The Instigator
Liz
Pro (for)
Winning
16 Points
The Contender
headphonegut
Con (against)
Losing
14 Points

Abortion

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/23/2010 Category: Politics
Updated: 6 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 3,602 times Debate No: 12120
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (21)
Votes (6)

 

Liz

Pro

My first debate is on abortion. Now why is it that some people think that abortion is so wrong? As one can see I'm pro-choice. I believe that it is a woman's choice wither or not to keep the child. No one should be forced to have a child that they didn't want. And just because someone has an abortion it does not mean that they are any different. There are facts that abortion isn't the worse thing in the world.
for starters, Abortion is not used as a form of contraception. Pregnancy can occur even with responsible contraceptive use. Only 8% of women who have abortions do not use any form of birth control, and that is due more to individual carelessness than to the availability of abortion. (womenissues.about.com #6). even with proper use of condoms and birth control it is still possible to get pregnant. condoms and birth control do not eliminate the risk of a pregnancy, they can only reduce the risk.
Teenagers who become mothers have grim prospects for the future. They are much more likely to leave of school; receive inadequate prenatal care; rely on public assistance to raise a child; develop health problems; or end up divorced. (women issues #9).
(all facts are from this website. http://womensissues.about.com... i'm not to good at citeing sorces)
headphonegut

Con

Thank you for this debate I look forward to it.
1. You have burden of proof.

Intro: Abortion during the first trimester if a women want to get an abortion she may use the MTX, Mifepristone and Misoprostol, and my personal favorite from the first trimester suction aspiration. It is exactly what you think it is. So The MTX what it does basically it stops embryonic cells from dividing and multiplying and is a non-surgical method of ending pregnancy in its early stages.Within a few days or weeks of receiving an injection of Methotrexate (MTX) at the clinic the, the pregnancy ends through an experience similar to an early miscarriage, by the way MTX is a chemotherapy agent that has been used for many years in the treatment of cancer because it affects cells that are rapidly dividing next we have mifepristone and misoprostol it's two steps 1 your doctor administers mifepristone then later the misoprostol the baby then comes out as a miscarriage in 1-4 hours then we have suction aspiration the doctor basically sticks a tube into the women the exactly what it implies sucks the baby out how about some pictures? http://www.wrtl.org...
http://www.baddawi-camp.com... http://www.google.com... Note: the pictures do not represent a suction abortion.
enough of that 2nd trimester you have D & C(Dilation & Curettage),D & E( Dilation & Evacuation) , and Induction Abortion ( also used for 3rd). Now the D as you've already guessed stands for Dilation C however means Scraping It is rarely used as an abortion procedure but however when done well let's just say the old clothes hanger sounds more accommodating. Now even worse is the D & E (most often done)the doctor Grasps the cervix with an instrument to hold the uterus in place.
Dilate the cervical canal with probes of increasing size. An abortion in the second 12 weeks will need the cervix to be dilated more than required for a vacuum aspiration.
Pass a hollow tube (cannula) into the uterus. The cannula is attached by tubing to a bottle and a pump that provides a gentle vacuum to remove tissue in the uterus. Some cramping is felt during the rest of the procedure.
Pass a grasping instrument (forceps) into the uterus to grasp larger pieces of tissue. This is more likely in pregnancies of 16 weeks or more and is done before the uterine lining is scraped with a curette.
Use a curved instrument (curette) to gently scrape the lining of the uterus and remove tissue in the uterus.
Use suction, which may be done as a final step to make sure the uterine contents are completely removed.
Give you a medicine to reduce the amount of bleeding with the procedure. this may be a bit confusing so here's a video. Shall we go on? yes lets now the third trimester involves Dilation and Extraction aka partial birth abortion. The doctor what he does is basically stab the baby in the neck make a whole insert a vacuum then suck the brains out because at this point the baby doesn't fit through the womb so the cranium collapses on itself the baby is taken out then thrown away

I do not know the resolution if my opponent will please post the resolution so I can make my arguments against the resolution and her in the next round I will be grateful. Thank you for the debate and good luck.

http://www.google.com...
http://www.google.com...
Debate Round No. 1
Liz

Pro

The resolution for this debate, is that every woman has the right to have an abortion if they so desire to have one. In my eyes it should not become illegal and no is saying that it will. And for someone to say that it is wrong and it should be illegal in any case, is obviously mislead and in poor judgement. In the case of rape or incest, forcing a woman made pregnant by this violent act would cause further psychological harm to the victim. Often a woman is too afraid to speak up or is unaware she is pregnant, thus the morning after pill is ineffective in these situations. (woman issues, #5b). The ability of a woman to have control of her body is critical to civil rights. Take away her reproductive choice and you step onto a slippery slope. If the government can force a woman to continue a pregnancy, what about forcing a woman to use contraception or undergo sterilization? (woman issues #7b) . I agree with this statement because, if you take away a woman's right to her own body, what could the government make you do. it is not murder if the child can't even live outside of the mothers body and as long as its done within the first four months then I don't see why people care so much. Its none of their business if a woman decides to get an abortion. I don't see why people who are pro-life feel the need to gather outside of clinics that do abortion. it's none of their business so why are they there. they have no idea what the situation is but they are foolish for that. And everyone is entitled to do as they please but seriously they have no right to do that.
(all facts are from this website http://womensissues.about.com.... I suck at citing things and I know it has arguments for both sides.)
headphonegut

Con

To deny someone of life is cruel and unjust. To deny a baby of life to deny someone a living being who hasn't even experienced life is beyond cold-blooded. When a women is bearing a child she has the I believe ultimate responsibility. The women must abandon everything and focus on her responsibility. When a woman kills a child she skills an opportunity someone that can have an idea the benefits outweigh the negatives. In case of rape doctors can administer pills and make sure she isn't pregnant and give her pharmaceuticals to ensure she won't get pregnant. It was decided on roe vs. wade that the mother had the choice whether or not she had the power over one's life a bit like Russian roulette except the baby has a 50% chance of being killed and 50% chance of staying alive.

"if you take away a woman's right to her own body, what could the government make you do. it is not murder if the child can't even live outside of the mothers body and as long as its done within the first four months then I don't see why people care so much"- opponent
R1- what about the babies rights? what about giving the baby rights? and not leaving it to a bovine/asinine teen who gives it away every time she feels like it. Most abortions are teens. How is it none of their business it's like saying why do people want to stop racism? it's like asking why do people even care about the columbine high school shooting I mean it was none of their business so what's the big deal? well Murder is a big deal it's a huge deal. When a baby has a mind the baby is a human being. You obviously have no idea what the "situation" is. killing is a very big deal in America people care, they're passionate, and they have the 1st amendment right to protest. Also the government is made for the people and by the people.

-aside- the resolution is unfair and limits the arguments that one can make against it
Debate Round No. 2
Liz

Pro

Ahh, so one of those people. i love america i do, but what pro-life protesters do is wrong. yes i know they are passionate i understand that. and they have every right to protest. But they have no right to call those who get abortion whores or sluts. they dont know what happened or what the is situation. I think the resloution is completely fair. This is going to be a short post on my end and i am highly sorry, i do apologize in adavance. I honestly belive that the government should not make abortion illegal. this post and the next one is going to be opion based on my end to be honest. I know that people get upset and all but stilll. it doesn't affect them, it doesn't change thiere lives in anyway. i do not belive that abortion is a problem. let the people do as they please. its thier lives
headphonegut

Con

headphonegut forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
Liz

Pro

As I have stated before, it is a woman's choice on weather or not to have the child. If she decides to have an abortion it is her choice, after all it is her body. No one can or should tell someone what to do with their body. you cannot compare someone who had an abortion to a murderer. It is not right to say that a woman who has an abortion is wrong, it was what she thought best. And if she was raped well then she should be forced to have a child, she shouldn't be forced to remember everyday of her life she was raped, do you have any idea what psychological problems that would cause. She would always be traumatized. In closing of this debate, pro-choice is just easier because its no-ones choice but the woman's and whomever she is with.
headphonegut

Con

headphonegut forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
21 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by chrischris 6 years ago
chrischris
http://www.internationaldrugmart.com... - Here you can find detailed information about the drug
Posted by chrischris 6 years ago
chrischris
It was really painful to see the video's at the same time help to know what actually happens. Misoprostol–Mifepristone is a combination medication described he is also termed as MTP kit. I got more information about this medication at International Drug Mart They even have the image of the drug.
Posted by surfride 6 years ago
surfride
Although to be fair, the blatant gross-mongering hasn't been rebutted particularly effectively.
Posted by surfride 6 years ago
surfride
The problem with the videos is not so much that they are there, it's that it's headphone's only argument in the round. It's not an actual argument, it's just a blatant attempt to attract sympathy for the poor widdle fetus. The only effective counter is to show a video of a birth taking place, with accompanying diagrams, and with full sound so everyone can hear and see how much pain and discomfort the mother must endure, as well as how nasty it is. Essentially, the videos and even headphone's entire description of abortion procedures add nothing to the debate. They do not provide any reason to vote against abortion logically or morally, and it seems that like the anti-choice movement as a whole, they are intended not to argue about mother's rights, fetus's rights, etc, but rather to just distract the debate to "Here, look how gross this is, how can we POSSIBLY allow it?"
Posted by Liz 6 years ago
Liz
this is for Brandonmaciel333, so you belive that if a woman is raped she should be punished with the memory everyday that she was raped, she would have to look at that child and know that her life was drasticly changed because some man dedcided to commit the worse crime of all. or what if the mothers life was in danger, what then. One thing is that men cant have kids, they dont know what its like, or the pain. Like i said before everyone has thier right to thier opions. It comes down to this whatever that woman feels is right. if she thinks an abortion is right, well then whos to say that she is wrong. it is her body no one eles.
Posted by yayawhatever 6 years ago
yayawhatever
Brandonmaciel333:

Seriously sweets, quit givin words your own personal meaning. Try actually looking words up in dictionaries before insisting on their definitions

You ignoring reality only promotes YOUR ignorance and inability to deal with reality--not mine

sticking your head up your @$$ encourages YOUR blindness, not mine
Posted by yayawhatever 6 years ago
yayawhatever
Brandonmaciel333:

You idiot. The nonsense u copy/pasted had NOTHING to do with my mockery of the stupid misogynistic priests CREATION of the term "dismemberment abortion" ...my fukking goddess...the stupid link u posted didnt even connect to his *dismemberment abortion" vid, but his dialation vid

Who gives a fukk? None of his vids are credible. Hell, he blocks most prochoicers because that stupid misogynist KNOWS he's in the wrong and doesnt have the intellectual capacity to actually debate those that disagree with his stance on a choice he will NEVER make

seriously though, it cracks me up that THE voice against a womans right to choose feels the need to muzzle the voices of those that disagree with him. And he's supposed to be like *spiritual* and like in touch with a supposed higher power....yet on some level, he's logical enough to KNOW he's in the wrong on MY RIGHT to choose

Don't like abortions? Don't have 'em
Can't have 'em and still don't like 'em?
Move to a 3rd world sh!thole that agrees with your misogyny

Have a lovely prochoice day
Posted by Brandonmaciel333 6 years ago
Brandonmaciel333
like seriously the video helps the doods point
and all the details..
man
how can people honestly think its ok?
its murder no matter how you see it
the end result is death
people know that if you have sex there is a chance they could get prego
accept responsibility
if you get raped
why are you going to punish the child
the child could grow up to be something in life
if you get prego and dont want it put it to adoption
its like this i could go up to you and say you were suppose to be aborted so ima kill you
its the exact same thing
yea i dont feel like using huge words and make things sound difficult for something thats so simple
im just being straight up
thank you
Posted by headphonegut 6 years ago
headphonegut
oh and it isn't used on medical sites "dismemberment abortion" because like anything there is a difference in terms of being politically correct and correct dismemberment abortion is D&E dilation and evacuation.
Posted by headphonegut 6 years ago
headphonegut
@ yayawhatever did you even see the video? That is actually what the doctor does in the second trimester he literally dismembers the baby piece by piece here's a link http://www.priestsforlife.org... don't believe this one here's another http://en.wikipedia.org... and another "How is dilation and evacuation abortion (D & E) performed?

A D & E abortion is performed in the second trimester (12-24 weeks) and is usually a 2-3 day procedure. At this stage of pregnancy, the fetus' tendons, muscles, and bones are more developed. The cervix has closed more tightly and must be dilated enough to remove the larger fetus.

To aid in cervical dilation, laminaria (dried seaweed sticks) are inserted into the cervix. The dilation process can take 1-2 days depending on the size of the fetus.

Once the cervix is sufficiently dilated, the laminaria are removed. Forceps are inserted into the uterus to forcibly dismember the fetus. The skull is then crushed and removed. A suction aspiration is then introduced to remove any remaining fetal parts, the placenta and uterine lining."- http://www.prolifeaction.org...
6 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Vote Placed by bballcrook21 11 months ago
bballcrook21
LizheadphonegutTied
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Reasons for voting decision: FF
Vote Placed by Cliff.Stamp 5 years ago
Cliff.Stamp
LizheadphonegutTied
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Reasons for voting decision: Forfeit.
Vote Placed by Phoenix_Reaper 5 years ago
Phoenix_Reaper
LizheadphonegutTied
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Vote Placed by Danielle 5 years ago
Danielle
LizheadphonegutTied
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Reasons for voting decision: First of all Con is a vote bomber. Not only has he vote bombed me before but he bombed his own debate here despite forfeiting most of the rounds. I also think he has multiple accounts on this site, including Liz his "opponent" who mysteriously voted for him too despite the fact that he didn't even provide an argument in several rounds. Hey headphonegut -- you're fucking pathetic.
Vote Placed by headphonegut 5 years ago
headphonegut
LizheadphonegutTied
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Vote Placed by HEADPHONEGUY 6 years ago
HEADPHONEGUY
LizheadphonegutTied
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