The Instigator
1970vu
Pro (for)
Winning
6 Points
The Contender
telisw37
Con (against)
Losing
1 Points

Adam Is not God.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
1970vu
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/1/2014 Category: Religion
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,110 times Debate No: 43217
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (22)
Votes (2)

 

1970vu

Pro

You can post your argument.
telisw37

Con

Welcome! I accept this challenge not to change the minds of those to deny the written word of God. But to improve my writing skills and knowledge of the simple truth.

The whole world waits for the restoration of Eden, (Who was at the Head?)
Rom_8:22, For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
All religions agree that a man named Christ existed.
The bible has 300+ prophecies leading to the virgin birth of Christ, being born of the seed of Adam fulfilling being the Root of David who Prevailed.
1st. Witness: Rev_5:5, And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.
2nd. Witness: Rev_22:16, I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.
The bible is a detailed record of the family of Adam who married Eve (Who became Israel by birth, bloodlines and real families) later called a whore who was beguiled by Satan not a talking snake.

2Co_11:1, Would to God ye could bear with me a little in my folly: and indeed bear with me.
2Co_11:2, For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.

2Co_11:3, But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.
2Co_11:4, For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.
2Co_11:5, For I suppose I was not a whit behind the very chiefest apostles.
2Co_11:6, But though I be rude in speech, yet not in knowledge; but we have been throughly made manifest among you in all things.
2Co_11:7, Have I committed an offence in abasing myself that ye might be exalted, because I have preached to you the gospel of God freely?

Christ on the Cross in Genesis 3.

" Gen 3:17 And unto Adam (Christ not virgin born yet.) he (The same voice in the clouds who spoke This is my beloved son and who I am well pleased! ) said Because thou (Adam/Christ) hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife(Eve=Israel) and hast eaten of the tree (CROSS!) of which I (Voice from clouds) commanded thee saying Thou shalt not eat of it:(Take sin upon yourself!) cursed is the ground for thy sake;(Your royal bloodline of David, mixed with Satan!) in sorrow (Christ a man of sorrows!) shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life; Gen 3:18 Thorns also and thistles (Crown of thorns!!!!!) shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field; (Fig tree no figs!) Gen 3:19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread till thou return unto the ground; (Lords supper before the cross!) for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art and unto dust shalt thou return. Gen 3:20 And Adam (Christ) called his wife's name Eve; (Israel) because she was the mother of all living. Not in Christ then you are dead! Not meaning Eve actually did not birth all races of people.

Footnotes:
Voice from heaven.
Mat_3:17, And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
Mat_17:5, While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him.
Mar_1:11, And there came a voice from heaven, saying, Thou art my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
Mar_9:7, And there was a cloud that overshadowed them: and a voice came out of the cloud, saying, This is my beloved Son: hear him.

Man of sorrows.
Isa_53:3, He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.

Crown of thorns.
Mat_27:29, And when they had platted a crown of thorns, they put it upon his head, and a reed in his right hand: and they bowed the knee before him, and mocked him, saying, Hail, King of the Jews!
Mar_15:17, And they clothed him with purple, and platted a crown of thorns, and put it about his head,
Joh_19:2, And the soldiers platted a crown of thorns, and put it on his head, and they put on him a purple robe,

Lords Supper.
Luk_22:7, Then came the day of unleavened bread, when the passover must be killed.

Luk_22:8, And he sent Peter and John, saying, Go and prepare us the passover, that we may eat.
Luk_22:9, And they said unto him, Where wilt thou that we prepare?
Luk_22:10, And he said unto them, Behold, when ye are entered into the city, there shall a man meet you, bearing a pitcher of water; follow him into the house where he entereth in.
Luk_22:11, And ye shall say unto the goodman of the house, The Master saith unto thee, Where is the guestchamber, where I shall eat the passover with my disciples?
Fig Tree Know that Adam and Eve were in a Fig Grove. Not a Apple patch! " Gen 3:7 And the eyes of them both were opened and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together and made themselves aprons.

Mat_21:19, And when he saw a fig tree in the way, he came to it, and found nothing thereon, but leaves only, and said unto it, Let no fruit grow on thee henceforward for ever. And presently the fig tree withered away.
Mat_21:20, And when the disciples saw it, they marvelled, saying, How soon is the fig tree withered away!
Mat_21:21, Jesus answered and said unto them, Verily I say unto you, If ye have faith, and doubt not, ye shall not only do this which is done to the fig tree, but also if ye shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; it shall be done.
Mat_24:32, Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
Mar_11:13, And seeing a fig tree afar off having leaves, he came, if haply he might find any thing thereon: and when he came to it, he found nothing but leaves; for the time of figs was not yet.
Mar_11:20, And in the morning, as they passed by, they saw the fig tree dried up from the roots.
Mar_11:21, And Peter calling to remembrance saith unto him, Master, behold, the fig tree which thou cursedst is withered away.
Mar_13:28, Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When her branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near:
Debate Round No. 1
1970vu

Pro

Adam:
1. 'So God created mankind in his own image,
in the image of God he created them;
male and female he created them.' Genesis 1:27
Notice the word ' mankind'. It does not say ' Gods'. It just says ' mankind'.

2. 'The bible has 300+ prophecies leading to the virgin birth of Christ, being born of the seed of Adam fulfilling being the Root of David who Prevailed.' Notice that any mention of Adam is virtually non existent after Genesis 5:3. Of course the bible has a bunch of these prophecies. But do they ever mention the name Adam? You see, Adam never spoke about theology. He just had sex with Eve and died.

3. Eve: Around the time Of Christ, the Torah already contained many prophecies saying that a VIRGIN will give birth to emmanuel. Notice the word Virgin. Did you know that Eve became a non virgin? As stated by Genesis 4:4:
'Adam[a] made love to his wife Eve, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Cain.[b] She said, "With the help of the Lord I have brought forth[c] a man." 2 Later she gave birth to his brother Abel.'
According to http://www.behindthename.com..., Eve comes from the Hebrew name chawah which means,' to breathe.' Likewise Israel means "God contended". Eve was called by adam 'the mother of all living'.

4. Adam sinned. The very nature of christ is being tempted to sin but not to sin. If you want everyone in the world to listen to you and then sin, People might think you are a hypocrite.

5. Why did the early church fathers not support this doctrine? If you take a look at the nicene creed, there is no mention of Adam.
telisw37

Con

Hello all!
I will quickly address the contentions.
Contention #1 I totally agree that Adam could not create Himself. Because the bible says Adam was formed. My opponent is totally ignorant of the Hebrew meaning of FORMED.
Strongs# 3335 ya star= Squeezed into the potter, divine activity.
Gen 2:5-7 Declares that Adam was formed to til the ground=make plants grow. Also this was singular, where in Gen.1:26 these people were CREATED IN THE IMAGE! Adam got the breath of God! Is what is written.
Contention#2 Adam sinned or paid the price for Eve, because in her womb was Noah, Abraham, David and the 12 tribes and Christ Himself=Adam's way to return virgin born.
" 1Ti 2:13 For Adam was first formed then Eve. 1Ti 2:14 And Adam was not deceived but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. "
To be the Christ is why Adam did it.
Contention#3
My Higher Criticizing opponent puts his limits on the Almighty? Duh??????? (Sorry I do not care if I lose points for being nice!)
Col_2:2, That their hearts might be comforted, being knit together in love, and unto all riches of the full assurance of understanding, to the acknowledgement of the mystery of God, and of the Father (ADAM IS WAS THE FATHER OF CHRIST,) and of Christ;
1Ti_3:16, And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, (CHRIST CAME THROUGH THE BLOODLINE OF ADAM) justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
Rev_10:7, But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.
The word "adam" has three meanings!
" H0120 "Means mankind. H119 means Red Ruddy!

#0120 אָדָם 'adam {aw-dawm'}

from H0119; TWOT - 25a; n m
"Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)

1) man, mankind
1a) man, human being
1b) man, mankind (much more frequently intended sense in OT)
1c) Adam, first man
1d) city in Jordan valley
"Brown-Driver-Briggs (Old Testament Hebrew-English Lexicon)
From H0119; ruddy, that is, a human being (an individual or the species, mankind, etc.):"X another, + hypocrite, + common sort, X low, man (mean, of low degree), person.
"Strong's (Hebrew & Chaldee Dictionary of the Old Testament)
#120.
אָדָם
adam (9a); from an unused word; man, mankind:"
NASB - any man(2), anyone(4), anyone's(1), being*(1), common sort*(1), human(19), infantry(1), low degree*(1), low*(1), man(363), man's(20), man*(1), mankind(9), men(104), men of low degree*(1), men's(3), men*(4), mortal(1), one(3), people(1), person(5), person*(1), persons(3), population(1), someone(1).

Adam also is the first man of Palistine=Jesus Christ!

" H0121 "

#0121 אָדָם 'Adam {aw-dawm'}

the same as H0120; TWOT - 25a; n pr m
"Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)

Adam = "red"
1) first man
2) city in Jordan valley
"Brown-Driver-Briggs (Old Testament Hebrew-English Lexicon)
The same as H0120; Adam, the name of the first man, also of a place in Palestine:"Adam.

Many religions say that Adam and Eve are the parents of all races. Another religious error!
Adam and Eve are the parents of Israel and the 12 tribes. Abraham did father many nations. But Egypt was all ready there. Abraham came from Ur.
Did Adam"s red ruddy kids turn black? Or Brown? Or did God set a trap for Adam?
Did God actually create Nations with no people? Host?=PEOPLE!
" Gen 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished and all the host of them. "
Who is the Lord of Hosts???????? Adam=Christ=Root of David=He the man who was with God in John 1;1 The Offspring of David saying Christ=Adam was His own father and Son of David.

" Gen 2:10 And a river went out (Notice outside.) of Eden to water the garden; and from thence it was parted and became into four heads. Gen 2:11 The name of the first is Pison: that is it which compasseth the whole land of Havilah where there is gold; (Is my opponents saying God made gold for cows=the golden calf, and not the people of the land named by Adam?) Gen 2:12 And the gold of that land is good: there is bdellium and the onyx stone. (Is my opponents saying God cast His pearls before swine and animals who was there because no humans existed outside of Eden?) Gen 2:13 And the name of the second river is Gihon: the same is it that compasseth the whole land of Ethiopia .(BLACK PEOPLE!!!!!!) Gen 2:14 And the name of the third river is Hiddekel: that is it which goeth toward the east of Assyria. (No brown/Arab people here either??????) And the fourth river is Euphrates. "

Lord of host
(Found 244 times in 234 verses)
Is my opponent is saying God is the Lord of the animals and not people too? Host not races of human beings?
Gen 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished and all the host of them. "

Adam=Christ AGAIN FOR THE BLIND WHO HAVE EYES BUT SEE NOT!

" Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word and the Word (Adam was with God not all of mankind!!!) was with God and the Word was God(Adam was with God not all of mankind!!!) Joh 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God.(Adam was with God not all of mankind!!!) Joh 1:3 All things were made by him;(Adam was with God not all of mankind!!!) and without him was not any thing made that was made.(Adam was with God not all of mankind!!!) Joh 1:4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men. (MAN DID NOT MAKE HIMSELF! NOR COULD BE HIS OWN LIGHT!) Joh 1:5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not. "
Yet my opponents says that Adam was a man and not God, did He=Adam keep his eyes closed while walking with God in the cool of the day??????
" Joh 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son which is in the bosom of the Father he hath declared him. "
" Gen 3:8 And they heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God amongst the trees of the garden. Gen 3:9 And the LORD God called unto Adam and said unto him Where art thou?

Adams genealogy creates and poem that points to Christ! Divine no accident.

Hebrew - English
Adam = Man
Seth =Appointed
Enosh= Mortal
Kenan= Sorrow;
Mahalalel = The Blessed God
Jared = Shall come down
Enoch = Teaching
Methuselah = His death shall bring
Lamech = The Despairing
Noah = Rest, or comfort.

Man (is) appointed mortal sorrow; (but) the Blessed God shall come down teaching (that) His death shall bring (the) despairing rest.
Debate Round No. 2
1970vu

Pro

1. 'Adam sinned or paid the price for Eve, because in her womb was Noah, Abraham, David and the 12 tribes and Christ Himself=Adam's way to return virgin born.' How can a man who sinned himself pay the price for another sinner? For Christ is sinless! You point out 1Ti 2: 13-14 to prove your point. Notice that the previous verses talks about the submission of woman:

11 A woman[a] should learn in quietness and full submission. 12 I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man;[b] she must be quiet. 1 Timothy 2: 11-12

2. Adam did not get the breath of God.Adam got the breath of life. You point out that God created man in his own Image. What does it mean?
We are made to look like god. But we are not god. Now of course Adam was immortal but because he ate that fruit, he was kicked out.

3. If we take a look at your verses, It does not mention Adam. Now if Adam was that important, he would be mentioned by the early church fathers and the Popes and the Preachers and even Martin Luther.
telisw37

Con

The same Popes who hide secret knowledge in special safes. The same religion who disobeyed God in marriage. But has gay sex with children. Who now says Atheist /Gays are OK. Notice no biblical base in my opponents arguments. My bible says to study and show your self approved a workman who can rightly divide the word of truth. Not wait for the Pope to preach.
Debate Round No. 3
1970vu

Pro

I forfeit. I realize that I am not a big expert on the Holy word Of God. But you say that to you went to Theology school. You are right. I babble alot. Good bye.
telisw37

Con

The same Popes who hide secret knowledge in special safes. The same religion who disobeyed God in marriage. But has gay sex with children. Who now says Atheist /Gays are OK. Notice no biblical base in my opponents arguments. My bible says to study and show your self approved a workman who can rightly divide the word of truth. Not wait for the Pope to preach.
Debate Round No. 4
1970vu

Pro

Again I forfeit. You win.
telisw37

Con

Smart man.
Debate Round No. 5
22 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by telisw37 3 years ago
telisw37
please view and comment on my new debate. I will never stop!
Posted by OtakuJordan 3 years ago
OtakuJordan
I never said that Mormonism was correct, so going off on a tangent about how it isn't is just another display of your total ignorance.
Posted by telisw37 3 years ago
telisw37
" Jam 1:8 A double minded man is unstable in all his ways. "
On the first page of the Mormon bible it say's ANOTHER TESTAMENT OF JESUS CHRIST.
Rom_15:20, Yea, so have I strived to preach the gospel, not where Christ was named, lest I should build upon another man's foundation:
2Co_10:16, To preach the gospel in the regions be)yond you, and not to boast in another man's line of things made ready to our hand.
2Co_11:4, For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.
Christians and Mormons serve another Christ. Not the one in the bible but you will babble on!
Rev_1:8, I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is,(ROOT OF DAVID ON THE THRONE NOW!) and which was,(WAS IN EDEN THE GARDEN OF GOD and which is to come,(TO RESTORE EDEN DUH???????) the Almighty.
Act_17:18, Then certain philosophers of the Epicureans, and of the Stoicks, encountered him. And some said, What will this babbler say? other some, He seemeth to be a setter forth of strange gods: because he preached unto them Jesus, and the resurrection.
Posted by OtakuJordan 3 years ago
OtakuJordan
Umm... black people can be Mormon too. http://en.wikipedia.org...

Every time you try to insult someone you just make yourself look even less intelligent. I love it.
Posted by telisw37 3 years ago
telisw37
Yes more foolishness. I just showed you the leaven of the bible. A black Mormon? Duh? All religions have a little truth. Your False Christian religion babbles that Gen.1;26 refers to Adam and not the Hosts of people created and not formed. Gen 2:7 was is Adam who was formed to til. Bible fact. I see you as Antichrist.
Rom_1:20, For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
Rom_1:21, Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

Rom_1:22, Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
Rom_1:23, And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
Rom_1:24, Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
Rom_1:25, Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
Posted by OtakuJordan 3 years ago
OtakuJordan
@Fluffy I am guessing Telis is a Mormon. Joseph Smith was the originator of the Adam-God doctrine.
Posted by FluffyCactus 3 years ago
FluffyCactus
@telisw37 "But you are the same guy that say's the bible is full of errors. Did your Protestant Pastor teach you that? Why debate the bible if you think it is wrong?"
I don't think he is debating the bible, but rather the implied interpretation of it that you present. The scriptures aren't so clear as you seem to think it is, because your arguments make zero sense.
Posted by FluffyCactus 3 years ago
FluffyCactus
Is this guy even Christian? @telisw37 what is your denomination?
I've never ever heard anyone say that Adam was God, so I thought it was an interesting debate topic. I was even more suprised that the Instigator was Pro Adam not being God. This surprised me because I thought that the topic was odd enough that only someone who thought that Adam was God would want to prove it. It was even more odd that someone actually Contended and accepted the Debate... Out of sheer curiosity I read the debate arguments.. And I quite thoroughly think that Con is a quack. Even in my days of excessive evangelistic fundamental creationism, where I touted ridiculous claims against the Catholic church for being the Harlot of Revelations, I don't think that even I was so crazy as this. I mean, who in their right minds reads Genesis and thinks: "Oh yeah, this guy here is definitely God." I mean, I think there is a reason why the tradition calls Christ the Second Adam, but it isn't because he actually is Adam.. I mean, Adam messed up. Christ didn't. This is what happens I guess when we don't read scripture within a properly informed tradition.
Posted by 1970vu 3 years ago
1970vu
This debate is done. If you want to argue, go have another debate.
Posted by telisw37 3 years ago
telisw37
Actually 99.9% of all religions serve Antichrist in ignorance. Just as the bible says.
There Jesus was not here in the beginning in the flesh. Their Jesus appeared in Mary. Adam died for his crime. He returned via baby virgin born is the story of the bible. Not religions. And remained sinless. He died on the cross to pay the price. I accept the deal.
1Jo_2:18, Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
1Jo_2:22, Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
1Jo_4:3, And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
2Jo_1:7, For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by OtakuJordan 3 years ago
OtakuJordan
1970vutelisw37Tied
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Total points awarded:20 
Reasons for voting decision: Conduct to Pro because Con was condescending after Pro humbly forfeited. Also, Con attacked Pro's Catholic faith. I don't know why Pro forfeited. All of his arguments were pretty much destroying Con's. I tied args because of this. S&G clearly go to Pro.
Vote Placed by Buckethead31594 3 years ago
Buckethead31594
1970vutelisw37Tied
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Total points awarded:41 
Reasons for voting decision: Conduct points to Con for Pro's forfeit. Although, I will give Pro points for grammar due to Con's sloppy presentation. Arguments to Pro because Con did not even refute Pro's rebuttals in round 3; also, he lazily copied his response and used it in round 4, again. Normally I would never up-vote a concession, but Pro seemed to have conceded due to Con's inability to accept he was wrong.