The Instigator
johnnyrocket64
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
desmoinesFE15
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

Abortion

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/6/2015 Category: People
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 306 times Debate No: 79431
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (1)
Votes (0)

 

johnnyrocket64

Pro

The major argument against Abortion is that you are taking a human life. My problem is that an unborn baby that is less than several months old is not a fully developed human, and thus does not have a conscious. The only valid argument against abortion, in my opinion, is that the unborn baby is one day going to become a living human. By aborting the baby, you are taking away the potential life of a person that may do great things. A woman, regardless of how she became pregnant, should have control over what she does with her body.
desmoinesFE15

Con

"My problem is that an unborn baby that is less than several months old is not a fully developed human, and thus does not have a conscious"

Incorrect, a baby can be considered human from the moment of conception. Not only this, but doctors and scientists have found that babies have advanced brain activity well before they are born. This means they are in fact fully conscious. And so what if the baby is not fully conscious? Its a living human!

"The only valid argument against abortion, in my opinion, is that the unborn baby is one day going to become a living human"

Only valid argument? The Bible states many reasons why Abortion definitely is not okay. And to say that the unborn baby is not yet living? The unborn baby is very much alive. Killing any living human is murder. Logic should tell you that.

"A woman, regardless of how she became pregnant, should have control over what she does with her body"

If the woman is in a situation where she must be aborted to save her own life, it is acceptable but still wrong and selfish. Any other case is definitely wrong though. If you plan on making arguments against the Bible, that is not the thing to do. God laid out the exact rules himself in the book. Much of abortion today happens because of "accidental pregnancy". If a young girl is foolish enough to get pregnant, the law is the law, and the word of god is what you must obey. You cant kill a baby because of one stupid mistake you made, especially if it does not endanger your own life.
Debate Round No. 1
johnnyrocket64

Pro

"doctors and scientists have found that babies have advanced brain activity well before they are born. This means they are in fact fully conscious"

I don't think you completely understand what it means to be conscious. A baby may be having brain activity, but at a basic level. This means it is not necessarily aware of its own state, neither is it having thoughts, emotions, or keeping memories. This is all because unborn babies are in a somewhat sedated state. Consciousness begins to happen when the baby is given something to stimulate it's mind, and is taken out of it's low oxygen environment. After the baby is born, it has a complex environment with new senses to interact with, and now begins to stimulate it's mind. Even at this state, the baby only has a basic Consciousness. No real memories being formed or kept, and no real internal emotions besides some pain.

"The Bible states many reasons why Abortion definitely is not okay. And to say that the unborn baby is not yet living? The unborn baby is very much alive. Killing any living human is murder"

What are some of these reasons? I am open to listening to them, but don't let the Bible be your only reason of thought. Think about the actual science behind it, not just what a 3000 year book says. As far as murder is concerned, if the abortion is legal, it can't be considered murder. Murder is defined as the unlawful killing of one human being by another.

"If the woman is in a situation where she must be aborted to save her own life, it is acceptable but still wrong and selfish"

I wouldn't consider it selfish at all. In most of these cases even if the baby was to be born it wouldn't survive very long, and the mother and baby could both end up dying or in a state of extreme illness.

"God laid out the exact rules himself in the book"

As I said before the Bible is not a completely legitimate excuse, as it is mostly based on old world thinking and theories of how the world worked and was created in a time before modern science.

" Much of abortion today happens because of "accidental pregnancy". If a young girl is foolish enough to get pregnant, the law is the law, and the word of god is what you must obey. You cant kill a baby because of one stupid mistake you made, especially if it does not endanger your own life."

Well the law in most cases does allow for abortion. Even if the abortion doesn't endanger your own life, you still might not be able to support and take care of the child, especially if you are still a teenager. I honestly think making a child go through that is far more selfish.
desmoinesFE15

Con

Regardless of weather or not babies have developed a full consciousness, this does not excuse them form being fully human. Especially in the latter stages of a pregnancy, babies are very much alive. They move around within the womb, and can even respond to movement outside of it. And trust me, babies still have plenty of emotions regardless of weather or not they are keeping memories. Just look at how much emotion a baby has as it is being born...

"What are some of these reasons? I am open to listening to them, but don't let the Bible be your only reason of thought. Think about the actual science behind it, not just what a 3000 year book says"

It may be an old book, but is contains knowledge far beyond it's years, and is written by very wise minds. Too many people are falling back on "how old the Bible is" for a variable as to why it is inaccurate. The Bible never directly uses the word "Abortion" but has other insights. First, the unborn has personal attributes such as sin and joy. In Psalm 51:5 David says, "Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, And in sin my mother conceived me." In Luke 1:44 he says "For behold, when the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby leaped in my womb for joy." Jeremiah 1:5 says, "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, And before you were born I consecrated you; I have appointed you a prophet to the nations." Mathew 1:20 says "Joseph, son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary as your wife; for the Child who has been conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit."". When he says "has been conceived" and "is of the holy spirit" we know the baby is a person at the moment of conception. Most importantly, Isaiah 49:1 says, "Before I was born the Lord called me;
from my mother"s womb he has spoken my name." He had been called by God even before birth.

"Murder is defined as the unlawful killing of one human being by another."

In modern law, yes. But think outside of that. The Bible states murder as the unjustified taking of a human life. Even if you think outside of the Bible, concerning morality, this would be the same definition used.

"I honestly think making a child go through that is far more selfish."

Nobody ever said the child had to live with his or her biological parents. Why not just have the child adopted. With a million-some parents looking to adopt children, why not just take this path instead of killing the baby. And when it comes to law, States in the US can still limit the use of abortion when necessary. There are still many other countries outside the US where abortion is illegal.
Debate Round No. 2
johnnyrocket64

Pro

johnnyrocket64 forfeited this round.
desmoinesFE15

Con

desmoinesFE15 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
johnnyrocket64

Pro

johnnyrocket64 forfeited this round.
desmoinesFE15

Con

desmoinesFE15 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by jethro_purazo 1 year ago
jethro_purazo
Interesting topic and debaters. I'm gonna watch over this debate. And I'll be sitting as the judge.
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