The Instigator
DoctrinallyCorrect
Pro (for)
Winning
19 Points
The Contender
uj0320
Con (against)
Losing
7 Points

According to the Bible Jesus Is God

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/6/2008 Category: Religion
Updated: 8 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 1,608 times Debate No: 5297
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (13)
Votes (4)

 

DoctrinallyCorrect

Pro

PROPSITION: The Scriptures Teach That Jesus Is God!

By the scriptures I mean the 66 books of the Bible.
By Teach I mean to impart informantion.
By Jesus I mean the son of Mary & Joseph.
By God I mean he is Deity.

This is such an easy propsition all I am going to do is list some scripture references as proof.

Isaiah 9:6 KJV
6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

John 20:26-28 KJV
26 And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them: then came Jesus, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, Peace, be unto you.
27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing.
28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.

Titus 2:13-14 KJV
13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Savior Jesus Christ;
14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

This should provide sufficient proof to get this debate started. I welcome response from anyone who may chose to respond.
uj0320

Con

"According to the bible, Jesus is God"

With this such religious topic, I don't think it is absolutely possible to prove which side is wrong or right by presenting reasonable or logical sources. Therefore, I'm just going to represent my points of view about the topic and prove why it is impossible to support one's notion on this topic with logical senses.

In bible, it states "Jesus is son of God, God is Holy Spirit, and Holy Spirit is Jesus." With logical senses, it is impossible to be a father and a son at the same time. One might say.. "it is possible because it's Jesus." Well, how can you prove it? It is not only impossible to prove it was actually possible but also pointless. As my opponent did so, one might represent the Bible as a source to prove the point. However, what makes Bible the most reliable source in this world when the author of it is God himself, who neither can be seen or touched by us just regular people?

It is pointless to argue about such a religious topic, therefore this debate should be tied or favored for me since my opponent will not be able to prove his point is right by legal or coherent sources.
Debate Round No. 1
DoctrinallyCorrect

Pro

Readers you understand that in order to defeat an opponent's argument you actually take up his material and answer it. He did not deal with any of my verses that I presented that in no uncertain terms say with any ubiquity that Jesus is God. I can see already that he is not going to deal with my verse in any theological or logical manner.

My proposition states that the scriptures teach that Jesus is God. I used scriptures that say that plainly. Case closed.

He says that it is impossible to a father and a son at the same time. Even if that is true, which it is not, that is not what we are debating. I simply set out to affirm that Jesus is God according to the Bible and I did just that. My opponent wants to know how I can prove that Jesus is a father and a son. I want to know, why would I try to prove something in this debate that is NOT my proposition. I may even believe that Jesus is at once father and son, but that is not the point of this debate. By the way, to prove that Jesus is God, one does not have to make him a father and a son. What if I were a Trinitarian and believe in God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Ghost? They believe that the Son (Jesus) is God, but is not the Father. So, you see my opponent has presented a straw man.

Tell me that neither Isaiah 9:6, John 20:26-28, nor Titus 2:13-14 says that Jesus is God and you win this debate. If you can't change the wording of those passages then I win.

If this is so pointless to debate then, why are you doing it?
uj0320

Con

Ladies and gentlemen, once again, I'm trying to deal with this argument in the most logical manner;therefore, I do not believe it is possible for Jesus to be God according to Bible.

"Readers you understand that in order to defeat an opponent's argument you actually take up his material and answer it."

I did take up the material and simply said the source of it is not qualified since the author himself is ambiguous, and is not scientifically proved. Consequently, the material is not reliable.

"He says that it is impossible to a father and a son at the same time. Even if that is true, which it is not, that is not what we are debating. I simply set out to affirm that Jesus is God according to the Bible and I did just that. My opponent wants to know how I can prove that Jesus is a father and a son. I want to know, why would I try to prove something in this debate that is NOT my proposition."

It is significant to prove how to be a father and a son at the same time because the Bible, the only source you are using to sustain your proposition, states God is Jesus' father, Jesus is God's son, and Jesus is God himself, and that's the proposition that you're trying to prove. It absolutely fits the topic and does not deviate from it at all. Well, furthermore, my opponent would have to prove everything written in Bible is reliable and true in order to justify the source he is using is proved and reliable to the readers of this debate.

" By the way, to prove that Jesus is God, one does not have to make him a father and a son. What if I were a Trinitarian and believe in God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Ghost? They believe that the Son (Jesus) is God, but is not the Father. So, you see my opponent has presented a straw man."

I don't think my opponent is making a coherent sense at this point. My opponent is saying.. 1. God the son. 2. God the father 3.Son is not the father. I will let the readers judge if this makes any sense.
Debate Round No. 2
DoctrinallyCorrect

Pro

I want to begin with a quote from my opponent.

"I did take up the material and simply said the source of it is not qualified since the author himself is ambiguous, and is not scientifically proved. Consequently, the material is not reliable."

He thinks that he dealt with my argument by saying that my source, the bible, is unreliable and unqualified as a source. On what planet and in what universe is this logical. My proposition is, ACCORDING TO THE BIBLE Jesus is God. To affirm that proposition the ONLY qualified and reliable source and material is the bible. Notice the issues is not that I am claiming that Jesus is God and quoting the bible to prove it. If that is what I was doing maybe he has a point. I am not claiming that Jesus is God, but that according to the Bible Jesus is God. The only way to determine that Jesus is God according to the bible, is to see what the bible says. However suspect or unreliable the bible may be in my opponents view, the one area that it is reliable is about what IT say. There is no greater source of authority about if the bible says something than the bible. You the readers understand that.

If I were to claim that according to to gallop poll McCain is leading the presidential race the most authoritative source to prove that would be to check the gallop poll. You could not logically quote zogby, Rasmussen, or any other poll as proof that McCain is leading in the gallop poll. You readers understand this very clearly.

So the fact of the matter is, if I am going to prove the proposition that "according to the bible" Jesus is god, to ultimately prove that, I MUST quote the bible. Now if I was going to just try and prove that Jesus is God, I agree that the bible could be questioned as a viable source, but that is not what I have done. The Bible still very clearly says in plain and impossible to misunderstand language that Jesus is God (Is 9:6, Jn 20:26-28, Titus 2:13-14, Rom 9:5). Even he cannot deny that.
uj0320

Con

uj0320 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
13 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by scissorhands7 8 years ago
scissorhands7
"A wise man shuts his mouth and has other people assume he is a fool; a fool opens his mouth and confirms the widely held opinion"
Posted by Rezzealaux 8 years ago
Rezzealaux
"I don't mind the opinions of those who think I'm childish and vulgar, because I think they're vegetables.
Thanks for playing."
Posted by scissorhands7 8 years ago
scissorhands7
I'm not arguing with what John has said. John has expressed his opinions in a level headed manner, unlike yourself who resorted to vulgarities.

I'm not asking you to suppress your opinions, just your crude vulgarities when addressing my God.

ex: "According to the bible God is a jealous and proud of it; petty, unjust, unforgiving, control freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty, ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevent bully."

A good opinion, nowhere were there any vulgarities

ex. "*According to the Bible God is a dick."

A childish opinion because you had to use vulgarities unlike John's intelligent expression of his own opinion. In the future, or at least on this site, try to express your own opinions in an intelligent manner. Please do not result to using vulgarities to state your point. This is a request and not a command.

Thank You
Posted by Rezzealaux 8 years ago
Rezzealaux
"Both of which, "I'm pretty sure" you haven't read. Until that time, I ask politely, (and I think I speak for the majority of people on this site) that you reserve your vulgar opinions, that are seen as both unintelligent and offensive."

Then "I'm pretty sure" you're wrong.
I intend to express my opinion as I see fit.
I'm a concise person.
John likes to be accurate.
You might as well have not made that comment, since I pretty much agree with everything John says.

I don't mind the opinions of those who think I'm childish and vulgar, because I think they're vegetables.
Thanks for playing.
Posted by scissorhands7 8 years ago
scissorhands7
Both of which, "I'm pretty sure" you haven't read. Until that time, I ask politely, (and I think I speak for the majority of people on this site) that you reserve your vulgar opinions, that are seen as both unintelligent and offensive.

If you wish to inject an opinion of your own about a God which most of the world esteems, I politely ask that you do not include vulgarities in that opinion. s0m31johns opinion is entirely acceptable, yours however is vulgar and only makes you look both childish and vulgar.

Thank you
Posted by uj0320 8 years ago
uj0320
I'm sorry I forfeited the last round.
I was busy chased by work lately and didn't realize the clock was ticking so fast..
Posted by Rezzealaux 8 years ago
Rezzealaux
I'm pretty sure it has both testaments, yeah.
Posted by scissorhands7 8 years ago
scissorhands7
The new testament?
Posted by Rezzealaux 8 years ago
Rezzealaux
"What Bible have you been reading?"

The uhh.... King James Holy Bible?
Posted by scissorhands7 8 years ago
scissorhands7
*According to the bible God is a pacifist, healer, teacher, lover, loyal, and a friend.
What Bible have you been reading?

Fixed.
4 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Vote Placed by Logical-Master 8 years ago
Logical-Master
DoctrinallyCorrectuj0320Tied
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Vote Placed by Rezzealaux 8 years ago
Rezzealaux
DoctrinallyCorrectuj0320Tied
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Vote Placed by ciscoredneck 8 years ago
ciscoredneck
DoctrinallyCorrectuj0320Tied
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Vote Placed by DoctrinallyCorrect 8 years ago
DoctrinallyCorrect
DoctrinallyCorrectuj0320Tied
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