The Instigator
garretthmck
Pro (for)
Losing
11 Points
The Contender
gt4o2007
Con (against)
Winning
13 Points

Abortion should be illegal

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 5 votes the winner is...
gt4o2007
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 6/9/2013 Category: Politics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 664 times Debate No: 34640
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (2)
Votes (5)

 

garretthmck

Pro

Abortion should be illegal. Why you might ask? Because it is murder! We have salamanders that are protected but we can't even protect a human fetus? As soon as an egg is fertilized, it is alive. Why? Because as soon as it is fertilized it starts to grow and develop. If you don't want a baby, then DON'T HAVE SEX. People might try to argue against this but sex is solely for reproduction. The reason why it's fun is because that way we'll make more babies. People should not be mindlessly murdering babies every time they get pregnant. If they don't want the kid, they can give it up for adoption. The only time I'd say it's ok to have an abortion is if it could hurt the well being of the mother.
gt4o2007

Con

Really? "DON"T HAVE SEX." For you to say that sex is only fun because that way we'll make more babies would through out homosexuals and people that masturbate. Sex is not solely for reproduction i.e. homosexuals and masturbation. Now onto the adoption issue sending a child to adoption means it will have a horrible life maybe or maybe not get picked by another family now even if they are in a family is it a family that can support them with love, food, clothes, and continuous shelter? When someone has an abortion it is not because they have fun doing it, it is an experience that most women describe as traumatic and definitely not the ideal situation. Now there will be people that will abuse an abortion as birth control but they are not common with most women. When someone is below 18 and makes the mistake of not using a condom is that a situation where they just accept that they will not be able to go to college or they can ask there parents to raise it or my bad give it up for adoption where it is continuously getting defunded not being able to support as many children that are up for adoption. Also but not least what if they can't afford a child at the time and since welfare is being cut they would not be able to provide for the child? Last but not least there is definitely a population problem with a couple most people have 2 children which would mean the population would sustain but when some have 3 or more it grows. Couples need to have 1 child for the population to go down.
Debate Round No. 1
garretthmck

Pro

Nice misspelling of throw. Anyways, masturbation is a form of fantasy sex. That means that they're doing it to pretend to have sex. And homosexuals are still technically having sex(gays at least. Not really lesbians) even if it is anal. It is still a close enough sensation ( I'm assuming) that it'll feel like intercourse. I'm saying that humans instinctively enjoy sex because we need to have sex to survive. If sex wasn't fun, then people wouldn't do it. It's as simple as that. So we find it fun so that we'll do it thus stopping our species from going extinct. And there are plenty of families that will ask to adopt your kid before they're born so no they won't have a horrible life. And at least they'd have a life. And the parents can go and check out the potential foster parent's home to see if it's ok(and do a background check). Also, if they are not financially able to take care of the baby, adoption, again, is also a choice. And if they're under 18 they should still know to use protection. Believe me, health class really emphasizes it in high school and middle school. And since when was overpopulation an issue in America? In places such as Asia and Africa it is an issue but not in America where we are debating it's legal status. And this leads me back to the point of using protection and just plain not having sex. And last time I checked, we have the freedom to have as many kids as we want in America. So you're arguments are illegitimate.
gt4o2007

Con

You can have as many children as you want yes but is that a good thing really? Overpopulation is a global issue not a continent issue not really sure why you compared America to Africa and Asia because Africa and Asia are continents with multiple countries. Masturbation is definitely fantasy sex and your point is? Homosexuals have sex and it feels good this has nothing to do with making a baby at all. When you refer to couples asking to adopt a child before it is born it is usually when they ask the woman to have a baby for them before she is pregnant not during her pregnancy. There is over 300 million people in this country the drop out rate is 7,000 people per day in high school so no not everyone should know to use a condom because they have not been to sex education. To say that just because you have the freedom to have as many kids as you want my argument is "illegitimate" then I turn it on you abortion is legal and woman can have as many as they want therefore your argument is "illegitimate".
Debate Round No. 2
garretthmck

Pro

My point for homosexual sex is that it feels like intercourse. That means that our brains are wired to enjoy sex. So I still don't see why you can't just admit that. And anyways. It's not as much the concern for the mother as it is the baby. Sure you can argue that it ruins their lives but they chose to have sex. That means they went into it knowing there was the risk of getting pregnant. And don't try to pull the rape card because that's not what I was talking about. I mean when a woman has sex knowing they can't afford/don't want a baby. They should put those factors into their decision of whether or not they have sex. It is murder to abort a fetus. Why? Because it is alive! Abortion is immoral above other things. Put this into perspective: a mother has a baby. As soon as she has it, she kills it. Then she'd go to jail for the murder of a human. So, what's the difference between that and five seconds ago when the baby was in the womb? Nothing! They were still a living creature! And back to your argument about overpopulation, I was saying that in America overpopulation is not a concern for us because we are not overpopulated. It is a concern in the general regions of Asia(especially China) and Africa because they're running out of space and resources. In America(and the rest of the continent), we are not overpopulated. We still have resources and space. And with genetically modified organisms we need less space to make more food. Not to mention we shouldn't just go around killing babies so the population goes down. We can educate people to know that they should try to limit how many kids they have but we can't make them get an abortion. I didn't even hear of anyone suggesting abortion as a population control in America before you. And now onto the next issue. Having a baby in high school doesn't automatically mean you have to drop out. I know multiple girls in my grade who have had kids/are pregnant and they haven't dropped out. Sure they missed a few weeks of school, but they were able to catch up and their babies were watched by their parents/a daycare while they were at school. Not to mention in cases that weren't rape/incest, it was their choice to have sex so they should have to deal with the consequences instead of just murdering an innocent baby. And as I said before also, there are actual families who do not hire a girl to get pregnant for them. Just look at this website: http://www.adoptionnetwork.com... . That blows your argument "When you refer to couples asking to adopt a child before it is born it is usually when they ask the woman to have a baby for them before she is pregnant not during her pregnancy." out of the water. I know you are an atheist but there are many Christian adoption networks for woman and also support for them to help them go through the pregnancy and afford it. And I am aware of the dropout rate but then it's their parents job to educate them. And it was their choice to drop out anyways. So although some people might say that I am against women having a choice, I cannot support it when the choice is to murder an innocent child that has done no wrong. Abortion is murder and that is all I can say.
gt4o2007

Con

Since this is the 3rd argument I don't want to assert a new one but I have never said that we do not like having sex I said that homosexuals have no affect on having or not having a child unless they go and adopt one or fertilize a woman to have a baby. I have not said that we should force anyone to have an abortion I said that it is a form some people use as birth control nothing else. The reason it is not murder is because if you were to take the baby out of the womb it would not be able to breathe or function in any way it has to form within the womb. The way fertilization starts is your brain starts to form first then your head around that it is everything but living. I certainly think abortion should be legal but definitely regulated like it is now doctors have said that a fetus can feel pain at week 16 and they start to move around 13-25 weeks I would call this a living organism but when a fetus has not even formed into what we would recognize as a human body yes I think you should be able to abort. So your argument about murder has no merit here. I was not going to mention rape because I assumed you would categorize this as affecting the mother but I do take offense on how you refer to rape as just something normal to THROW around. I have no problem with religious beliefs benefiting families I completely support that by the way. Now you may know in your school multiple girls that have had babies and been able to.

http://www.pregnantteenhelp.org...

This website completely made your argument invalid about how they can simply go back to school easily. On the site it sites studies saying 70 % of the teens that get pregnant drop out. I think they should be aloud to have an abortion so that hey can be a functioning member of society instead of a high school dropout that could of had a better life.
Debate Round No. 3
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by wolfman4711 3 years ago
wolfman4711
Geez save that for a debate smart a$$
Posted by elvroin_vonn_trazem 3 years ago
elvroin_vonn_trazem
And here we have another ignorant abortion opponent, who needs an education.
1. Murder is about killing persons.

2. The concept of "person" is distinct from the concept of "human". In the realms of legend we human persons have imagined a great many types of non-human persons, from wise dragons in ancient China to magical djinns of the Middle East, to elves in Europe. And modern fiction includes a much much longer list. Is there doubt in your mind that if you killed Yoda, it would be murder? So, in order for killing an unborn human to qualify as murder, you first have to show exactly how an unborn human qualifies as a person, instead of being just a mere mindless animal. Which you CANNOT do.

What you CAN do is devise a set of tests that you might expect persons to pass, and mere animals to fail. How else would you prove that some alien creature, on another planet, belongs in one category or the other? Well, scientists studying human newborns and somewhat older infants have found that they always FAIL to pass tests that actual persons might be expected to pass --and which various ordinary animals CAN pass. See the "rouge test" for example. An adult monkey can pass it; a human baby cannot. Logically, therefore, all humans younger than newborns will also fail the tests, and therefore utterly fail to qualify as persons.

3. An unborn human is not a "baby". It is actually a "baby under construction"; a genuine baby doesn't need an umbilical cord in order to survive. Also, have you ever heard of "Murphy's Law"? The construction process, for a human growing in a womb, is very complex, and Murphy's Law does indeed affect the outcome rather often --50% or more of all conceptions Naturally fail to successfully finish the in-the-womb construction process.

4. The actual purpose of human sex is NOT reproduction, it's for "pair bonding" --because human infants are so helpless that each new mother needs some help, and if she can induce a man to hang around....
5 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Vote Placed by sweetbreeze 3 years ago
sweetbreeze
garretthmckgt4o2007Tied
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Total points awarded:70 
Reasons for voting decision: Yes, abortion should be illegal, as long as it's not an accident. Those poor innocent babies. What did they do wrong?
Vote Placed by Juris_Naturalis 3 years ago
Juris_Naturalis
garretthmckgt4o2007Tied
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Total points awarded:05 
Reasons for voting decision: Counter no longer necessary. Pro's source didn't seem as solid as con's so con get's the source point
Vote Placed by wolfman4711 3 years ago
wolfman4711
garretthmckgt4o2007Tied
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Total points awarded:30 
Reasons for voting decision: Most of cons arguments were irrelevant From the debate, and was never able to rebut pro's arguments
Vote Placed by orangemayhem 3 years ago
orangemayhem
garretthmckgt4o2007Tied
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Total points awarded:13 
Reasons for voting decision: A fairly good debate, albeit a bit thick in places and could've been a tad easier to read. Conduct was pretty much fine across the board. Both sides were slightly 'creative' with S/G in parts but Pro less so, so Pro gets that point. Arguments to Con on the basis that fewer of Con's points were knocked down than Pro's by the end of the debate. Both sources cited were equally good although Pro should've cited a few more to back up his claims which were sometimes unsubstantiated.
Vote Placed by effimero89 3 years ago
effimero89
garretthmckgt4o2007Tied
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Total points awarded:05 
Reasons for voting decision: I mean I personally agree eith Con, Pro didn't have much to say. The homosexual argument has no place in this type of debate...