is about to give birth and they see that the baby has that illness, they wont just kill it and live with the shame of murder for the rest of their lives, but rather they would get a cure and go on living their lives as a happy, not dead, person.

-Adoption may not be easy most of the time, but I refuse to believe that a sane person would say, "Oh, this is too hard, I should just kill a baby instead, cause that's way easier." Being a teacher isn't easy either, but you don't see teachers getting frustrated and just killing off students cause they don't want to deal with them.

-Abortion can actually be dangerous. According to multiple research studies, the risk of breast cancer, in women who had abortions rises 50%, as well as, miscarriages in later pregnancies, loss of fertility, and in some cases (though rare) can actually kill the mother who is getting the abortion.

Thank you for participating in my debate. I wish the best of luck unto you :)
Viridiel

Con

-How is murdering an innocent baby in anyway less cruel then letting it live with a deformity?
: Lies on what deformity. If that deformity happends to be no limbs, the child will have a depression most of his life because they think they're an abomination. They may look happy, but most of them hide their sorrow behind a smile. A lot of people do that lately.

-Adoption may not be easy most of the time, but I refuse to believe that a sane person would say, "Oh, this is too hard, I should just kill a baby instead, cause that's way easier."
: A teacher has a life of its own. If no-one wants to adopt the child, he would live in an orphanage for the rest of his life having the sad thoughts that nobody wants him and that his parents just left him off there because they didn't want him/her. As I said, they may look happy, but most of them hide their sorrow behind a smile.

- Abortion can actually be dangerous.
: Anti-abortion literature is full of stories about women gravely injured or even killed in clinics. Such places exist: A woman died in Kermit Gosnell"s Philadelphia clinic, some were injured, and all received inferior care. Steven Brigham has been in legal trouble in several states. Such doctors stay in business because they are cheap, they are in the neighborhood, they perform abortions later than the law allows, and they zero in on low-income patients who, sadly, are used to being treated badly by people in authority. No doubt there are other inferior clinics out there. But only in abortion care do the few bad providers taint all the others"and taint them so much that opponents can pass laws that would virtually shut down the entire field in the name of patient safety.

And yet, abortion is remarkably safe. The CDC reports that from 2003 to 2009, the most recent period for which it has figures, the national mortality rate was .67 deaths per 100,000 abortions. In 2009, a total of eight women died due to abortion. Tragic as that is, compare it with fatal reactions to penicillin, which occur in 1 case per 50"100,000 courses. And what about Viagra? According to the Association of Reproductive Health Professionals, it has a death rate of 5 per 100,000 prescriptions. But you don"t find legislators calling for a ban on Viagra.

Really, though, there is only one directly relevant comparison of risk with respect to abortion, and that is pregnancy and childbirth. The death rate for that is 8.8 women per 100,000. Continuing a pregnancy is 12 to 14 times as potentially fatal as ending it. (And maternal mortality rate is rising in the US even as it is falling around the world.) Curiously, no one suggests that obstetricians be compelled to read pregnant women scripts about the dangers that lie ahead before sending them home for 24 hours to think about whether they wish to proceed.

I wish you a great luck aswell, and I really liked this debate.
Have fun! :)

Sources: http://time.com...
Debate Round No. 3
8 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 8 records.
Posted by Philocat 2 years ago
Philocat
@Rational_Thinker9119, that's just playing semantics. The fact remains that people use the 'word' murder to mean the intentional killing of another human being.
Posted by 4God 2 years ago
4God
Abortion is murder. Everyone that I've heard that has aborted their baby has done it for selfish reasons. Not because they learned their child has an illness or deformity. The baby has as much right to live as the mother does. At least you would be giving them a chance at life, instead of just killing them. Everyone can make excuses and justify wrong, but it doesn't make it right.
Posted by Rational_Thinker9119 2 years ago
Rational_Thinker9119
The resolution is false as it entails a contradiction. Murder by definition is an unlawful killing, ergo, it is an illegal killing. So in order for abortion to be legalized murder, then abortion would have to be legalized illegal killing. Since that is a contradiction, the resolution is false.
Posted by Dilara 2 years ago
Dilara
Rumbero. Killing a sperm or egg isn't murderer. A fetus is a different thing.
Posted by Dilara 2 years ago
Dilara
And for the health and life of the mom and if she can't afford a baby.
Posted by Do_I_Need_A_Username 2 years ago
Do_I_Need_A_Username
Abortions remove a living unborn child from the womb. The child has no say in it. If women want to have sex, they must face the responsibility of being a parent. However, if it was rape, and the women doesn't want the child, they should have to go through a rape test to prove that they were raped. Abortions should only be legalized with that acceptation. Other than that, no abortions.
Posted by Philocat 2 years ago
Philocat
Since when was a sperm equal to a foetus?
Posted by Rumbero 2 years ago
Rumbero
Really..Abortion is Murder..So evertime you jerk off is it mass murder..Abortion is a medical procedure
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by Chuz-Life 2 years ago
Chuz-Life
BrandumfulViridielTied
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Total points awarded:50 
Reasons for voting decision: The resolution is that "abortion is legalized murder" and Con's strongest counter was not much more than to say "it should be okay if the child is severely deformed" (paraphrased) . The debate then shifted to a discussion on how safe abortions are. . . and that doesn't have anything to do with whether or not an abortion is a legalized murder. Pro did a better job of staying on topic and maintaining that abortion is murder. Con never directly refuted the charge.
Vote Placed by Dilara 2 years ago
Dilara
BrandumfulViridielTied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: I am pro life. Con and pro had good arguments.