The Instigator
DarkDarling
Con (against)
Losing
1 Points
The Contender
Lee001
Pro (for)
Winning
19 Points

Abortion

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 5 votes the winner is...
Lee001
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/23/2015 Category: People
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,309 times Debate No: 72181
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (37)
Votes (5)

 

DarkDarling

Con

In my opinion I believe abortion should be illegal. It shouldn't even be allowed today, but it is.
Lee001

Pro

Thank you for instigating this debate. I will use this round for acceptance, and read you're argument next round. Good luck!
Debate Round No. 1
DarkDarling

Con

Lets be honest. Your body is your own body. It belongs to you, but what you choose to do with your body, put in your body. Sometimes it up to the government. As long as they keep in some areas abortion illegal. You can't. Your not allowed. This is a really complicated topic cause the girl chose to be stupid for pleasure. She chose. Then she's pregnant. Either she things the baby in her body is just some animal she can kill over and over again, or she believes there a human with a living soul. Not only is it her body now, but its the baby's body in her. Once the body is being formed. There shouldn be a choice whether I should kill it or not. There are probably many women in certain areas where they werent allowed to kill there baby, and guess what. Now there living breathing humans who are making a difference in this world. Do you realize how many human beings who have a mother who thought of getting an abortion before they were born. My mom honestly wanted to get an abortion, but she didn't and I am thankful. What if she did? I wouldn't be here. Sometimes makes me a little bit sad, but I should't. She gave me a chance.
Lee001

Pro

Abortion: 1.Induced termination of a pregnancy with destruction of the embryo or fetus.

You state that "Your body is your own body. It belongs to you, but what you choose to do with your body, put in your body"

From reading this, I concede your basically saying that It is the women's choice to do whatever she want's with her body, so basically you're implying that she has the right to do what she want's to do with her body, such as having an abortion is she choses.

Abortion is not against the law, in fact it's a women's right to have an abortion, unless she choses to invoke this right. We read this in the 14th Amendment: These are just the key clauses of the Amendment

1 No state would be allowed to abridge the "privileges and immunities" of citizens.
2 No person was allowed to be deprived of life, liberty, or property without "due process of law."
3 No person could be denied "equal protection of the laws."

This Cleary states, women have the right to an abortion if they wish, as stated in the 2nd point. "Not being deprived of Life" It's the women's life, nobody should be able to tell her how to live it, or do what they want, ultimately it is her decision.
Violating this right, would mean violation the Amendment which is completely unconstitutional.

"The US Supreme Court has declared abortion to be a "fundamental right" guaranteed by the US Constitution"

This will be my 1st argument, the violation of an individual's rights.

Sources: http://americanhistory.about.com...

https://dictionary.search.yahoo.com...
Debate Round No. 2
DarkDarling

Con

I did not say only in the us I meant everywhere. Its not an individual right because theres another body inside her. When you create something by accident, doesn't mean you can kill it by purpose. Your being selfish. Abortion is wrong. Sometimes it even effects the woman who does it. Stress, trauma, and even guilt. The only reason they did it was because they were scared, they didn't have time. If they did had time, werent scared of the pain or what people think. They would have no problem. Conjoined twins. If one wanted to be seperated, but they said that theres a chance the other one might die, the other would have a say in it. A baby doesn't. Thats the unfair part about it. Something you did not mean to create doesn't have a say on whether it wants to live or not. This is not a violation of there rights because theres another person in you, and you are violating theres.
Lee001

Pro

You state: "Something you did not mean to create doesn't have a say on whether it wants to live or not. This is not a violation of there rights because theres another person in you, and you are violating theres."

You're right, the child doesn't have a choice, that's how it's always been. It's the women's choice, not the fetus's choice. That will never change. It's the women's body overall, she has protection under the 14 Amendment to protect her decision, it's her right. Yes, the fetus doesn't have a for say in the final decision, that will never happen.

Next Argument:
"Personhood begins after a fetus becomes "viable" (able to survive outside the womb) or after birth, not at conception. [31] [32] Embryos and fetuses are not independent, self-determining beings, and abortion is the termination of a pregnancy, not a baby. A person's age is calculated from birth date, not conception, and fetuses are not counted in the US Census. The majority opinion in Roe v. Wade states that "the word 'person,' as used in the Fourteenth Amendment [of the US Constitution], does not include the unborn." [49]"

The fetu's in not apart of the world census, thus saying they don't have any right's that we have. they don't have a say in the Abortion decision.

http://abortion.procon.org...
Debate Round No. 3
DarkDarling

Con

Dont be dependment on the amendments cause i mean for all woman. not woman only in america. You ignored everything i said, and stated that the amendment lets this blablablabla. Give me evidence for all woman, give me the reason why all woman should be allowed to have an abortion. What you said meant nothing. cause it only affects america. americas only 1.8% of the population in the world. tell me why abortion is right. who cares if the amendment protects even less than 1,8% of woman. Who cares. Why do girls do it. Why should they have the right. Who will this help overall? Who cares about there choice when in the end instead of two people there will be one. Not even that one person is probably making a difference because there out making babies by accident. stop talking about 'choice' and start talking about lives. who cares if the amendment doesnt consider a unborn a person. who cares. tell me why. dont go all on facts on tell all the wya. tell me the reason why it should be allowed. oh cause ur a girl who didnt mean to have a bay. didnt mean to stupid. your angry cause you dont have time for this. give me the best reason and you win. dont send me articles. gives me your words completly. idc about the amendment or anything like that cause its only 1.8% of the population. if the girls gonna die then its understandable why she cant have the baby. but if shes in a good enviroment and just doesnt want. dont tell me its her right. dont tell the baby aint a person. tell me why she can, and she should, tell me why abortion is RIGHT.
Lee001

Pro

Well sorry, I didn't know you meant "world-wide" abortion, you didn't state that in the first round.
I'll give you evidence why ALL women should have a choice, we have a brain, we can speak, its our body our life. Therefore you can say and do what you like with you're own body. Nobody else has the right to tell you what to do, unless you let them.

Vote Pro for sticking to legible argument's are for better spelling and grammar, thanks!
Debate Round No. 4
37 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Ragnar 1 year ago
Ragnar
@tajshar2k
PM me if you'd like help writing better RFDs.

@DarkDarling
My advice for your next debate on this topic, would literally be to look at Lee001's arguments, and imagine how she would write (and format) your case. I'd also suggest using an Apply In Comments rule, to pick the right opponent for your skill level.
Posted by bluesteel 1 year ago
bluesteel
=================================================================
>Reported vote: Chuz-Life // Moderation action: Removed<

3 points to Con (argument), 1 point to Pro (S&G). {RFD = Reasons for voting decision: I find the argument (by Con) that "it's not okay to kill something just because you may have created it by accident" to be very compelling. Pro's only response was to claim it's not a person. That was not a compelling response. Furthermore in R3, Pro acknowledges that the child in the womb is a "child" and that supports Con's position. I decided to keep sources as a tie because they were not debated and so they had no significant impact on this debate.}

[*Reason for Removal*] Failure to explain S&G.
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> Tumblrnatic // Moderation action: Removed<

7 points to Pro. {RFD = Reasons for voting decision: Her debates were well constructed, and had been well thought through. Darkdarling didn't have very good grammar, as a result Lee001 got my vote.}

[*Reason for Removal*] Failure to explain sources and conduct.
==================================================================
Posted by tajshar2k 1 year ago
tajshar2k
@bluesteel So if I vote again on this poll "properly" I wont get banned right?
Posted by bluesteel 1 year ago
bluesteel
======================================================================
>Reported vote: tajshar2k // Moderator action: removed<

5 points to Pro (arguments, sources). {RFD = Reasons for voting decision: Pro gave strong concrete arguments backed up with sources.}

[*Reason for removal*] Failure to explain *why* Pro's arguments were stronger and *why* Pro's sources are better. This RFD is no more than a bare recitation of the point categories (i.e. "more convincing arguments," and "more reliable sources"). In fact, it's worse than that: it doesn't even say Pro had *better* sources; it just says that Pro *had* sources.
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Posted by Lee001 1 year ago
Lee001
Like a robot?
You have to argue with evidence, theory proof. None of which you did.
Instead you based it off you're emotion,
Sorry I know how to debate.
Posted by DarkDarling 1 year ago
DarkDarling
idc if im suckin at the spellin words but theres one thing you struggle on. giving a real reason. I like to argue with people who come out from the heart. emotion and facts. you sounded like a robot. so now im bored. nd dissapointed. i enjoyed this cause well when I read it. Obviously im right. but ya know you sound right to.
Posted by DarkDarling 1 year ago
DarkDarling
I am acting like life is perfect. no. life aint perfect. but its are duty to make it better. like i said in order for all of us to continue we have to have each others back. to help each other. selfish is a word that has a meaning of a fact. what u just showed me did nothing of a sort. I said I was against abortion. I already know abortion is allowed. that doesnt help your case. your not giving me a reason or a fact to why abortion is right. 'abortion is right cause its allowed'.
Posted by Lee001 1 year ago
Lee001
Exactly "life ain't fair" So stop acting like life is perfect, by saying all women shouldn't be able to have an abortion. Most abortions are OK to do by 3 months because the fetus isn't completely developed, its not alive. It's not murder.
Posted by DarkDarling 1 year ago
DarkDarling
its like basic logic. some guy gets me pregnant. I get sacred, and go get an abortion. cause i was scared, cause i didnt know how to take care of a baby. basic logic. stop putting the amendmet in this. stop usin one source than only helpin 1.8% . how is this emotional. this is logic. For are country to continue we have to help each other, keep every living human being alive as much as we can. help them. we cant be selfish. do what we want. right now. take the amendment off of your back nd tell me something else to throw me off. this aint. your just twistin my words. life aint fair.
Posted by Lee001 1 year ago
Lee001
I'm so confused, sorry haha.
5 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Vote Placed by AlternativeDavid 1 year ago
AlternativeDavid
DarkDarlingLee001Tied
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Total points awarded:01 
Reasons for voting decision: Conduct: The "blablablabla" in round four seemed very uncalled for. Due to this, I feel as though should Pro get Conduct. I'm awarding nobody S&G because both had atrocious spelling. I will give neither side arguments because while Con was using mostly emotional arguments, Pro's arguments were hardly relevant to Con's assertions. Con also clearly opened round 3 mentioning that all women were included. This was utterly missed by Pro who then tried to say that Con did not say it. Pro gets sources because Con had none.
Vote Placed by tajshar2k 1 year ago
tajshar2k
DarkDarlingLee001Tied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro used reliable sources which were used to back up her claims. Con based her argument on assumption and opinions. I also noticed grammatical mistakes in Con, so Pro wins in that category also.
Vote Placed by Midnight1131 1 year ago
Midnight1131
DarkDarlingLee001Tied
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Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro had this debate in hand for the whole time. Pro used more sources, and had better grammar. Con just reused the same arguments in each round, and started losing their temper in the last one. Pro kept a cool head, and successfully refuted all of these arguments. Pro also used sources, whereas con did not.
Vote Placed by Mister_Man 1 year ago
Mister_Man
DarkDarlingLee001Tied
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Total points awarded:12 
Reasons for voting decision: "Vote Pro for sticking to legible argument's are for better spelling and grammar, thanks!" This alone nullifies the spelling and grammar vote and unfortunately for Pro, gives Con a conduct point because she's telling us who to vote for and I don't believe that's very "respectful" in an argument. Sources to Pro because she was the only one who posted sources. Now for the arguments... Con relies solely on personal opinion and personal moral values, which is not a very good argument at all. And unfortunately for Pro, she simply just explains the law... In her 3rd round, she starts to have an argument by saying "It's the women's body overall..." but very quickly destroys her own argument by bringing up the constitution. I don't feel bringing up laws explains how something is good at all. "Abortion should be legal/allowed because it is currently legal" is not a good argument. So Arguments to neither, as both unfortunately didn't present great arguments for/against abortion.
Vote Placed by Blade-of-Truth 1 year ago
Blade-of-Truth
DarkDarlingLee001Tied
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Total points awarded:06 
Reasons for voting decision: Conduct - Tie. I found Con's conduct in this debate to be questionable. She seemed too emotionally invested in her side and nearly attacked Pro for simply serving as opposition. With statements such as "your being selfish", among others, I was very close to awarding this to Pro. However, no lines were truly crossed, hence this is tied. S&G - Pro. Con failed to properly capitalize multiple times, as well as having several grammatical errors. While Pro wasn't perfect either, she had nowhere near as many mistakes. Arguments - Pro. Con relied heavily on emotional appeal, and never presented any solid evidence for a majority of her claims. On the other hand, Pro was able to cite current laws and cases where the right to an abortion was shown. She presented a case of how making it illegal would go against the rights of the woman, and was never really met with sound rebuttals from Con. Because of this, I believe Pro won arguments. Sources - Pro. Con failed to utilize sources whereas Pro did.