The Instigator
smithk96
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
1dustpelt
Con (against)
Winning
18 Points

Abortion

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 4 votes the winner is...
1dustpelt
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 4/29/2012 Category: Miscellaneous
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 642 times Debate No: 23267
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (1)
Votes (4)

 

smithk96

Pro

Open to whoever wants to except.
1dustpelt

Con

I accept.
Debate Round No. 1
smithk96

Pro

I am arguing as for abortion. The reason being is that it is the choice of the woman; and if the man is there, him also; to keep to zygote or not. If they don't then let it be. Another reason is that there might be underlying issues with why the woman wants an abortion; like say if she got raped, or incest. That's why I feel like some one should have the choice to choose if they want to carry the child for nine months, or have the choice to abort it with in the first trimester.
1dustpelt

Con

I thank my opponent for posting.

First I will present my case.

P1: A fetus is a human
P2: It is morally wrong to kill a human
C: Abortion is wrong

P1: A zygote, made at the moment of conception, already has the same attributes needed to be alive. It has metabolism, growth, reacts to stimulants, and reproduction cells. It has human DNA. A fetus is a homosapien, therefore they are a human.

P2: This ones kind of obvious, I hope you agree.

Conclusion: Abortion is killing a human, therefore it is wrong.

Sources
F. Beck, D. B. Moffat, and D. P. Davies, Human Embryology, Second edition
http://abortionfacts.com... THE THREE QUESTIONS

I await your response.
Debate Round No. 2
smithk96

Pro

P1: I understand that a fetus is a human.
P2: But a fetus isn't a fetus until 8 weeks into the pregnancy.
C: Yes, it is wrong to kill maybe after the 8th week.

P1: Yes, it may contain those following this but so does a bacterial cell. But do we care for them?
C: If it is a fetus, yes it might be wrong to kill, but before then, I feel like it is okay.
1dustpelt

Con

"But a fetus isn't a fetus until 8 weeks into the pregnancy."
You apparently are not well-versed in human reproduction. The Zygote exists for only four days, then turns into a blastocyst on the fifth day.

"Day 1: Conception: Of the 200,000,000 sperm that try to penetrate the mother's egg cell, only one succeeds.2 At that very moment, a new and unique individual is formed. All of the inherited features of this new person are already set – whether it's a boy or girl, the color of the eyes, the color of the hair, the dimples of the cheeks and the cleft of the chin. He or she is smaller than a grain of sugar, but the instructions are present for all that this person will ever become.

The first cell soon divides in two. Each of these new cells divides again and again as they travel toward the womb in search of a protected place to grow.3

Day 6-14:The new individual at first attaches loosely to the wall of the womb, then burrows deeply and attaches securely to it over the next week. Sensitive pregnancy tests can now show positive, but this depends on the level of hormone produced by the new life. By the end of the second week, the mother's menstrual period is suppressed by this hormone (hCG) which is produced by her child.4

Day 17:Blood vessels begin to form.4 Remarkably, the future sex cells that will give rise to sperm or eggs for a new generation begin to group together - only 17 days after this new life is alive itself.5

Day 18-20:The foundations of the brain, spinal cord, and nervous system are laid.6

Day 21:The heart begins to beat,7 unsurely at first, gaining strength day by day. The heart beats 70 times per minute at first, reaching a maximum of 170-190 at seven weeks, and slowing a bit to 160-180 at 9 weeks.8 A day later the eyes begin to develop. The earliest stages of the ears are now present.9

Day 26-27:The lungs now begin to form.10

Day 28-32:Two tiny arms make their appearance and budding legs follow two days later.11 The beginnings of the mouth take shape.12 The nose starts to develop.13 The thyroid gland begins to grow. Blood flows in the baby's veins but stays separate from the mother's blood. The tongue now begins to form. The face now makes its first appearance.14

Day 36:The baby's eyes develop their first color in the retina (see photo above, right).15

Day 40:The baby makes her first reflex movements. Touching around the mouth with a fine bristle causes her to flex her neck.16

Day 41:The fingers begin to form, followed by the toes a few days later.17

Day 42:The baby develops nerve connections that will lead to a sense of smell. The brain is now divided into 3 parts – one to experience emotion and understand language, one for hearing and one for seeing. 18 Joints begin to form.19 Mother now misses second period.

Day 44:Buds of milk teeth appear. Facial muscles develop.20 Eyelids begin to form, protecting the developing eyes.21 Elbows take shape. Internal organs are present, but immature. 99% of muscles are present; each with its own nerve supply.22 Electrical activity is detectable in brain.23

Day 52:Spontaneous movement begins. The baby then develops a whole collection of moves over the next 4 weeks including hiccupping, frowning, squinting, furrowing the brow, pursing the lips, moving individual arms and legs, head turning, touching the face, breathing (without air), stretching, opening the mouth, yawning, and sucking.24

8 Weeks:The baby is now well-proportioned, and about the size of a thumb. Every organ is present. The liver is making blood, the kidneys function, and the heart beats steadily. The skull, elbows, and knees are forming. Of the 4500 structures in the adult body, 4000 are already present.25 The skeleton of the arms and legs and the spine begins to stiffen as bone cells are added."

Is it right to kill it?

http://abortionfacts.com...
Debate Round No. 3
smithk96

Pro

Day 21:The heart begins to beat,7 unsurely at first, gaining strength day by day. The heart beats 70 times per minute at first, reaching a maximum of 170-190 at seven weeks, and slowing a bit to 160-180 at 9 weeks.8 A day later the eyes begin to develop. The earliest stages of the ears are now present.9

Thank you for informing me about this, this is where I personally feel its wrong to kill a human, because this is when I feel like it becomes a person.

But, also, you have yet to take in the consideration about the mother situation.

"1% of all abortions occur because of rape or incest; 6% of abortions occur because of potential health problems regarding either the mother or child."

Yes, it is a very small number, but I feel like it okay with those situations.

source:
http://www.abortionno.org...
1dustpelt

Con

"Thank you for informing me about this, this is where I personally feel its wrong to kill a human, because this is when I feel like it becomes a person."
And this is when most abortions occur, it is before 8 months. Concession. Vote Con.

"1% of all abortions occur because of rape or incest; 6% of abortions occur because of potential health problems regarding either the mother or child."
Yes, I feel it is okay in those situations. I agree.

Vote CON, Pro has conceded.
Debate Round No. 4
smithk96

Pro

I have to agree with you that they should vote con. You presented a very good argument, and changed my mind a tad.
1dustpelt

Con

Thank you very much. My opponent has conceded.
Debate Round No. 5
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by themanofearth 4 years ago
themanofearth
smithk96: Just some information you should be aware of.
This issue with abortion is not whether a developing human is a human or not. It's whether and when personhood is bestowed that is the issue and consciousness is what makes a person a person. This is the reason we have no problem harvesting the organs of brain dead patients.

Calling a zygote a person is ridiculous at best. Yes it is alive and yes it is human but it is not and cannot be considered a person (except if you believe in a soul that enters the zygote at the moment of conception and that opens a whole other argument). Calling a fetus a person has a little more bight to it but the issue is when a fetus can be called a person. In this case I'd have to go with the 28th week when the thalamus - the brain structure responsible for routing sensor information (pain, taste, etc.) and regulating consciousness - is fully formed and functional. Before this time, there can be no pain sensory and no neural activity recognizable as a conscious state that could amount to personhood and therefore be valued.
4 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Vote Placed by thejmanjman 4 years ago
thejmanjman
smithk961dustpeltTied
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Reasons for voting decision: This is the space where comments go.
Vote Placed by WriterDave 4 years ago
WriterDave
smithk961dustpeltTied
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Reasons for voting decision: Pro's concession.
Vote Placed by TUF 4 years ago
TUF
smithk961dustpeltTied
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Reasons for voting decision: Pro conceded
Vote Placed by 16kadams 4 years ago
16kadams
smithk961dustpeltTied
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Reasons for voting decision: FF. Also pro, if you want to still be pro abortion, read this: http://www.abortionaccess.info/fetusperson.htm