The Instigator
Skeptic111
Con (against)
Winning
3 Points
The Contender
lefillegal1
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points

All people are Created Equal

Do you like this debate?NoYes+0
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 1 vote the winner is...
Skeptic111
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/26/2014 Category: Philosophy
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 3,362 times Debate No: 44644
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (3)
Votes (1)

 

Skeptic111

Con

I will propose the argument that All People are Not created Equal. There are inherent and fundamental differences between people of different ethnic backgrounds. There are traits and racial tendencies which characterize races differently from each other. There are exceptions and great variety in all races of people, however the argument that all are equal is an Exception rather than a Rule, and it is untenable to base law on the exception rather than the rule. The majority of people of a certain ethnicity are predisposed to behavior characteristic of that ethnicity.
lefillegal1

Pro

I accept this debate and I will show that all people are created equal.
Debate Round No. 1
Skeptic111

Con

Argument:
If all races were equal, we would all be the same.
We would all look the same, and have the same thoughts, and act exactly the same way in every situation. The reality is there is great variety in appearance, intelligence, culture, behavior of people. I argue that we are created inherently different as individuals and among different races of peoples- not everybody is created equal.


for example, in Health:
Some races are prone to heart disease and diabetes- and not others. Some races are immune to malaria and not others. Some races are resistant to certain virus and flu- while others are decimated by same illness.

www.patientnavigatortraining.org



Crime in the US:
"Blacks are seven times more likely than people of other races to commit murder, and eight times more likely to commit robbery.

When blacks commit crimes of violence, they are nearly three times more likely than non-blacks to use a gun, and more than twice as likely to use a knife.

Hispanics commit violent crimes at roughly three times the white rate, and Asians commit violent crimes at about one quarter the white rate.

The single best indicator of violent crime levels in an area is the percentage of the population that is black and Hispanic."
-www.colorofcrime.com

www.cga.ct.gov



Scholastic achievement/ intelligence:
average SAT verbal scores:
Whites- 535
Asians- 520
Hispanics- 450
Blacks- 430

www.dartblog.com


Athletic Ability:
According to racial equality activist Richard Lapchick, the NBA in 2011 was composed of 83 percent non-white players, including 78 percent black, four percent Latino, and one percent Asian; 17 percent of the players were white.[2] The league had the highest percentage of black players of any major professional sports leagues in the United States and Canada.[3]
lefillegal1

Pro

First and foremost All people are "created" when the male's sperm has fertilized the female's egg. If you want to argue "born" equal, it still holds true. All babies are born dependant. Whether Sick or healthy, weak or strong, blind or not, deaf or not, rich or poor, and white or black. All babies depend on help when they are born. No human baby is born independent. They all need some sort of nurturing from an outside source. No newborn can feed themselves. The fact that all babies are born dependant proves all men are created equal, no matter which way you slice it. "Born equal" is different than being born in "equality", as I have shown. You seem to intertwine the two in your arguments, which I shall now refute.

"If all races were equal, we would all be the same.We would all look the same, and have the same thoughts, and act exactly the same way in every situation."

Prove it. By that logic then all people of "one" race would ALL have to look, think and act the same. This is not true for any "one" race so, it cant be true for "all".

"I argue that we are created inherently different as individuals and among different races of peoples- not everybody is created equal."

I believe I've shown that even as individuals, were are "created" the same and or "born" the same. What you are really arguing is "equality".

"for example, in Health: Some races are prone to heart disease and diabetes- and not others. Some races are immune to malaria and not others. Some races are resistant to certain virus and flu- while others are decimated by same illness."

You realize this furthers my point dont you? Your example shows ALL races are susceptible to something. In the case of health, ALL men are susceptible to "death" equally.

"Crime in the US:"

Doent even include "All" men or "All" crime. So it has no bearings in your arguement. Although one look at "all" crime would show that no "one" race is without it, thus proving that ALL races are born with the "equal" capacity to commit crime or not. Thats not really serving "your" point now is it?

"Scholastic achievement/ intelligence:average SAT verbal scores: Whites- 535Asians- 520Hispanics- 450Blacks- 430"

Again proving my point. Although these arent "worldwide" stats, they obviously assume that "ALL" races are born with the "equal ability" to "learn". Isnt that what the stats are comparing? Thanks again for further proving my point.

"Athletic Ability:According to racial equality activist Richard Lapchick, the NBA in 2011 was composed of 83 percent non-white players, including 78 percent black, four percent Latino, and one percent Asian; 17 percent of the players were white.[2] The league had the highest percentage of black players of any major professional sports leagues in the United States and Canada.[3]"

And what of Hockey? Cricket? Water Polo? Lacrosse? Mens swimming? Volleyball? The point is ALL men dont play sports, and even the men who do play sports, dont play ALL sports. Again proving that ALL races have the "equal opportunity" to play any sport they choose.

My opponent has failed to provide any amount of evidence supporting his argument. As I have shown, all the evidence presented by my opponent thus far, has actually helped to prove MY point.
Debate Round No. 2
Skeptic111

Con

As stated in the opening commentaries- this debate is not about creation or how we are created, it is rather about whether all people are inherently equals. The title is used because it is a famous statement of the Declaration of Independence- that "all men are created equal."

Your central argument is that people are all equal because we are all made of egg and sperm, and we are all equally helpless at birth, we all have a capacity to learn, and that we all ultimately die. Your points boil down all human experience to the lowest common denominator.
This broad generalization does not strongly support the claim of human equality. By your argument we humans would also be perfectly equal to many thousands of other mammal species on earth.

In fact, your argument shows that there are only very few fleeting examples of equality among humans: Conception. Birth. And Death.
If these are the only ways in which humans are equal, I am not convinced, because it leaves out more than 99% of our lifetimes.

I've shown 3 examples of how races of people tend to be inequal.
The first example of Health shows that races have different tendencies toward disease and illness. Your response is that all humans get sick. Once again, this coarse argument would liken humans to nearly every other animal on earth that can get sick or diseased.

My second argument shows that different races have different tendencies in crime and violence. This has been noted all across the globe. Not only do statistics show more criminality and violence among certain people- it shows predictably where more crime and violence will occur. And it is this level of predictability which makes it all the more powerful an argument.
The third argument- athletics- takes a single sport- basketball- and shows how one racial group out of many possible, consistently dominates that sport. Whatever the particular skills and ability required of that sport, one racial group seems to have an inherent advantage over others. This holds true to more than one sport.

I think it is clear that statistics back the conclusion that in fact, "all people are not created equal". Individual traits vary within the same race, but each race has certain overall tendencies in behavior, health, intelligence, ability, criminality, violence, etc.... All factors which define humans throughout their lives.
lefillegal1

Pro

A279;in"her"ent\in-G2;hir-ənt, -G2;her-adjective:
"involved"in the"constitution"or essential"character"of"something": belonging"by"nature"or"habit": intrinsic" in"her"ent"ly"
adverb
Examples an"inherent"concept"of"justice Origin:"Latin"inhaerent-,"inhaerens, present"participle"of"inhaerēre"(see inhere").First"use:"1581 Synonyms:"built-in,"constitutional, constitutive,"essential,"hardwired, immanent,"inborn,"inbred, indigenous,"ingrain,"ingrained"(also engrained),"innate,"integral, intrinsic,"native,"natural,"in one's blood
fun"da"men"tal\G6;fən-də-G2;men-təladjective
1 a":"serving"as an"original"or generating"source":"primary""b":"serving"as a"basis"supporting existence"or"determining"essential structure"or"function":"basic
2 a":"of or"relating"to"essential structure,"function, or"facts":"radical ;"also":"of ordealing"with"general"principles rather"than"practical"application "b":"adhering"to"fundamentalism
3":"of,"relating"to, or"produced"by the"lowest"component"of a"complex vibration
4":"of"central"importance":"principal
5":"belonging"to one's"innate"oringrained"characteristics":"deep-rooted" synonyms"see"essential
"Con
I will propose the argument that All People are Not created Equal. There are inherent and fundamental differences between people of different ethnic backgrounds."
Have I not argued against "the basics"? Or does "inherent" and "fundamental" take on a different meaning now?
"Your points boil down all human experience to the lowest common denominator."
According to the definitions of " inherent" and "fundamental", why shouldnt it? The starting point should be "birth" which includes the "basics". You are now trying to argue the end results of the "basics". Example 1.No one born can just play basketball, or any sport for that matter. The "burden of proof" is on you to show that we are first" basically programmed to play ANY sport. You seem to believe that if a majority of people choose one thing then they must be born to do it. Thats wrong because a majority of people can choose to fly but none were born to do it. Even if the NBA were all black, you would still have to prove that, ALL other races; and every single individual of that race, tried to play basketball AND that they ALL were inferior to black people in terms of basketball. Good luck with that one.
Example 2 Violence is violence. If all crime were actually recorded you would see that invading europeans are actually the most violent of all races. No one recorded the countless crimes commited towards slaves, indians, and hispanics by the hands of "Americans". Nor the lives lost to Hitler and his regimes. Nor Alexander the Great. Again no race is without these atrocities, putting us all on an even playing field as far as violence is concerned.
Example 3 We all die. Youre attacking straw men when you argue the "how" and "why". The actual argument is are we "equal". As long as we all die, then our individual health serves no advantage and obviously has no bearing on the end result. Which happens to be death. Your argument could now only be "quality" of life, and even still "quality" must be defined. Either way it has no bearing in your initial argument.
"By your argument we humans would also be perfectly equal to many thousands of other mammal species on earth."
Is not man a mammal? Although im not arguing for the equality of mammals this does nothing to refute my statement that "all men are born equal" .
"This broad generalization does not strongly support the claim of human equality."
Isnt "humanity" itself, a "broad generalization? Why even call this into question? Another "straw man" attempt perhaps.
"I've shown 3 examples of how races of people tend to be inequal."
No, youve shown examples of how races tend to CHOOSE differently. People choose sports. Sports dont choose people. Youve shown examples of how races CHOOSE which form of violence to partake in. And youve shown how different races CHOOSE to handle death. Being born susceptible to Malaria means nothing if you never contract Malaria.
""Your response is that all humans get sick. Once again, this coarse argument would liken humans to nearly every other animal on earth that can get sick or diseased."
It ALSO likens every human to humans, but I guess youre purposely ignoring that fact.
"My second argument shows that different races have different tendencies in crime and violence"
No, YOUR second argument shows the "stats" in the U S.A. but the "stats" on ALL crimes and violence reveal that ALL races have an equal propensity towards violence.
"The third argument- athletics- takes a single sport- basketball- and shows how one racial group out of many possible, consistently dominates that sport. Whatever the particular skills and ability required of that sport, one racial group seems to have an inherent advantage over others."
"Seems" to have an advantage is not the same as "has an advantage". And you have yet to prove "what" that "advantage" is, nor that the "advantage" itself is inherent in any race.
"I think it is clear that statistics back the conclusion that in fact, "all people are not created equal".""
Think again! Even YOUR "stats" can be shown to "back" otherwise. As I have shown.
""all people are not created equal". Individual traits vary within the same race, but each race has certain overall tendencies in behavior, health, intelligence, ability, criminality, violence, etc.... All factors which define humans throughout their lives."
And therein lies your problem, "ALL factors" can not be "factored" when speaking of "created". Simply because in this argument, created refers to beginning or start. Some of those "factors" are not there in the start, so they have no grounds in your argument. Until you can prove all the factors are indeed present at the start, you havent refuted any of my statements. You have only offered the opinion that my statements " boil down all human experience to the lowest common denominator." Which by the way, is where one must start if speaking of "equality". For to start with anything other than the "lowest common denominator" could not be considered starting "equally", so to speak. (My math teachers are ashamed of that statement, lol)
Debate Round No. 3
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by Skeptic111 3 years ago
Skeptic111
Lefillegal1- thank you for accepting this debate.
Posted by Skeptic111 3 years ago
Skeptic111
Thank you for your comment... You are quite right in your point that there is included in that statement an assumption of being "created"... However, I would like to retain the title for the argument's sake, for the reason that it is a historical statement, which is in our founding documents and remains today, and has widespread acceptance. Perhaps it would be possible to debate separately the idea of creation. Perhaps a better expression of the intent is "All people are Inherently Equal". thanks
Posted by MasterDebater2 3 years ago
MasterDebater2
There's two debates into one on this one, first off are all people equal? Secondly were we created?

The debate title should read: "All people are equal" or "Humans were created"
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by Josh_b 3 years ago
Josh_b
Skeptic111lefillegal1Tied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:30 
Reasons for voting decision: I am going with con on this one. Pro tries to prove that all men are equally created, not all men are created equal. Despite con's considerable racism, the lack of equal athletic abilities proves his side as true within and between races.