The Instigator
maddy_lion
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
Policydebaterspydir
Con (against)
Winning
6 Points

Abortion

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
Policydebaterspydir
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/6/2016 Category: Politics
Updated: 9 months ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 338 times Debate No: 87734
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (2)
Votes (1)

 

maddy_lion

Pro

I am for abortion, but only in certain cases. For example, what if the baby is going to kill the mother? Should a woman in this situation be denied an abortion? What if the baby is going to be born with severe mental or physical issues? Would it honestly be able to maintain a happy, and healthy life? Not to mention the extra financial, mental, and physical challenges of taking care of this child. That's a good case where abortion is an acceptable solution. Another case would be teenage pregnancies. There is almost no way a teenager could take care of a baby considering they have, school, work, friends etc. to worry about. The teen could put the baby up for adoption, but there is still no guarantee the baby would be happy. It would also be a very hard 9 months for the teenager, think of how much they would be judged and made fun of. Is a baby that probably won't be happy anyways really worth all that? Or should the teen get an abortion?
Policydebaterspydir

Con

Okay, I want to start off this debate by thanking my opponent for creating this debate.

Now, I couldn"t help but notice something he stated in his opening: "I am for abortion, but only in certain cases"

He said this nonchalantly, but he really has forced me into a pickle. He hasn"t taken the stance that Abortion is okay, he is taking the position that Abortion is okay in moderation. So, I must argue the fact that abortion is murder, even from conception. This will be the stance that I will take and will attempt to prove today.

Again, thank you so much for creating this debate, and I hope for a great debate.
Debate Round No. 1
maddy_lion

Pro

Yes, I also hope that this is a good debate, and I am for abortion, but in moderation. However, a pregnant woman does have rights to her body. For example, what if the baby will kill the mother? If denied an abortion, wouldn't making her deliver this baby be murder as well?

Also, I must repeat that teen pregnancies are another case where an abortion should be performed. If the teen doesn't abort the baby, they will have to balance the stigma around being pregnant at that age, school, and employment. Whether or not they give the baby away, it can result in psychological problems for the teen. For example, teen mothers are twice as likely to develop postpartum depression as a normal teen. Especially if they raise the baby themselves, they will begin to feel trapped, their grades will most likely drop, they could get fired because their constantly late for work, and they will begin to feel deserted and alone. They also aren't as likely to succeed later in life, since they wouldn't have much time for anything other than the baby. The teenage mom will be stuck with a burden, one that quite possibly will destroy their entire life. And just to think all of these problems that occur in teen moms could all be avoided with an abortion.

I would also like my opponent to know that I am a girl, not a boy, and I as well hope it is a good debate.
Policydebaterspydir

Con

Before I begin, I want to have the opposition clarify something: are there any restrictions on when the fetus can be aborted? Please answer this question in the beginning of your next speech so I can focus my rebuttals on that primary question.

Abortion: The deliberate termination of a human pregnancy.
Human: Of, relating to, or having characteristic of humans.
Characteristic: a feature or quality belonging typically to a person, place, or thing and serving to identify it.
Harms:
When is a fetus considered human?

So, essentially, the opposition has to consider when the fetus is human. They are asserting tha the fetus is not really human, but a group of cells; A part of the mother"s body that she can do with as she pleases. This view does have merit. If the baby is a part of her body, then she can do with it as she pleases. That logic flows pretty nicely. There is only problem: What if the fetus is a human being? In this section, I will layout the average development of a fetus in the womb.
Week1: The fertilized egg makes its way to the uterus. It is about the size of a pen tip. Within days, the cells organize into groupings, the inner cell mass becomes the baby, and the outer cells become the placenta. The egg sheds its protective shell, and burrows into the womb.
Week 5: The baby is the size of a sesame seed. Around this time, the cells take the shape of the embryo, and make primitive organs. The brain and the spinal cord are visible. Around this time, the circulatory system forms. His heart begins to beat. The baby begins to draw nutrients and oxygen from the umbilical cord.
Week 9: The baby LOOKS human with limbs, nose, and even ear lobes. It is now the size of a grape and weighs a fraction of an ounce. It has UNIQUE fingerprints.
Week 10: The baby has fingernails and its liver makes blood cells.
Week 11: the baby"s bones start to harden, and he can even open and close his fists.
Week 13: the urinary tract is functioning and he is starting to urinate. Week 14: The baby can make facial expressions.
Week 15: The baby"s eyes can detect light and his legs are longer than his arms, he can also move them.
Week 17: The baby can now move all his joints.
Week 18: the baby can hear noise, such as your voice, and possibly other loud noises
Week 19: The nervous system has developed and he can now access the ability to hear, taste, smell, touch and see. Unfortunately, he hasn't developed eyes, his sense of smell, or his sense of taste.
Week 20: Usually, the mother goes to have an ultrasound, and you can feel his movements. He is now the size of a banana.
Week 21: The eyelids and eyebrows are developed.
Week 22: the baby has lips, and teeth are forming.
Week 24: the baby"s lungs have developed, and the taste buds have developed. He can now taste and breathe on his own.

The definition of human is Of, relating to, or having the characteristic of a human. From this definition, all I have to do is show that the fetus has the characteristics of a human, and it is therefore considered a human. Once we do this, the killing of a fetus is instantly equated with murder, for we are killing a human with the intention of doing so.
We can see that the fetus, by week nine, looks like a human with limbs, nose, eyes, and even a nose. He also has UNIQUE fingerprints. Notice the word unique. Unique can be defined as: being the only one of its kind; unlike anything else. This is equated with grown humans. On week 14, it can make facial expressions. Week 17, he can move joints. Week 19 he has assessed the ability to all of the five senses. By week 24, it LOOKS, ACTS, and BEHAVES human. He also has access to all of his senses, making him conscious, which makes him alive.

What is a cell?

As I stated earlier, the opposition will have to assert that the fetus is a group of cells that the mother can do with as she pleases. However, she might argue, "but, in the first week, it is essentially a bag of cells." But, what is a cell? Cells are considered the basic units of life in part because they come in discrete and easily recognizable packages. In these packages is something called deoxyribonucleic acid. Now, you might think, what is deoxyribonucleic acid? Well, you would recognize it as DNA. DNA is a self-replicating material present in nearly all living organisms as the main constituent of chromosomes. It is the carrier of genetic information. The important part that I want to expound upon is the Genetic Information. Genetic information includes information about an individual's genetic tests and the genetic tests of an individual's family members, as well as information about the manifestation of a disease or disorder in an individual's family members
So, basically, the cell contains DNA, which contains genetic information. This Genetic information is so complicated, I had to research the kid version to understand it in a broad sense. Kids Health.org gives a broad sense of what genetics is:

"Each of us has a unique set of chemical blueprints affecting how our body looks and functions. These blueprints are contained in our DNA (deoxyribonucleic acid), long, spiral-shaped molecules found inside every cell. DNA carries the codes for genetic information and is made of linked subunits called nucleotides. Each nucleotide contains a phosphate molecule, a sugar molecule (deoxyribose),and one of four so-called "coding" molecules called bases (adenine,guanine, cytosine, or thymine). The sequence of these four bases determines each genetic code.
The segments of DNA that contain the instructions for making specific body proteins are called genes. Scientists believe that human DNA carries about 25,000 protein-coding genes. Each gene may be thought of as a "recipe" you'd find in cookbook. Some are recipes for creating physical features, like brown eyes or curly hair.Others are recipes to tell the body how to produce important chemicals called enzymes (which help control the chemical reactions in the body).
Along the segments of our DNA, genes are neatly packaged within structures called chromosomes. Every human cell contains 46 chromosomes, arranged as 23 pairs (called autosomes), with one member of each pair inherited from each parent at the time of conception. After conception, the chromosomes duplicate again and again to pass on the same genetic information to each new cell in the developing child. Twenty-two autosomes are the same in males and females. In addition, females have two X chromosomes and males have one X and one Y chromosome. The X and the Y are known as sex chromosomes." (emphasis added)

As a summary of this, we all have a unique set of blueprints that tells us how are body looks and functions, located in our DNA. The specific part that affects how your body looks is the part called the Genes. Genes are like cookbooks. They tell you how your hair will look, what color your skin will be, and what color your eyes will be. These are all humanistic characteristics. All contained in a little cell that you can"t see. Much smaller than the size of a kid, grape, or even a sesame seed. The same cells located in you. They function in the same way, work the same way, and carry the same information inside of a human egg, the size of the tip of a pen.
If the cell contains human information, then it fits the definition of a human. In order to be human, it has to be Of, relating to, or a characteristic of a human. We find that the cells contain humanistic information, thus making it human.
In order to reconcile this, the opposition must prove that DNA does not make themselves human, and thus making the opposition un-human, for their DNA tells us humanistic information about them. It is silly to think that they are not human, so why are unborn fetuses who at week one carry the same information as full grown adults, are aborted. If it is true that within the first week that the fetus carries humanistic information, then it is murder to kill it.
Debate Round No. 2
maddy_lion

Pro

In my opinion, early abortions are preferable. Usually it would be a good idea to abort the baby in the earlier stages of pregnancy, but if there was a scenario where the mother found out late in her pregnancy, that the baby would be born with severe disorders, late abortions are also acceptable.

I would like to specify that even as a few cells, the fetus is human. However, the mother does have rights to her body, especially if the baby will kill the mother. Forcing the woman in this situation to give birth would be murder as well.

I would also like to repeat my point about teen mothers. If the teenager takes care of the baby themselves, there is a pretty good chance they wont do a good job. The teen will probably develop postpartum depression, and as the baby grows up they are also likely to develop issues such as depression.

I would also like to point out the over population issues the world is facing. Consider the law in China that only allows parents to have one child. Would bringing an unwanted baby into an overpopulated world help this cause? No.

In closing, I would like to remind my opponent that both the fetus and mother are human. If the mother is in a situation where she knows the baby will not live a long, happy life, doesn't have the money or time to take care of the baby, or if the baby will kill the mother, an abortion should be allowed.
Policydebaterspydir

Con

Okay, thank you so much for responding. I will try to stray from the technical rules of debate so I won"t appear to be a bully, and will try to answer your questions and refute your arguments in simple terms as to help with clarity.

I asked you to clarify the acceptable time to have an abortion, and you partially answered my question. You hinted that the fetus should be aborted earlier, but if it cannot be discovered, and it will affect the safety of the mother, then it is okay to abort.

"In my opinion, early abortions are preferable. Usually it would be a good idea to abort the baby in the earlier stages of pregnancy, but if there was a scenario where the mother found out late in her pregnancy, that the baby would be born with severe disorders, late abortions are also acceptable."

Refutation:

The Fetus is Human
As my opponent states right after this, "I would like to specify that even as a few cells, the fetus is human." The opposition here agrees with me. The fetus, even as a few cells, is in fact human. This is really important, as I will prove.
2. If the Fetus is Human, then Abortion is Murder.
What is murder? Murder is the intentional killing of one human being by another without self defense. So, if abortion is the termination of a pregnancy, and that pregnancy holds human information, then abortion is murder!!! If I prove that a fetus is human, then there is no acceptable situation to abort.

I will now prove this assertion.

Proofs:

Cause and Effect

This principle will shape the rest of my debate. If one does something, then that creates a reaction. And that reaction has either a negative or positive effect.
Think about it, how many successful pregnancies result in human life? How many successful pregnancies result in anything else but humans? Think about that for a minute. If I push a button that sets off a nuclear bomb, for whatever reasons I needed to do it, wouldn"t I be responsible for the outcome? It only follows that I am at fault for my actions! Now, if we apply this same model to abortion, we find something very interesting. If 100% of abortions result in the termination of a pregnancy, then that pregnancy is stopped. If the pregnancy is stopped, then the human life is stopped before it can be fully formed. If the human life is stopped, then it only follows that abortion is the termination of human life! If abortion is the termination of human life, then it is murder. If it is murder, then it is unacceptable. It is murder, so it follows that abortion is unlawful.

At conception, which is when the sperm enter the egg, the life is started. From day one, all the way to the final day, the fetus is human. The opposition has agreed to this, and she now finds herself in a dilemma. She can either say she didn"t mean it, which would be self contradictory, or she can keep her original statement and agree with me that abortion is murder.

Do we need abortion?
I want to make an interesting observation, my opponent hasn"t provided any examples, statistics, or evidence that points to the need for abortion! She has only given hypothetical examples which she hasn"t backed up.
So, please give me some examples of your hypothetical situations please.
Now, if she doesn"t provide any evidence, then she cannot use her hypothetical situations. However,her hypothetical situation of the teen mom does sound probable, so let's assume it is valid. If it is valid, then let's add to the hypothetical demonstration. Let's say the teen who has just become a mom, decides to keep the baby, assuming the baby will not kill her. She has the baby, which yes, will probably will be excruciatingly painful. She has the baby and everything goes fine. The baby lives, and she is temporarily okay. I say temporarily because she probably cannot keep good care of the baby. This is usually accurate. If the teen cannot keep good care of the baby, then guess what, we already have measures set in place to help her. She can offer up her baby for adoption. This great website lays out the advantages of adoption over abortion, namely that the baby is allowed life. http://www.americanadoptions.com...

I recommend you read it and decide for yourself whether abortion is better than adoption.

But then, we come to the sad part of my argumentation. What if the baby or the mother will be killed? Well, The sad thing is, if the fetus is human, or potentially human, we can"t risk the life of the potential human being. That really isn"t fair. The only difference between the mother and the fetus is that the mother can talk and take care of herself. We should be giving voices to the unborn. I am one of those people.
Also, there hasn"t been any evidence suggested that the mother"s life can be at risk, so, technically, there is no support for the opposition's argument.

But, let's assume her second hypothetical situation is true. What if the mother or baby was going to die?
In order to answer this question, we have to take a step back. I"m sure my opponent has heard of the birds and the bees. What is the cause of the baby? I would assert that most of the time, the conception was intentional. If the conception was intentional, what did the person expect? Did the mother expect the baby to just disappear? Well, most women who are seeking abortions, did want the fetus to disappear. Yet, they still made a choice to have sex. They made a decision that has consequences. As sad as it is, the fetus is human. We can"t just throw them under the bus by saying the mother owns them. That isn"t fair for the Fetus. The fetus is there because the mother chose to put it there, whether intentional or unintentional. It is her fault. I know I am sounding rude and sexist or some other synonym for mean, but I really am speaking the truth. I have supported it with facts, logic, and even with the opposition's statements. There is no denying it, the fetus is human, and any attempt to end its life is murder. There is now way around it, and any form of abortion should be abolished.

It is for the former reasons I ask anyone who is reading this to consider carefully who's decision it is to take life. It is a very tricky topic which is in a very literal sense, life or death.

Please make the right choice. If you can't handle a baby, take measures to protect yourself from conception. And if you do end up having a unexpected pregnancy, then deal with it! You made a choice, and now you have to pay the price. There is a saying which I am told a lot by my grandpa: If you mess with the bull, you get the horns.
Debate Round No. 3
maddy_lion

Pro

maddy_lion forfeited this round.
Policydebaterspydir

Con

So in closing, it appears that I have won...

So... if you vote, give me the points, because my opponent forfeited.
Debate Round No. 4
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by maddy_lion 9 months ago
maddy_lion
Sorry, I forgot to make it more characters.
Posted by Policydebaterspydir 9 months ago
Policydebaterspydir
why did you make this debate only 8,000 characters? I had another whole argument I wanted to present.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by Zanomi3 9 months ago
Zanomi3
maddy_lionPolicydebaterspydirTied
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Total points awarded:06 
Reasons for voting decision: Forfeit, as well as Con using sources while Pro did not.