The Instigator
MewxVenus
Pro (for)
Winning
23 Points
The Contender
flynn09
Con (against)
Losing
20 Points

Abortion practiced on a baby with a beating heart should be illegal

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 7 votes the winner is...
MewxVenus
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/31/2009 Category: Health
Updated: 8 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,778 times Debate No: 6705
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (19)
Votes (7)

 

MewxVenus

Pro

I stand on the pro side of this argument. Abortion. Simply put...ew. Babies have a right to live. Before I say anything, I would like to point out that this resolution says "practiced on a baby with a beating heart". Babies are not considered alive and can't feel pain until they are 8 weeks old. Abortion before this point, I personally believe, is ok. Not necessarily right, but definitely ok.

Now, I know a common argument for this topic is "WHAT ABOUT THE RAPE BABIES?" Well, my friends, it is proven that less than one percent of abortions are used on these rape babies. Mostly, careless teenagers get abortions. The problem with youth today is that they have a severe lack of morality and, for the most part, an inability to accept responsibility for their own actions. By taking away the option of abortion, we force them to be responsible for what they have done. And yes, I acknowledge that flighty teenagers or drug addicted mothers are likely to abandon their child. But I ask you to acknowledge this: Abandonment is a better alternative to abortion. At least then the child has a chance to live.

I would also like to say my piece about stem cell research. For anyone who doesn't know, this is taking the cells that create a child when it is...oh about one to eight days along, and grafting it to...let's say an old woman's heart. Stem cells can become any kind of tissue. And since one to eight days meets the requirements of the eight week time bracket before the baby is truly alive, then this is also a better alternative to an abortion after eight weeks.

There is a tragedy taking place right here in America. In our back yard, so to speak. Partial birth abortion. There are two states where this act is STILL LEGAL. For the benefit of those reading, and, just in case, my opponent, I'll clarify. A partial birth abortion is when the baby is partially delivered and then killed. Think back to my argument where I stated abandonment is a better alternative to abortion. The child in this partial birth abortion would have a split second of life before eliminated. This is not ethical. It is not fair, and it is certainly not morally right. This also takes us back to my argument on the morality of America's youth. By allowing abortions, we are telling them morality is not a matter to be concerned with. These are not the kind of ideas we need encouraged.

Many people may be thinking, "What about high school girls? Having a baby will hurt their education!" Well, first of all, they are probably pregnant out of their own carelessness, unless of course they were raped. But a statistic I offered earlier says that less than one percent of abortions are conducted on rape victims. Next, I would like to offer up a personal example. I am a freshman in high school. Last year, a friend of mine got pregnant. She was in the eighth grade, just like me. Instead of taking the easy way out and getting an abortion, she held in there. 9 months later she had a beautiful baby boy. She stopped smoking, and matured a great deal. Oh, and it didn't hurt her education, because she's a freshman with me this year. The birth of her son forced her to mature and even had health benefits, seeing as she stopped smoking. While high school pregnancies are frowned upon, they force many students to mature and to make choices that benefit people other than themselves.

I now await my opponents arguments.
flynn09

Con

Speaking for the opposition, I have noticed many flaws with the pro's arguments. I will be addressing these flaws as I move on with my constructive points. Now, the argument brought forth today is that abortion practiced on a baby with a beating heart should be illegal. This falls under the topic of banning partial abortion.

The pro argument clearly stated that, "babies are not considered alive and can't feel pain until they are 8 weeks old. Abortion before this point, I personally believe, is ok. Not necessarily right, but definitely ok." Now, this is all well and good and could make for a very interesting argument except for the fact that this is not what any of the pro's constructive points came down to. All of the points that they brought up were against ALL abortion. To quote they're comment, "The problem with youth today is that they have a severe lack of morality and, for the most part, an inability to accept responsibility for their own actions. By taking away the option of abortion, we force them to be responsible for what they have done." It is clear that they are not aware that by making partial abortion illegal, that is banning ONE type of abortion. Saying that women can't have abortions late in pregnancy does not mean that they will stop having abortions because it would still be legal to abort a child before that time period before partial birth abortion becomes the case. What this debate should be about is the difference between aborting a child of under 8 weeks (which you said was okay) and a child of over 8 weeks (which you are strongly opposing now).

Now that I have brought attention to the abysmal case construction brought to us by the pro side, I will now move on to a constructive point in opposition's argument. This is that of choice. Everyone talks about having a choice whether to abort a child, give it up for adoption, or keep it. There is no doubt in any body's mind that this is 100% true, BUT who would CHOOSE to abort a baby of after 8 weeks rather than abort the baby before 8 weeks when it doesn't have a heartbeat? If anything, having a ban on partial birth abortion would be forcing the woman's decision to take a shorter amount of time which could mean that she decides to abort her child when really, she may have decided to keep it, had her decision not been pressured by time.

Now, to be fair, I will address some of the pro's "points" even though they pertain to a completely different case which we are not debating today. They are talking about what is ethical and what is "right". Well, I must beg to ask, how is it OUR job to force our morals and our personal beliefs of what is right on a decision that should be kept in the family. There is already enough pressures on a woman who does not want to carry a child, we should not tell them that they don't have this option. Sure, there is always the argument, "What if the baby wanted to live?" but that also leads to the counter, "What if the mother didn't want the baby to live?" Now, at first glance, that question seems to say this mother in question is essentially murdering her child, but we cannot assume, that every mother who keeps their child and doesn't want it is going to try to give it a good home. Many women would in fact keep this child. How is it that we should make a law that says people who don't want to carry a baby have to? This could lead to abuse, or an extremely harmful situation for that child.

Now, I can already predict that the whole debate is going to come down to the question, "Is abortion bad or good?" which is too bad because the argument introduced by the pro side is much more interesting, seeing as we don't get down to the tired "abortion is wrong," argument. For all the reasons I have brought forth today, and for the lack of understanding brought forth by the pro side today, I believe that partial abortion should be legal.
Debate Round No. 1
MewxVenus

Pro

I would like to clarify my purpose in this debate. The reason I have brought forth evidence against all abortion is because, like my oponent mentioned, most women don't know before the eight week mark if they want an abortion or not. So speaking against all abortion must occur.

And while this is a bit extreme, I ask those reading this debate to imagine abortion as a form of murder. The definition of murder, given by dictionary.com is: "to kill or slaughter inhumanly or barbarously"

Face the facts: taking a human beings life is inhuman and barbarous. Fetuses are human beings, no matter how small. So abortion is a form of murder.

Keeping this in mind, I urge those judging this round to vote pro. Thank you.
flynn09

Con

As much as the pro side tried to rebuild her case, I must still bring forth the fact that even though women may not know before the eight week mark if they want an abortion, making abortion illegal AFTER the eight week mark would force them to rush their decision and potentially make a rash decision that would mean they chose to abort a child rather than keep it. I did bring this up in my first round so hopefully now pro understands that her point clearly falls.

Now, unfortunately, pro brought up the idea of abortion as a form of "murder," well, that just lowers the standard of the debate a significant amount. We could go back and forth all day saying, "it's murder," "it's not," but really, what we have to decide is should we be forcing out morals on a(what is supposed to be) private decision of a mother? Until you are yourself put in that position you cannot walk around all high and mighty about this topic. Sure, you believe it's wrong, but who are you to tell someone else they are a horrible person if they believe something differently. The fact is, it is the mother's choice. The mother is not going around blowing up big buildings or becoming a serial killer, she is just trying to make a very difficult decision as to whether or not she wants to bring a child into the earth or not. Carrying an unwanted child can be very emotionally devastating so the idea of, "live with your consequences," is just plain not compassionate. Do you want a child to think of itself as a "consequence" when growing up? NO. This is no life for a child.

This is why CLEARLY con already wins this debate. I am eager to see pro try and rebuild her case and invite any and all of her NEW constructive points she will have to bring forth.
Debate Round No. 2
MewxVenus

Pro

I accept a loss in this round since I started a topic I don't really believe in.
flynn09

Con

Thanks, very interesting arguments, made for an interesting discussion:)
Debate Round No. 3
19 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by theitalianstallion 8 years ago
theitalianstallion
How did mewxvenus win when she conceded in the 3rd round? Nevermind, I just answered that question myself...Vbombing.
Posted by MewxVenus 8 years ago
MewxVenus
....Anyone wanna explain to me WTF happened here???
Posted by MewxVenus 8 years ago
MewxVenus
Yeah...well ok! :)

I'lll try uber hard

You pegged it. Stupid internet....

XP
Posted by Maya9 8 years ago
Maya9
If you want me to stop, you need only cease behaving like a person worthy of criticism.

If you're not willing to bring your "A Game", don't expect people to take you seriously.

If you actually beleive that fetuses feel pain at the age of eight weeks, then you obviously didn't do proper research. My guess is that your sole sourse of "facts" is some anti-abortion website bent on spreading misinformation.
Posted by MewxVenus 8 years ago
MewxVenus
Ok look. I did research the topic and do debate formally. This is just how I practice, which is not where I bring my "A Game". Please just stop. I never did anything to you personally. As of this moment, we have never spoken, never seen eachother's debates.

I admit the relationship debate was stupid. And I don't believe "ew" is grounds for a debate. I just worded things simply. So sorry. Really.
Posted by Ragnar_Rahl 8 years ago
Ragnar_Rahl
It's not possible to abort a baby.

A fetus is a different story.

:)
Posted by Maya9 8 years ago
Maya9
I'm stalking and harassing you? Let me ask you something: do you ever worry about your head exploding with that giant ego?

I call 'em as I see 'em. If you're a moron who can't type a proper sentence, I'm going to call you on it. If you have no place here and are just wasting everyone's time, I'm going to call you on it.

I have no formal debate experience. Hell, I didn't even complete high school. Yet I could run circles around YOU in debate because I do my research and understand logical thought. YOU, on the other hand, seem to believe that "ew" constitutes a logical argument and post silly "debates" about your adolescent relationship.
Posted by MewxVenus 8 years ago
MewxVenus
hahaha Thanks. I'm ussually pretty good...when I know the topic. This place is pretty cool to practice :) and thank you for the Debate
Posted by flynn09 8 years ago
flynn09
I think, Mewx, that it's great that your trying debating. I only started 4 months ago and I know how nerve-wracking it can be so I find this to be a good place to practice. It was an interesting argument, thanks:)
Posted by MewxVenus 8 years ago
MewxVenus
I'm sorry...the way she says things just come of as harassment to me. I just hate being ganged up on and things like that...It's just not been my week. But I'll spare you the sob stories. They're not that significant in the great scheme of things anyway. And I really don't care about the "Cheezypuff" thing. We're in a long distance relationship and were just doing something for the entertainment of our friends as I stated already.
7 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 7 records.
Vote Placed by zach12 8 years ago
zach12
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Vote Placed by marin24 8 years ago
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Vote Placed by RacH3ll3 8 years ago
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Vote Placed by MewxVenus 8 years ago
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Vote Placed by Derek.Gunn 8 years ago
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Vote Placed by JustCallMeTarzan 8 years ago
JustCallMeTarzan
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Vote Placed by s0m31john 8 years ago
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