The Instigator
Ruac
Con (against)
Losing
1 Points
The Contender
I-am-a-panda
Pro (for)
Winning
26 Points

Abortion

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/2/2010 Category: Health
Updated: 6 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 1,254 times Debate No: 11063
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (18)
Votes (4)

 

Ruac

Con

Okay, this is one of the things that I hate most about our government. It doesn't matter if the embryo isn't fully formed, once he/she starts forming, it has a soul, along with the rights of a human being. He/she is a child of God, like you and me, and deserves to e treated so.
I-am-a-panda

Pro

I thank my opponent for this debate. I am presuming that he as CON, must prove that abortion in every circumstance, once conception has occurred, should not be permitted, and I the opposite.

== CON Arguments ==

"It doesn't matter if the embryo isn't fully formed, once he/she starts forming, it has a soul, along with the rights of a human being. He/she is a child of God, like you and me, and deserves to [b]e treated so."

--> My opponent must back up these statements. He must prove that a soul exists and is in every human being and foetus.

== PRO Arguments ==

I will present 3 arguments, the Life argument and the Viability argument.

=== Life ====

The Foetus is not truly life until it has brain and heart activity. Until then it lacks vital organs which makes it technically alive as a human. You cannot kill what is not alive.

The heart does not form until the 6th week of pregnancy "The heart bulges, further develops, and begins to beat in a regular rhythm." -- http://en.wikipedia.org...

The brain doesn't form until the 5theek -- "A neural groove (future spinal cord) forms over the notochord with a brain bulge at one end. Neuromeres appear." -- http://en.wikipedia.org...

Therefore, until the 6th week of pregnancy, abortion is acceptable.

=== Viability Argument ===

If the Foetus is not viable, then it is a parasite. If the foetus cannot survive outside of the womb on its own, then it is reliant on the mother, and not human until it can do so.

"It is rare for a baby weighing less than 500 gm to survive" -- http://en.wikipedia.org...

This graph should be a good guide as to what we are dealing with - http://en.wikipedia.org...

"According to data years 2003-2005, 20 to 35 percent of babies born at 23 weeks of gestation survive, while 50 to 70 percent of babies born at 24 to 25 weeks, and more than 90 percent born at 26 to 27 weeks, survive." -- http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is then feasible to say that a baby below 20 weeks of gestation is not viable, and therefore a parasite.

I await my opponents response.
Debate Round No. 1
Ruac

Con

I thank my opponent for accepting in advance
_______________________________________________
You asked for proof that a soul exists. I will give you proof now.
If you ever went to confession, which I assume you never did, you will feel something come over you (if you have a good relationship with God) when the priest says the forgiving prayer. It makes you feel like you have been carrying a lot of weight for a long time, and had just been free of your burden. The burden you have been feeling are your sins. They have been weighing you down for a long time. You feel great, that would be your soul getting freed of the weight of your sins my friend.
This is some proof of the human soul.
I-am-a-panda

Pro

I thank my opponent for his response.

"If you ever went to confession, which I assume you never did, you will feel something come over you (if you have a good relationship with God) when the priest says the forgiving prayer. It makes you feel like you have been carrying a lot of weight for a long time, and had just been free of your burden. The burden you have been feeling are your sins. They have been weighing you down for a long time. You feel great, that would be your soul getting freed of the weight of your sins my friend. This is some proof of the human soul"

== REBUTTAL ==

My opponent has not shown any evidence of a soul. Personal experience is subjective. If I didn't feel such an experience, would it be proof a soul doesn't exist?

At any rate the "weight of he shoulder" effect is guilt. Humans feel guilty if they do something perceive to be morally wrong. Talking to another human being, and one you know is guaranteed not to say anything to authorities, makes people lose this feeling of guilt. It's a mental effect.

"Some evolutionary psychologists theorize that guilt and shame helped maintain beneficial relationships, such as reciprocal altruism. If a person feels guilty when he harms another, or even fails to reciprocate kindness, he is more likely not to harm others or become too selfish. In this way, he reduces the chances of retaliation by members of his tribe, and thereby increases his survival prospects, and those of the tribe or group..... As a highly social animal living in large groups that are relatively stable, we need ways to deal with conflicts and events in which we inadvertently or purposefully harm others. If someone causes harm to another, and then feels guilt and demonstrates regret and sorrow, the person harmed is likely to forgive. Thus, guilt makes it possible to forgive, and helps hold the social group together." -- http://en.wikipedia.org...

My opponent has not refuted my arguments, so they stand.

I await my opponents response.
Debate Round No. 2
Ruac

Con

It is quite hard to show you proof that the human soul exists, along with God. You get this knowledge by personal experience, not simply books or articles on wikipedia. The soul is a fragile thing, and once the embryo becomes even the tiniest little cell, it has a soul. Yes, the brain and the heart are very crucial, but what matters the most i the SOUL, my friend, and if you do not take car of it, cleanse it of its sins, you will LOSE it, and lose all hope.

Oh, and one question: Why don't you prove that the soul DOESN'T exist?
I-am-a-panda

Pro

I thank CON for his response.

== CON ==

"It is quite hard to show you proof that the human soul exists, along with God. You get this knowledge by personal experience, not simply books or articles on wikipedia. The soul is a fragile thing, and once the embryo becomes even the tiniest little cell, it has a soul. Yes, the brain and the heart are very crucial, but what matters the most i the SOUL, my friend, and if you do not take car of it, cleanse it of its sins, you will LOSE it, and lose all hope."

== REBUTTAL ==

My opponent is contradicting himself. on one hand, he is saying an upkeep of a soul is required for it to be kept. He also claims all foetus have souls, even though they lack the ability to upkeep them. Also, appeal to emotion.

He has also not proved a soul exists either.

== CON ==

"Why don't you prove that the soul DOESN'T exist?"

== REBUTTAL ==

I needn't affirm a negative. me or hypothesis has yet been shown that could predict or validate the theory of a soul existing. The burden lies on you to affirm a soul exists.

I await my opponents response.
Debate Round No. 3
Ruac

Con

Ruac forfeited this round.
I-am-a-panda

Pro

I extend my arguments and await my opponents response.
Debate Round No. 4
Ruac

Con

Ruac forfeited this round.
I-am-a-panda

Pro

Unfortunatley my opponent has forfeited the last 2 rounds of this debate. My Round 1 and Round 3 arguments still stand without refutation.

For this reason, I strongly urge a PRO vote.
Debate Round No. 5
18 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by I-am-a-panda 6 years ago
I-am-a-panda
Agreed Marauder
Posted by Marauder 6 years ago
Marauder
Ruac remindes me of Gateroadmusic, he dosent say much or respond to much in his debates. If Ruac is not up for arguing more than his quick low content opinons, but must post them anyway he should do so in the forums and not start an offical debate.

If he's like Gaterode evenmore he will disapear from this site after his first 2 or 3 debates, and we not hear of him again
Posted by Koopin 6 years ago
Koopin
Kenostic, it is a classic closing. The President always says when he is running, "I heavily urge the American people vote for me."
But then again, its your vote.
:/
Posted by Kenostic 6 years ago
Kenostic
I know, but my dislike for people urging me to vote for them overrides that. A debate shouldn't take into account the audience, it is simply a contest between two brains.
Posted by I-am-a-panda 6 years ago
I-am-a-panda
Err...he forfeited two rounds. That's hardly proper conduct
Posted by Kenostic 6 years ago
Kenostic
I gave Ruac a point for conduct because i really hate it when people "encourage" or say "should" vote for them. Otherwise, Panda really put forth a good debate.
Posted by Koopin 6 years ago
Koopin
I don't get it? What are you saying?
Posted by True2GaGa 6 years ago
True2GaGa
Vote Placed by Koopin 3 minutes ago
Ruac I-am-a-panda Tied
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Total points awarded: 0 7
Posted by Koopin 6 years ago
Koopin
All seven point to Pro.
Posted by brian_eggleston 6 years ago
brian_eggleston
All credit due to Ruac for soldiering on against all the odds and well done to Panda for a masterful debate.
4 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Vote Placed by I-am-a-panda 6 years ago
I-am-a-panda
RuacI-am-a-pandaTied
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Vote Placed by Marauder 6 years ago
Marauder
RuacI-am-a-pandaTied
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Vote Placed by Kenostic 6 years ago
Kenostic
RuacI-am-a-pandaTied
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Vote Placed by Koopin 6 years ago
Koopin
RuacI-am-a-pandaTied
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Total points awarded:07