The Instigator
mikebgood
Pro (for)
Losing
7 Points
The Contender
Alex
Con (against)
Winning
60 Points

Abortion is wrong and therefore should be illegal under all circumstances

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 12 votes the winner is...
Alex
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/26/2009 Category: Society
Updated: 8 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 3,011 times Debate No: 7569
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (7)
Votes (12)

 

mikebgood

Pro

I'm going to start it off simple since that's the way all arguments should be approached (at least initially).

A) If abortion is murder then it is wrong and should therefore be illegal.
B) Abortion is murder.
C) Therefore Abortion is wrong, and so it should be illegal.
Alex

Con

I thank my opponent for starting this debate.

As i see it, my task is simple, all i must do it prove why abortions should not be illegal under ALL circumstances.

My opponent makes the argument that abortion is murder, well...Well i don't necessarily disagree, however what about ectopic pregnancies? Pregnancies that are often fatal to the woman, should we sentence those woman to death because of an abnormal pregnancy? Please tell me how that is justified.

I await the start of the next round.
Debate Round No. 1
mikebgood

Pro

You made a good point with ectopic pregnancies. I will only concede that in the case of an ectopic pregnancy the patient has the right to get the embryo removed only because an ectopic pregnancy will lead to certain death for both parties. Even still, it is a lesser evil, not entirely justified. Abortion for any other reason should be illegal.
Alex

Con

Thank you for making it that simple by conceding.

I just ask that my viewers and voters vote based on the arguments, and since he conceded i urge a Con vote.
Debate Round No. 2
mikebgood

Pro

I do not concede that abortion should be illegal. Abortion SHOULD be illegal under all circumstances because it is murder. In the case of an ectopic pregnancy the potential for life is removed so therefore you are not altering that young human's fate. However, the medical field should be actively seeking a solution to ectopic pregnancies that will allow both the mother and child to live. The only reason intervention should be permitted now is if/because we don't have the means to save the child's life.
Alex

Con

"I do not concede that abortion should be ilegal"?

Clarify that please.

So ectopic pregnancies does not fall under circumstances? If that is your argument please provide some evidence as of why it is not a circumstance.

If he cannot do so the resolution is successfully negated.
Debate Round No. 3
mikebgood

Pro

The point I'm making is that any effort that is made to kill an embryo/fetus, or neglecting to act when it is possible to save the life, is evil. Therefore it should be illegal. Society as a whole should be making strides to prevent the death of the unborn. The fact that with current technology and knowledge we cannot save the child, would alter the circumstances and thus make it not murder. When we are able to save the life and don't; that would be murder. Does this clarify?
Alex

Con

Let me clarify, I am against abortion, read my previous debate on the topic.

I believe your typical abortion is evil just the same. I also believe that your typical abortion should be illegal as well. BUT, to say that it should be illegal no matter the circumstance is simply evil in itself.

The fact is, is that there is not technology to save every ectopic pregnancy, therefore the female should have the option to abort it.

To deny a woman an abortion, that is sentenced to death if otherwise is simply horrible and it is wrong.

Also, how about making the exception for underage rape cases? Only, however if it has been proven in court and was ruled rape.

Small underage woman should not be forced into unspeakable hardships, and possibly life threatening processes, because she got raped.

Do you think that is okay? Picture this, your daughter, or maybe an old friend gets brutally raped and ends up pregnant. Not only has she gone through an extremely traumatizing experience, but now she must undergo 9 months of pregnancy, which is an unbelievable hardship and on top of it, it is possible that she will not make it.

My opponent is placing the lives of small bits of cells above living breathing woman. That is wrong, and it contradicts my opponents purpose of making it illegal.
Debate Round No. 4
mikebgood

Pro

To further clarify; the removal of an embryo in the occurrence of an ectopic pregnancy is a lesser evil and should therefore only be carried out until such point that modern medicine can find an alternative that will save the child.

In address to your question about underage rape cases:
I'm not sure which element you're attributing the power to allow for an abortion.
Is it necessary that the woman be underage? Is it sufficient?
Is it necessary that the woman be raped? Is it sufficient?
Also, what would you consider underage? Under 18, or simply under the biological age that allows her to bear children?

If, for example, a 16 year old was raped and became pregnant I'm assuming you would justify her action of getting an abortion.
But look at it this way; if she was 18 and consented to the sex would it be wrong for her to get the abortion?
You would say yes, but I would ask why.
Why does the fact that one has been wronged allow them to commit a wrong to another? It doesn't.
Also, the fact that different judges and juries will rule in different ways means that the decision to allow the child to live, in your example of underage rape, would be completely arbitrary. Life has intrinsic value that should respected regardless of what any judge or jury might conclude.

In a side note; you don't seem to have a strong conviction about preserving human life when you can reduce it to just "small bits of cells" when an abortion is more convenient than the alternative. A true belief in a principle means that one believes it even when it is difficult, painful, or costly.
Alex

Con

The fact is that my belief of abortions are irrelevant.

Either way, rape cases or not, you still conceded that ectopic pregnancies should have the option of abortion. Thus negating the resolution.

Thank you for the debate.
Debate Round No. 5
7 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 7 records.
Posted by mikebgood 8 years ago
mikebgood
snelld,
I actually agree with you completely in principle. When you take an innocent child's life it is always wrong. The only reason I made the exception for an ectopic pregnancy is because the child already faces a certain death. (Correct me if I'm wrong on my medical knowledge.) So I compromised because I feel that the greatest amount of life should be preserved. However, if at all possible the child should be saved- this should be the focus of much research and progress.
Posted by snelld7 8 years ago
snelld7
lol you should just have said YES UNDER ALL SITUATIONS. It isn't condemning the mother to death AT ALL (ectopic pregnancy) . You didn't rape her nor did you force her to have sex. Think of it this way, would you have said people 100 years ago condemned the girls to death that had these kind of pregnancies? Of course not, which means simply by not allowing her to kill her baby you are in no way responsible if she dies. It's a risk associated with pregnancy. Even rape, it isn't the baby's fault his father forced himself upon his mother, so don't punish him for it.

"I've noticed that everybody that is for abortion has already been born."~Ronald Reagan
Posted by sorc 8 years ago
sorc
"Maikuru,
I realize I could have worded my initial claim better but what I'm getting at is that since the termination of an ectopic pregnancy currently would not negatively alter the fate of either party it is not murder. Therefore, under the current circumstances, terminating one would not be wrong and should not be illegal."

This is unfortunately irrelevant due to your absolute wording of the resolution.
Posted by mikebgood 8 years ago
mikebgood
NukeTheJuice,
The point is that abortion is stepping on the rights of another, the most basic right of all: the right to live.

Maikuru,
I realize I could have worded my initial claim better but what I'm getting at is that since the termination of an ectopic pregnancy currently would not negatively alter the fate of either party it is not murder. Therefore, under the current circumstances, terminating one would not be wrong and should not be illegal.
Also, under the Hippocratic oath to do no harm, the doctors should be devoted to preserving the most basic human rights possible.
Posted by InquireTruth 8 years ago
InquireTruth
"Plus its in the constitution, that we as Americans have the right to live our lives anyway we choose as long as were not stepping on the rights of others."

Where in the Constitution does it say that exactly?
Posted by Maikuru 8 years ago
Maikuru
Mikebgood, by agreeing that ectopic pregnancies can be terminated (even if it is "less evil" and only until science can better handle them), you have conceded the point that abortion should be "illegal under all circumstances."
Posted by NukeTheJuice 8 years ago
NukeTheJuice
America is based upon choices. I personally wouldn't have an abortion, but I'm not gonna run some other women's life and tell her she cant because of my beliefs. Plus its in the constitution, that we as Americans have the right to live our lives anyway we choose as long as were not stepping on the rights of others.
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