The Instigator
Pro (for)
0 Points
The Contender
Con (against)
4 Points

American Ex-patriots, traitors or geniuses?

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Post Voting Period
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after 2 votes the winner is...
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 6/30/2013 Category: Politics
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,075 times Debate No: 35184
Debate Rounds (2)
Comments (1)
Votes (2)




This debate is about if ex-pats are right or wrong for leaving the U.S. To live out there lives in European countries.
I will be debating Pro, that they are making the right choice. My opponent will be debating Con, that they are wrong.

Ex-pats are making the right decision by leaving this country to live out their lives in European Countries because of the many superior aspects of some European countries. These include a much more diverse culture (due to the large number of countries in one are, many of which had colonies which add to the diversity), guaranteed government health care, and generally more liberal policies. In the next 15 to 20 years it is more than likely that an increasing number of young Americans will move to European countries such as the U.K. Though some will move due to various things in pop culture, many more will move due to the great number of opportunities and better policies than in America. I feel so passionate about this issue because, as George Carlin would say, have reached the age of reason. As soon as I finish my college education I plan to say my final goodbyes and leave this country behind, which is why for the time being I'm saving all the money I can to make it happen because since the U.S. dollar has low value you don't get as much when exchanging currency.


Good evening sir, I graciously accept your challenge :
I see 2 points of argument as to why you claim ex-pats are making the correct decision:
1. Diversity of culture
2. Economic purposes (Opportunities)

1. Diversity of Culture
My opponent makes the claim that the United Kingdom/European nations are superior in their cultural diversity. I can't stand against that, as the value of a certain culture is subjective to one's own opinion. While my opponent may enjoy French culture, I have a love of Hispanic (specifically Mexican) culture. I would like to point out that the United States contains many hubs of cultural diversity (New York, NY Portland, OR Seattle, WA, San Francisco, CA, Miami, FL). Ex-pats would be wise to consider other states than just "Throwing out the baby with the bath water."

2. Economic Opportunities
Secondly, my opponent states that "[Ex-pats] will move due to the great number of opportunities and better policies than in America." I will assume we are referencing the Eurozone. Before ex-pats expect such incredible opportunity, it is first necessary to study the current economic conditions of the Eurozone:
An average 12.1% jobless rate and 24% youth unemployment rate is not considered "opportunistic" (1).

Furthering my point, let us magnify the United Kingdom: Their regressive VAT tax has wrecked havoc upon the poorest 20% of households (2). U.K. business also struggle under liberal policy, bearing 30% of all taxes paid:

Ex-pats should consider this rather alarming. This is no way to run a country. Entrepreneurship will most likely not provide such a lucrative life. VAT taxes have beaten the poorest, people cannot thrive like this.

Forgive me, I've ran out of characters. I'd like to make the case for the U.S.'s better opportunities compared to the Eurozone for potential ex-pats next round.

Debate Round No. 1


As we discussed in the first round, culture is all a matter of preference; so while some may prefer the refined, diverse culture of Europe. Others prefer the diverse but less refined culture of America.

Though you do make a point about the struggling Euro and economy, keep in mind much of the European economic downturn was caused by the banks and stock market in the U.S. By saying opportunities I was talking about the fact that non-liberal arts majors will have a easier time finding jobs in Europe because of the abundance of liberal arts majors in Europe. I was referring to the policies on things such as same sex marriage and government health care. 17 European countries provide universal health care and less than 6 in Europe do not. Also, of the 15 countries which have legalized gay marriage, 9 of them are in Europe.

The U.K.'s Value Added Tax was put in place by the conservative party shortly before Thatcher came into office, causing as much permanent damage to the U.K. as Reagan did to the U.S. But, like in America and most other countries money rules the government protecting the rich and hurting the hard working middle and lower class.

Gay marriage:
Universal health care:


Respectfully, why is Europe a better place to live because a downturn began in the United States? This seems irrelevant. If an economy (the Eurozone) were as spectacular and opportunistic as my opponent displays it to be, why is it struggling in employment after five years, while the United States is making leaps and bounds(1)? Opportunities for ex-pats in the EU are non-existent.

My opponent, in the first round, stated the U.S. dollar is becoming lack luster; however, he must observe the Euro is currently stagnant. It is struggling amidst the debt crisis Europe is struggling through(2). While on the topic of debt, several culturally refined countries my opponent may refer to like Spain, Greece, and potentially Italy, are currently requesting bailout money to save their governments. I must state that while healthcare and lavish social programs sound lovely, "there's no such thing as a free lunch." The people of Greece are learning this lesson sadly in cruel fashion.

Evidence displays that ex-pats would fare better in the United States, where capital is rather cheap and entrepreneurship is not just a goal, but practically an expectation for such a dynamic economy. As far as gay marriage, the United States is a Federal Republic, some states (an increasing number I must report) already allow such unions. Again, we run into the problem of "throwing the baby out of the bathwater" if gay marriage rights are the sole purpose of ex-pats leaving the U.S.

Finally, it does not matter who instated the VAT tax. My opponent and I are debating whether potential ex-pats should leave, or stay. Ex-pats should be concerned about the tax existence, *not* the history of the tax. The fact is:it's in place and damaging lower end households.

Debate Round No. 2
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by ararmer1919 3 years ago
I feel sorry for pro when he moves to the UK and gets his reality check. Just so you know pro, the grass isn't always greener on the other side.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by Guy_D 3 years ago
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Reasons for voting decision: Just wasted five minutes reading this poorly structured debate. There are many problems in the arguments. Title: "traitors or geniuses" = nonsensical, what does it really mean?. Nobody seriously talked to the topic. Blaming America for the world's problems as Pro did has nothing to do with the topic. Moving to a country where there is less opportunity is really dumb. If all Pro wants to do is sit at an out door cafe so he can feel the superior "diversity"? lol. Well... It doesn't make you a traitor, and it most certainly doesn't make you a geniuses.
Vote Placed by gordonjames 3 years ago
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: PRO missed many points (like taxation of ex-pats bu US government without representation)