The Instigator
lnhsjayhawk
Pro (for)
Winning
13 Points
The Contender
KaioHutch
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points

Abortion is wrong

Do you like this debate?NoYes+1
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 3 votes the winner is...
lnhsjayhawk
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/27/2014 Category: Society
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 594 times Debate No: 47955
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (3)
Votes (3)

 

lnhsjayhawk

Pro

I believe that abortion is wrong. The first round is for acceptance, and the second round is where I will begin my case. I wish luck to whoever accepts this debate.
KaioHutch

Con

Hello, I'd like to hear what you have to say about abortion.
Debate Round No. 1
lnhsjayhawk

Pro

Abortion is wrong: To begin my case I will clarify the following definitions, which are all from the Merriam Webster Dictionary -
Abortion: A medical procedure used to end a pregnancy and cause the death of a fetus
Fetus: A human being or animal in the later stages of development before it is born
Death: The time when someone or something dies
Murder: The crime of deliberately killing a person

I will now begin my case. I will be exploring abortion in three main areas today. In my first area, I will give you reasons as to why abortion is wrong in that it is murder. In my second area, I will give why it is more important to give Fetus"s the choice to live rather than giving woman the choice to have an abortion. Finally, in my third area, I will give you statistics that support my case. Now let"s go to my first contention, where I will give you reasons why abortion is wrong in that it is murder.

As my definitions from the Merriam Webster Dictionary can prove, abortion actually is murder. The definition of abortion is a medical procedure used to end a pregnancy and cause the death of a fetus, obviously implying that it is a deliberate choice by the pregnant human. A fetus in a human form is something in the later stages of being born. The heart of a baby starts beating a mere 18 days after conception [1], and as a human gestation period is more than double that time, you are killing something by the time the fetus is formed. The definition of murder states that it is the crime of killing a person, which an abortion does, as I have already proved with little evidence, only definitions. Because we as an American population do not endorse murdering, and believe it is morally wrong, abortion is therefore morally wrong and should not be done.

This is where I will give you why it should be important that babies are given a chance to live, instead of woman being given the chance to choose. Let"s start off with the women. When women want to get an abortion, it is obviously because they are pregnant but do not want to have the baby, for various reasons. However, if a women didn"t want to have a baby, they should"ve simply not had sex in the first place. My opponent may argue that many women are raped, and have a right to abort because of this. However, only 1% of abortions are caused by rape [1]. Also, the women who have been raped could simply go through pregnancy and give their child up for adoption, among many other options. Now, let"s go to the children. My opponent may argue that this is a women"s rights issue we are talking about here, and that the whether the child wants to live or no doesn"t matter. However, this is something much bigger, as this is a human rights issue we are talking about here. Here"s a scary fact: Abortion is America"s LEADING CAUSE OF DEATH with more than double the deaths of Heart Disease. Clearly, this is a problem, as we are killing off a whole generation of innocent citizens who could"ve achieved so much more in life. Just imagine if MLK Jr. had been aborted, or any of our presidents, our other historical figures. Our world would be much different today without them.

In my third area, I will list some sources that will support my case.
[1]: http://www.wickedshepherds.com... (I urge you to go to this site, as it give you clock at the beginning that will shock you, and some of the stats may make you change your opinion on abortion)
[2]: http://www.lifesitenews.com...
[3]: https://eslbee.com...
[4]: http://www.jstor.org...

"I"ve noticed that everyone who is for abortion has already been born" - Ronald Reagan
KaioHutch

Con

To your first case on how the Merriam Webster Dictionary proves that abortion is murder, may I guide your attention to both Collins English Dictionary [1] as well as the Oxford Dictionary [2] as they both state nothing about murder and simply because one dictionary says it is murder does not prove your point as looking at only one type of dictionary and drawing a conclusion from it is absurd. And as to your first source, I'm not even going to comment on how unreliable that source is at anyone can come up with those statistics if they are automatically against abortion and until I see proof of these statistics through a more reliable source I can't take that into consideration as there is no proof that this is documented fact. As to it being murder I completely disagree as the act of murder is an unlawful killing as seen in the Oxford Dictionary [3] and even the Merriam Webster Dictionary's full definition of it [4], as this proves that abortion isn't murder as it is within the law until the fetus is 24 weeks old in the United Kingdom [5] and whatever time limits are in place for the US system.

First of all you've referenced the first source and I've already made my viewpoint of it clear so no need to clarify there. You use hypothetical questions like what if great figures were aborted, well let me flip this question around. What if Adolf Hitler was aborted, or Kaiser Wilhelm and so on. Our world would be a lot better if they weren't here similarly I think most people can agree. And to your statement about the child wanting to live doesn't matter, I feel this is inappropriate as a fetus is incapable of human emotions whilst developing inside someone's body and even if they do, the fact remains that we simply don't know what any of them are thinking so to make such a statement like that is trivial. A fetus is given a chance to live and that has been deemed by the time limit in which a person is allowed to get an abortion and saying they don't have a chance is just plain wrong as no one can get a day before abortion and other very late abortions. I think the fact that there are people who disregard the women who have been raped is pure idiocy as even if that percentage is at 1%, we shouldn't ignore the feelings of a human who was unwillingly forced to have a child and lets not forget that some pregnancies can end with a mothers death which I assume no one condones because in a sense the fetus killed the mother.

Here are some of the links to the definitions I've listed as sources.
[1] Collins English Dictionary, Abortion: http://www.collinsdictionary.com...
[2] Oxford English Dictionary, Abortion: http://www.oxforddictionaries.com...
[3] Oxford English Dictionary, Murder: http://www.oxforddictionaries.com...
[4] Merriam Webster Dictionary, Murder: http://www.merriam-webster.com...
[5] NHS Website, Abortion: http://www.nhs.uk...
Debate Round No. 2
lnhsjayhawk

Pro

First I will begin by asking my opponent to not bring up any new arguments in the final round, as this would be unfair to today's debate round, and only build up theirs and counter mine.

My opponent begins with giving some dictionaries that attempt to disprove my first contention. However, when we look at these dictionaries, we can see that one says it is the deliberate termination of a human pregnancy [1], while the other states that it is an operation or other procedure to terminate pregnancy before the fetus is viable[2]. Now unless my opponent can prove that terminating pregnancy doesn't kill the fetus, these definitions are saying the same thing as Merriam Webster's, which states that it is a medical procedure used to end a pregnancy and cause the death of a fetus [3]. My opponent attempted to say that these definitions prove that abortion is not murder, however they actually mean the same thing, as terminating pregnancy causes the death of a fetus. While the definitions in my opponent's dictionaries may state that abortion isn't murder, abortion is still killing, even if it is legal. Basically my opponent is attempting to state that killing is justified if it is not murder, because murder is illegal, as stated in both of the dictionaries they provided, while abortion is legal in some states. Of course, this does not include abortions that happen where it is illegal, where it would be murder.

I will briefly go over where my opponent stated that one of my sources was unreliable, which may be true, as people indeed can make up statistics. However, I will now provide sources that further back up the point of my case where Iv state abortion is the leading cause of death in the U.S. Please note that one of my sources is from 2005, however it is from the CDC, the Center for Disease control and Prevention. meaning it is reliable. To be honest, I am giving my opponent grace here as abortion numbers, while they were bad in 2005, were not as worse as now. It also only refers to black abortions, further lowering the numbers. To be clear the sources I will use to back up the fore mentioned part of my case are sources [4], [5], and [6].

I will admit it was a fault of mine to bring up the hypothetical question regarding historical figures, as it would only bring up arguments involving tons of good and bad historical figures. I think me and my opponent can agree that it would be best for the debate to just throw out that argument, as it would cause unnecessary debating. My opponent also brings up the argument that I have disregarded the emotions and feelings of a woman who has been raped in my first case. However, the only reason I brought up the 1% statistic is because I was arguing that it should not be a major part in today's debate. Of course I regard all peoples feelings, including those women who have been raped. I also believe that my opponent is being very contradictory here, as my opponent is completely disregarding the fetus, who hasn't really been given a chance at life. Finally, my opponent states that the fetus actually has been given a chance to live, which is technically true. However, unless my opponent can show me someone who would like to live in a womb for less than one year and then die, that point is invalid. For these reasons and many more I respectfully ask for a pro ballot in today's debate.

Sources:
[1] http://www.oxforddictionaries.com...
[2] http://www.collinsdictionary.com...
[3] http://www.merriam-webster.com...
[4]http://cnsnews.com...
[5]http://home.epix.net...
[6]http://www.freerepublic.com...
KaioHutch

Con

Okay I won't bring up any new argument topics, but I am definitely countering the stuff you just said. Of cause terminating a fetus is killing them and all I'm trying to point out that it is on legal grounds and isn't murder and the deaths of fetuses are justified. You're arguing that because illegal abortions take place, that all forms of abortion are wrong when this is specifically why we have legal methods in the first place. Years ago abortion had to be done through illegal methods only because laws in certain countries and even states like in the USA refuse access to legally abort. This brings the dilemma that yes what illegal abortions are doing is wrong but this is only due to the states not allowing abortion and if abortion was legal everywhere technically no one would have reason to get an illegal abortion.

Not trying to make a counter argument against the statistics and I'm going to take these statistics into account but generally I don't think we can justify abortion being wrong for the sheer numbers as there are still tons of babies being born every minute and while there are a lot of deaths, I could turn to other parts of the world where babies are born and die on the same day due to poor conditioning in their country. And I also think about this number like this, if they are aborting that many fetuses what are unwanted, then clearly we would have a problem if they were allowed to live as most of them would be put into adoption centers which probably couldn't handle the excessive amount if it keeps on rising and rising each year.

As to your third statement, I'm not disregarding the fetus because there isn't anything to disregard simply put. Like I stated earlier we don't know what a fetus could think even if we try and even yet how do we know the wishes of a developing fetus. They have no wishes because they aren't born into the world yet. Saying unless I can show proof of someone who wants to live in a womb for a month is asking a human themselves and of course they wouldn't want to logically but a fetus isn't born yet and probably isn't thinking anything inside the womb let alone that it wants to live.

My opponent has brought some interesting points but it still remains that I think abortion is within reason and should be legal everywhere so we don't have people committing illegal abortions and have this ethical problem that it is murder.
Debate Round No. 3
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by lnhsjayhawk 2 years ago
lnhsjayhawk
Sorry, but I failed to address your second comment of how I believe women should be punished for the abortion. I looked and I can't seem to find that in my case. Can you please point that out for me?
Posted by lnhsjayhawk 2 years ago
lnhsjayhawk
Hello, 2sense, as I state in my first case, only 1% of the woman who get abortions are raped, so the woman can usually prevent the baby by providing a condom for the male. I do believe that the male is absolutely believe that the male is indeed responsible in some cases of abortion. However, I was simply giving ways that the woman could deal with the baby besides having an abortion, and all I said is that the woman shouldn't have sex in the first place. Sorry for any misunderstandings.
Posted by 2Sense 2 years ago
2Sense
I'm curious, Pro, why you put the blame on the woman, but not the man who failed to wear a condom? Why do you believe women should be "punished" for engaging in intercourse?
3 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Vote Placed by TheLastMan 2 years ago
TheLastMan
lnhsjayhawkKaioHutchTied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:50 
Reasons for voting decision: Well, both sides need more improvements. First round was a waste. The instigator did not set any definitions and gudeline properly. 2nd round was leading to semantics. Pro was saying that the fetus is a human and aborting a fetus is akin to murder. He should have established that the fetus is a human being and it's alive. But, it does not matter because Con failed to attack it. Pro claimed Abortion is America's leading cause of death with more than double the deaths of Heart Disease. But, this was nothing but mere assertion. It lacked support because Pro didn't provide any sources. However, Con failed to counter it. Though, Pro didn't provide a reliable source in the 2nd round, he did in the last round. Con neither presented any good argument nor sources. Just some sources for dictionaries do not deserve points. Argument and source goes to Pro.
Vote Placed by Buckethead31594 2 years ago
Buckethead31594
lnhsjayhawkKaioHutchTied
Agreed with before the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Agreed with after the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:30 
Reasons for voting decision: Con was unable to effectively show me how abortion isn't wrong. It would seem that Con's arguments were best in the final round- after the debate came to a close.
Vote Placed by whiteflame 2 years ago
whiteflame
lnhsjayhawkKaioHutchTied
Agreed with before the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Agreed with after the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:50 
Reasons for voting decision: Despite my personal opinion, I don't find it difficult to side with Pro in this debate. Con simply isn't doing enough. So long as Pro is winning the argument that killing a fetus is killing a human being, he's winning that it's a huge harm. I think there are many reasonable starts to arguments from Con that could have persuaded me to think otherwise, but it's simply not enough, and much of it comes too late. I don't see anything on quality of life until the final round, I see little on how it affects the mother beyond some assertions, and nothing at all that impacts as well as death of a fetus. Hence the vote. Pro should probably be careful about using biased sources, but still provides the most solid support for his arguments, so he gets sources as well.