Allow illegal immigrants amnesty.
Debate Rounds (4)
First, what is illegal immigration?
Illegal immigration is the migration of people across national borders, or the residence of foreign nationals in a country, in a way that is illegal according to the immigration laws of the destination country.
There are two types of immigration in the United States as of March 2014.
The first type is family immigration. The second type is permanent/temporary immigration.
There is actually a section about illegal immigrants coming from different countries. We currently let in around 70,000 immigrants each year from different countries. This is mainly because of persecution in their birth country.
Now, imagine that you are a child in ____(insert country here). Bloody battles ensue, you are getting persecuted, and your parents don't have any money. Life is terrible in this country, and you think that going to the United States would be the best option. You flee there, and just as you get there you aren't allowed. Are you supposed to go back to your country now and face more persecution?
I honestly see nothing wrong with immigration. They aren't doing it illegally because there are specific instructions congress has set up for refugees fleeing their homes. They can have just as much success and will hopefully get a job and grow up happily.
I'm interested in how my opponent will respond.
Now. What you said about illegal immigration is what most people think right away when defending illegal immigration. I will give you a list of reasons why making "refugees" as you call them, amnesty is completely wrong if you just think about it.
First off, I would LOVE to say to all the poor and oppressed in the world "Come to America and live a better life!" The sad truth is that we cannot. The more illegal inmigrants that come to the Unites States and obtain a residency by the government keeps the cycle going. If foreign nations see that they can cross our border without getting caught and become a residence ten years later, then this creates a magnet effect. More will come. More will see the opportunity. The United States is a great place to live and that is why so many people are trying to come here.
Secondly. This magnet effect will keep millions of immigrants crossing the borders which means millions more to care for, feed, and help. We will need to do all of these things because illegal immigrants who come here are most likely not millionaires. They are poor or oppressed victims. Like I said, I would LOVE TO help all the poor and vulnerable in the world! But if all of the world saw that we just let anyone across our borders, then what stops them from doing the same? We have to stop the cycle.
Thirdly. We have legal immigration for a reason! So we can keep new hardworking Americans coming from different countries from all race, ethnicity, and religions. The more different the better! According to http://www.dhs.gov... we had about 500,000 new immigrants come to the United States legally in 2013. This is great. We can keep America diverse and new by letting legal immigrants come.
You said "I honestly see nothing wrong with immigration. They arnt't doing it illegally because there are specific instructions Congress has set up for refugees fleeing their homes. " This is incorrect. This is what the laws of the United States say about people fleeing their countries to come to the United States: "Immigrants can be classified as illegal for one of three reasons: entering without authorization or inspection, staying beyond the authorized period after legal entry, or violating the terms of legal entry. Section 1325 in Title 8 of the United States Code, "Improper entry of alien", provides for a fine, imprisonment, or both for any noncitizen who:" This is from wikipedia that cites lines from the United States Constitution and laws. Go to the wiki page to see that they used sources to find this all out. http://en.m.wikipedia.org... It is in the "Legal Issues" section.
To sum everything up I must say you made a good first attempt, but I need more than just emotional feelings for the poor and oppressed. We all wish we could help the world, but there must be a limit. We cannot care for everyone, that is a simple fact. Legal immigration still continues so there is no need to block down our borders from everyone. After all, we are all immigrants to the United States in the first place.
I really don't see how stopping the whole cycle would be a good thing"
Just because we have people illegally entering our country, we have to take it away and spoil it for other people that are trying to enter for valid reasons? Maybe we should propose stronger border laws for illegal immigrants instead of taking the whole thing away. If there was some sort of system where children and adults that felt threatened in their country to send some kind of form into the government" because technically you do need a visa/refugee status when entering the United States. I don't know whether it's fear or lack of time that keeps them from getting a visa or a refugee status but our immigration system is very complicated.
I don't think the whole "magnet" idea is going to get as extreme as you propose. The whole world is not made up of terror-struck and third world countries. There are millions of people who are happy where they are. Unfortunately, most people in third world countries probably won't even be able to make it to the United States because they are so far away. Most illegal immigrants are from Mexico because they are close enough to cross the border.
When you say "you can't help everyone" that's true. We can't individually help each person that enters the United States, but we can at least let them enter. I feel like you were just wording your statement as another way of saying "we don't have enough room". Forgive me if I am wrong, but that is the kind of feeling I'm getting.
There is enough room for these people in the United States. That is a given. Millions of children are being born right this very second, and unfortunately, there are people dying this very second in the United States. We have room for them! Granted, these children are being born into families that will hopefully keep them in their home and won't live on the streets.
You prove a very good argument, and I do feel myself losing already (this is my first debate so this was kind of "testing the waters" for me).
Just to kind of clear this up, are you proposing that we don't let illegal immigrants into the United States? When they show up at the border, we just make them return to their country?
If that is the case, I think that we should have them fill out necessary paperwork in a safe place so they don't have to return to their country. We can see if they are really fleeing for valid reasons, and then we can let them in. Thanks :)
You continue to talk about that we need to help the threatened and oppressed people from other countries. You are truly talking from the heart. Your heart tells you that we must and need to help all of the people that we possibly can. Once again we cannot.
You said "I don't think the whole"magnet" idea is going to get as extreme as you propose". It has. look at this chart. http://www.pewhispanic.org.... Not only does it show a steady increase in illegal immigration, but this is the America with illegal immigration laws. Imagine what would happen if we showed that we grant amnesty to the millions, then millions more would come.
You then stated, "The whole world is not made up of terror-struck and third world countries. There are millions of people who are happy where they are. Unfortunately, most people in third world countries probably won't even be able to make it...". I would like you to scroll down on this website here http://www.globalissues.org.... It states that almost 3 billion people and counting live in poverty. What you stated is simply not true. There are 2.2 billion children in the world. 1 billion children are currently in poverty. 640 million have inadequate shelter. 400 million have no access to safe water. 270 million have no access to health services. Those facts are just out of the 2.2 billion children in the world. Since you said that they will not be able to come to the United States easily because they live too far away here are more facts. http://m.huffpost.com.... 45.5 percent of Mexicans are in poverty. That is 45.5 percent of 122.3 million, which is the population it was in 2013. Imagine this plus all the central American countries, South American, and others how many people in poverty live so close to the United States. Third world countries also are not in the best government controlled areas. A lot are dictatorships, or some sort of oppressive governments.
As I said before America is like a melting pot. What makes us a great nation is the cultural, ethnic, and religious diversity. That is why we still continue to have legal immigration. We do not have the money or resources to help the millions. We are barely getting out of a recession as it is right now. Having room is not the problem. There is room, but not the money or resources.
This is my second debate on this website, but I love debating these topics with my friends and family, but I appreciate you accepting this debate once again. It keeps me on my toes.
My solution to illegal immigration is to prevent it from happening in the first place. That is the best solution. Having a better border security is essential to any country, including the United States.
Yes, we have legal immigration" so what are we going to do with the 70,000 kids that Congress has allowed to enter the country because of persecution in their country. Are we just going to pick and choose which ones are just going to come in?
You're right about not having any money (though I'm not going to go into blaming any particular president) but we are slowly creating more jobs.
Barack Obama in his latest term ~ 1.8% increase
Read article here: http://en.wikipedia.org...
The goal is that we will be able to house more and more people because there will be enough jobs. It will be a slow process, but hopefully we'll make it. If you just cut illegal immigration entirely, yes it will be helping stop people trying to cross our borders for bad reasons but it's also shutting out millions of children and adults who are fleeing for actual reasons (like persecution)
(I can feel myself parroting what I've said in previous topics, I'm a bit of a broken record on this topic now, forgive me)
You saying that makes my point clearer. You cannot decide something based off of what you feel. You have to lookdeeper than that.
Once again, my solution to illegal immigrants is to keep them out in the first place. We cannot grant them amnesty now or this will create that "magnet effect" I talked about earlier. We simply cannot do that.
"You're right about not having any money"
"The goal is that we will be able to house more and more people because there will be enough jobs"
I would hope that would be our goal. What you are looking for is a utopian society, a perfect society that accepts all and becomes this 'perfect society'. All utopian societies have failed. We cannot become some sort of caregivers to millions that illegally come to the United States. We have laws for a reason. Legal immigrants, come on in.
Thank you for participating in this debate. Good luck on the results.
A perfect utopian society is not perfect, but it's something we can aim for.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by a_drumming_dog 2 years ago
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Reasons for voting decision: Conduct goes to Con because Pro muffed the acceptance. I feel that Con had the stronger argument. Pro was not successful in rebutting it. Pro didn't provide a lot of evidence to support their views, and also conceded to Con in the last round.
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