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The Contender
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0 Points

Baltic War Debate

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Post Voting Period
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after 4 votes the winner is...
Voting Style: Open Point System: Select Winner
Started: 5/15/2015 Category: Entertainment
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,050 times Debate No: 75328
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (50)
Votes (4)





This is a war debate. It is impossible to accept this debate. If you want to accept, please send me a PM. If you somehow find a way to accept this debate, you will automatically forfeit the complete 7 points. Tell me what country you will represent, what your WMD will be (refer to the below list), and tell me why I should choose you to be my opponent; give me a very good reason as to why you want to do this debate and why you would be a worthy opponent. I am Sweden. Comment if you are interested. If you want to debate, message me.

If you are a member of the Art of War (AOW) debate group [created by @The-Voice-of-Truth], then you must vote on this debate. If you are a member of AOW and accept this debate, then state your win/loss ratio.

If you are interested in joining AOW, message @TheRussian or @The-Voice-of-Truth. The primary prerequisite to join this group is: you have to have participated in AT LEAST ONE war debate. If you are a member of AOW, you must vote on other members' war debates unless a valid reason is given. You can challenge other members to debates related to war game scenarios.

There are some strict rules that apply. Voters must penalize any violation of the rules.

1. When you accept the debate, state your country, and state the numbers of your armed forces (aircraft, men, ships, etc.). Use this source for military numbers ONLY, as it is the most reliable:;

2. Each country's turn can range from about 3 days to 60 days long, so all actions must be in accordance with this time period. (DO NOT try to win in one turn! Take into account that your opponent is also a living, thinking being that can adapt to a situation.)

3. Morale is a key factor in your armed forces' effectiveness.

4. You may produce more military forces (soldiers, ships, aircraft, tanks/humvees/cavalry), but it depends on your military budget, your country's population, and how industrialized your nation is.

5. You may choose to invade or defend.

6. The defender makes the first move.

7. The defender's primary military objective is to remove the attacker's forces from the defender's territory. The attacker's primary military objective is to annex the other country, or destroy it (physically, economically, etc). Secondary military objectives can be made by the debaters if they wish. Fulfillment of the military objectives is victory. If either side fails to fulfill their set objectives, the voters are free to reasonably determine the winner based off of who was more successful in completing their objectives.

8. If a nation's capital is destroyed/liberated, this does not necessarily mean that the war is won; the capital could be recaptured. If one of the debaters destroys or controls the administration of the opposing country, OR if the opposing country is destroyed to the point of no administration, then that debater is immediately guaranteed a 7-point victory.

9. Every aspect of the war must be realistic and must remain within the parameters established by the rules and the title. Any unrealistic action and actions deviating from the rules will cause the entire action to be void. Any further deviation after the first void action will result in a complete debate forfeiture.

10. You can have ONLY ONE WMD (Chooses WMD). WMD is to be used as a last resort. It can only be used if there is an extreme threat to the nation or your army. IF a WMD is to be used, you MUST fully describe the effects of its use IN DETAIL. Every aspect of the WMD's effects MUST be correct and realistic.

Any unrealistic detail in the effects will cause the use of the weapon and ALL of its effects to become void, and there will be no "restocking" of the WMD. Once you use it, you have used it, whether or not the effects are void. At the beginning of the war, you MUST specify what country you are, what WMD you will use (and describing the weapon using the below rules in the weapons' list), and you must show what the entirety of your armed forces is made of (soldier count, tanks, artillery, ships, aircraft, etc.).

Specify what your WMD is going to be. Specify ALL measurements of the WMD (yield, range, parts-per-million, altitude, longitude, latitude, etc).

You may choose ONE weapon from the following list of WMDs:

- Nuclear Weapon: The blast yield must be 209.2 billion kilojoules (50 kilotons of TNT) or LESS. You MUST specify type of detonation (underground/collapse, ground/shock, airburst/dust).
You MUST specify the location of the detonation (longitude, latitude, altitude. Also name the country, province/state, and city of detonation).

- Chemical: Maximum 15 parts-per-million. Specify chemical type. Nerve agents ARE allowed, but only one can be used.

- MOAB/FOAB: Must be used in the unconventional manner. If an MOAB/FOAB is detonated above ground and at an altitude, it has the effects of a tactical nuclear weapon (thus classifying it as a WMD) without the radiation. MUST specify location of the detonation (longitude, latitude, altitude. Also name country, province/state, and city of detonation). Note: If an MOAB/FOAB is used in a conventional manner, then it is NOT classified as a WMD.

Biological and radiological weapons are NOT allowed.

11. No allies (NATO, UN, Muslim Brotherhood, or otherwise) under ANY circumstances. Annexation of other countries or agreements that allow formations of larger nations and/or direct military intervention is NOT alloother than what is specified. You cannot receive donations or economic support from private agencies.

12. Cyberwarfare is allowed. Electronic warfare is limited to radar/radio jamming and interception; NO EMPs.

13. The country chosen must be one of the 206 sovereign states recognized by the United Nations as of 2015. Former states such as the USSR are not accepted, nor are territory-controlling factions not officially recognized by the United Nations, such as the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL, currently the Islamic State), and Gaza Strip, controlled by Hamas, but recognized by the UN as a part of Palestine. You cannot choose my nation.

14. Appropriate conduct MUST be maintained: no insults, cursing, profanity, vulgar language or trolling. Any violation of appropriate conduct WILL BE REPORTED to DDO authorities.

15. If you fail to follow the rules once, you will be given a warning and your actions in that round will be void. Further disobedience of ANY of these rules WILL result in an immediate loss of the debate.

16. The Instigator is Pro.

17. These debates are strictly Force versus Force; no civilian action is allowed unless Total War is declared.

18. TOTAL WAR can be declared only after the use of WMDs. Total war is defined as the complete mobilization of all available manpower of the country. In a state of total war, every able citizen either joins the military personnel or the military labor workforce.

19. All scenarios MUST be realistic; there MUST be an established reason for conflict.

20. We may either follow the date-time storyline format, or state the events that occur directly as realistically possible in a period of 60


Okay, this should be fun!

Here are my numbers

Total Population: 38,346,279
Available Manpower: 18,830,448
Fit for Service: 15,583,917
Reaching Military Age Annually: 433,061]
Active Frontline Personnel: 120,000
Active Reserve Personnel: 515,000

Tanks: 1,009
Armored Fighting Vehicles (AFVs): 2,608
Self-Propelled Guns (SPGs): 443
Towed-Artillery: 72
Multiple-Launch Rocket Systems (MLRSs): 240

Total Aircraft: 467
Fighters/Interceptors: 99
Fixed-Wing Attack Aircraft: 99
Transport Aircraft: 263
Trainer Aircraft: 76
Helicopters: 255
Attack Helicopters: 29

Total Naval Strength: 83
Aircraft Carriers: 0
Frigates: 2
Destroyers: 0
Corvettes: 1
Submarines: 5
Coastal Defense Craft: 3
Mine Warfare: 24

Oil Production: 34,200 bbl/day
Oil Consumption: 580,000 bbl/day]
Proven Oil Reserves: 156,500,000 bbl/day

Labor Force: 18,220,000
Merchant Marine Strength: 9]
Major Ports and Terminals: 4
Roadway Coverage: 423,997
Railway Coverage: 19,428
Serviceable Airports: 126

Defense Budget: $9,360,000,000
External Debt: $365,200,000,000
Reserves of Foreign Exchange and Gold: $107,800,000,000
Purchasing Power Parity: $814,000,000,000

Square Land Area: 312,685 km
Coastline: 440 km
Shared Border: 2,845 km
Waterways: 3,997 km

I will take the defensive here in this war

my WMD is VX nerve gas 15 parts-per-million

May 16th: Tensions flare up between Poland and Sweden over territorial boundaries regarding the seas

May 17th: Relations further deteriorate when both sides send in their navies to force the other to accept a boundry

May 19th: A Swedish trade merchant ship is sunk in disputed waters, Sweden blames Poland. Sweden demands payment and an apology

May 20th: Poland refuses. Tensions are high

May 22nd: NATO realizing that a war between two countries near Russia could encourage further Russian aggression offer's to mediate the dispute.

May 24th: Both sides refuse outside help. Poland begins defensive preparations in case of an invasion. They lay a defensive minefield near there coastline, splits their navy up at several ports along the border, and starts basic mobilization

May 25th: Sweden angered by Polish mobilization and pressured by internal calls to war declares war against Poland.

May 26th: Many countries declare neutrality. Poland scrambles their air force, ramps up fighter and tank production, as well as small arms. Poland also starts cyber warfare. They start to fortify the northern coast with 80k men and 800 tanks. They also start to place anti air guns and anti naval missiles behind the fortified lines. Poland also starts a propaganda campaign in order to bolster voluntary enlistment.

I'm currently holding back the rest of my forces to deploy as I see fit.

I'm going to stop here and allow you to respond.

Good luck
Debate Round No. 1


My WMD is 1000 mosquitos infected with Yellow Fever.

May 27th Sweden relises that he had better read up on the Art of War.

May 28th Sweden pays Russia 40 million to not sell natural gas and oil. This accompanied by a promise of buisness.

May 29th Sweden calls up the reserves and begins instituting propaganda posters.

June 1st Sweden pays Germany to cut off Polish border and to allow Swedish troops into the country. It is payed 20 million. 5 million is payed to slovenia, czech republic, Bulgaria, and Ukrain for the same reason. Production on boats and tanks begins.

June 3rd Sweden sends a fleet of all of its ships except for its coastal defense craft and begins to smash Poland's fleet.

July 5th Poland has lost 4 submarines 1 frigate 1 corvette and 65 other ships. Sweden lost 3 submarines no frigates 3 corettes and 25 other ships. The rememnts of Polands navy is bottled up in Gdansk by 100 Swedish ships.

July 6th 40 tanks have rolled off the line. Artillery is purchased from Russia. Sweden gets 40 towed arillery for 40 million. 50 attack aircraft is purchased for 100 million.

July 7th 10,000 men have joined up. Sweden makes a deal with Estonia to allow planes to fly there.

July 8th Sweden makes constant air raids upon fire stations in Warsaw.

July 9th Bat bomb detonated in Warsaw, the city has been burned to the ground with 93% of all buildings destroyed. Morale plummets for Poland. Sweden has an influx of enlistment. It now has an army of 70,000

July 10th under cover of 50 planes the full Swedish navy attacks Gdansk. All but three Polish boats are smashed, and 18 airplanes destroyed. The lone submarine escapes but is being pursued. Sweden looses 21 planes and 14 boats.

July 14th All Poland ports are mined and a blockade, backed up by Swedens air surrounds Poland's coast. 40 tanks and 4 boats have rolled off the line.

No land battles only sea and air battles. Your capital is destroyed our air is superiour and you cannot get natural gas or oil. Good luck winning without a fleet.


Sorry, i just do not have enough time at the moment to respond, i would like to request my opponent to pass this round in order to allow me to respond. I terribly sorry about this, i just have a lot of things going on at the moment.
Debate Round No. 2


Umm ok. Sure. I pass this round.


Thanks for passing that round, i actually was really sick and unable to do anything.

Now, on to my response

I am going to say that the use of the bat bomb was improper, as while incendiary weapons are useful, they wouldn't destroy a city . Besides, i have a much larger and better trained air force, how did you manage to make constant air raids on my capital if my air force is scrambled to deal with any threat. Therefore, i am going to void the bombings and air raids on my capital.

July 15th: Poland realizes that that this war can only be won once the skies are captured. Poland sends a request to the United States to allow for Polish manufacture of the F-16 fighter jet. As Poland already as several in it's inventory, the United states agrees on the terms that Poland ends construction once the war is over, and does not export any built. Poland accepts this pays 500 million dollar to the United States.

July 16th: Poland shifts their manufacturing focus from tanks to aircraft. Poland also signs an agreement with Denmark and Norway to station military in their countries. Poland pays both nations 300 million each for this.

July 17th: Poland launches operation Blind man Gambit. Phase 1 Polish cyber warfare teams break into Swedish radar and starts broadcasting false signals and attacks. (I started my attacks on may 26th) Sweden is completely unaware, and deploys their air force to what seems to be an easy target of Polish cargo planes.

July 18th 6 am: Phase 2: As the Swedish air force is distracted, Poland launches a massive offensive, sending 80% of their fighters and bombers (200) to Sweden.

July 18th 11 am: Phase 3: in order to break the morale of Sweden, Poland begins massive bombing campaigns on Swedish cities near the coast, targeting Halmstad, Goteborg, and Malmo. Civilian causalities are over 300,000.

July 18th 5pm: Polish planes head back to Denmark. They are intercepted by vengeful Swedish planes who are now back in position to deal serious damage. In their assault, I lose 50 planes, and Sweden loses 22 planes.

July 20th: In order to prevent Sweden from regaining the ability to use of Radar, Poland places a numerous amount of malware, trojans and viruses on Swedish radar. It'll be months before Sweden regains control. Poland now turns their cyber attacks to the Swedish electrical grid.

I only fought air battler, but i took an offensive against you in order to bring pressure off of my sea border. Every city now has detachments of AA guns and missiles in order to counter a Swedish air threat. I also see my reserves expand by 100K as men and women sign up to defend their home.
Debate Round No. 3


I declare it unvoid. It is completely logical to be ablt to hit all fire stations in a twelve hour period. Thus without fire stations you would be vulnerable to the bat bomb.
Just to remind you I am in the lead for fighter numbers due to my purchase.

I hate my stupidity. Now I have to WMD thank you mod for catching that.

July 21 code is whiped and rebult. Will finish in four days. Until then spotters are used. Your lack of knolegde is apperant. I you wete attacking a data base then what you did woukd have taken months to repair.

July 22 All power stations are dark to the internet. Hacking is now impossible. Tigers are ppaced throughout every network.

July 23 Sweden paus 10 million to Germany to allow planes to take off and land there. They attack military covoys of airplanes because you can't get out any other way.

July 25 Sweden releses all of the Polish plotition's emails online and shuts down every power station. Cyber defenses are purchased from Russia for 10 million.

July 26 All power goes down for Poland.

July 27 Polish sub is finally caught and destroyed.

July 28 The wreckage is placed in exhibits all over the country. All avilabe land forces are sent to the norwegian border and attack plames destroy all cargo planes spotted to prevent movement if troops.

July 29 Poland runs out of oil.

July 30 Assasins kill several high up muck mucks.

August 1 20 tanks 5 attack helecopters 20 airplanes and 3 boats have been produced. AA defenses are everywhere in the cities. Walle goes up in combat mission boosting morale. He promises that poland will pay in blood for every swedish man woman or child killed by the barbarians.

I am in the green and you can't get men out except by flying which is extremely risky.


I will revoid the bombing,capital, it's not that it wouldn't be possible to hit firestations but air patrols would have destroyed any attack.

I will also void the shutting down of my power grid, you do not have the cspicity to do this as your grid is already shut down.

8/2: Poland makes an emergency deal with open to get oil. I will pay 105 percent of market value for a steady stre of oil.

8/3: Poland launches a new air assault, this time on the Swedish Navy. While casualties are high on both sides, I lost 40 fighters, Sweden lost 20 ships, it is an indecisive battle, but it alters the Swedish mindset for the war. Sweden is now on the defensive.

8/4: Poland offers a white price under threat of gas attack.
Debate Round No. 4


walle_ras forfeited this round.


I am voiding any action after September 20th, as that goes past the turn limit
Very well, i will concede the point that i was unsuccessful in shutting down the power grid, but if that is the case, it is impossible for you to do that to me to. I declare all shutting down of power grids void.

Well played so far!

September 20th: Poland launches a massive draft of people. 10 million are conscripted into the armed forces. They are motivated to protect the motherland from the evil invaders. What they lack in quality, they make up for in numbers

September 21: As the Swedish army is currently well placed, Poland decides to launch a special operation. Operation Tip of the hat.

September 22 - 27: Phase 1 Warsaw is evacuated, all military and people flee in what looks like panic. A WMD is armed in the center of the city unbeknownst to Sweden.

September 29: A small Army of Polish loyalists (5,000 men) launch phase 2, They launch a domed assault on Swedish positions and are decimated. With their retreat, Sweden now feels confident enough to march in to Warsaw.

September 30: Warsaw has Fallen

October 1: Poland enacts Phase 3, a VX nerve gas 15 parts-per-million wmd is detonated within the capital city. The Swedish army is decimated, but so is the city. The Polish government, now on the run,broadcasts a message to the Polish countrymen, "Today, Warsaw was destroyed, it was first burned by the Swedish, Crumbled as Swedish guns lay waste to the city, and drowned as the gas slaughtered any there. Warsaw is no more, but Poland is stronger than ever. WE WILL WIN THIS WAR. POLAND (Dramatic pause) WILL BE FREE!!!

Morale on Sweden plummets as most of their army is gassed, Poland is inspired by this turn of events and is inspired with the idea that the war is winnable.

October 3: Phase 4, in order to cut off any further line of attack, Poland pays 30 Billion directly from the reserves to the rebels to stop fighting their own countrymen, and rather, fight off a foreign invader. The Polish government also promises a restructure once the war is over in order to address the concerns of the people. Any group that refuses this offer is assaulted by a now larger Polish army. Poland also order the air force again on complete scramble, and calls back all fighter from Denmark in order to recapture air superiority.

October 7: Poland is now under a single flag once more, but Sweden is still dangerous.

October 9 - 29: Poland marches a larger army against a smaller battered Swedish army. While is take more casualties, I am fighting a war of attrition.
Poland: 107,000
Sweden: 60,000
3 tanks
November 1: Poland sends 2 million of her newly conscripted soldiers to the northern coast.

November 5th: The retreating Swedish army is trapped between two much larger forces in the city of Koszalin. They have no choice but to surrender. Poland losses: 400 men before the surrender, but gains 22,000 men in PoWS.

November 7th: Poland sends a peace treaty to Sweden.

1. Sweden will withdraw
2. Sweden will take the blame for the war
3. Sweden will pay 40 Billion Euros to Poland
4. Sweden will receive 22,000 PoWs back.

Please comment your acceptance or denial.
Debate Round No. 5
50 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Lexus 3 years ago
No walle, he does not have the absolute authority to tell me who to vote for and if I vote honestly that my vote will be reported. I removed it anyways.
Posted by Luharis 3 years ago
while it was nice of you to vote for me, it is improper as the moderator has made his ruling. Please either change you vote or abstain.
Posted by walle_ras 3 years ago
@Lexus yes he does. This is an art of war debate. I also explained why I forfeited. (Slept through alarm)
Posted by Lexus 3 years ago
You don't own me @Russia_The_Almighty.
Posted by walle_ras 3 years ago
For future reference we need to decide whether the bat bomb is legal or not.

Thank you Luharis for an awesome debate.
Posted by Russia_The_almighty 3 years ago
Message from moderator continued.
Anyone who votes con will have their vote reported IMMEDIATELY.
Posted by Russia_The_almighty 3 years ago
For you voters waiting
Reason: Voting
RFD: This was a very well thought out war debate I commend both of you. Unfortunately there are a few things both sides weren't doing so well in. Such as not asking me about 2 rounds ahead of time on whether or not the bat bomb was valid. If this was the 7 points debate here is how I would put it. S&G and Sources tied obviously. As for conduct, I would have wished that both of you had asked me sooner by PM than voiding things and revoiding things on you own. Argument wise, both made smarter moves than some stupid generals in history. As for the amount of people conscripted in Poland, I can not see that happening. If this was a country like India or even America I could more likely understand it, but the Polish population has only 15 million fit for service. With the amount of deaths and wounded in the country, I can't see that happening including likely all those who died at Warsaw. Now if it was I don't know 5 million that might be more likely, but after all the deaths and not 10 million joining? I can't see that happening. Therefore I apologize to Luharis,but Walle_ras wins in arguments meaning everyone should vote pro.
Posted by Luharis 3 years ago
No one can resist the allure of gold, and the few hundred thousand rebels would have been crushed by my army, what were they even rebeling about anyway?
Posted by walle_ras 3 years ago
The reason they joined is because I promised that they would be free. You think like King George the III.
Posted by Luharis 3 years ago
I used a combination of military force, money, and promises of government reform.
4 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Vote Placed by Lexus 3 years ago
Who won the debate:--
Reasons for voting decision: No conclusion reached
Vote Placed by tejretics 3 years ago
Who won the debate:--
Reasons for voting decision: Pro forfeits, and Con's arguments were completely irrational. Thus, I tie the debate.
Vote Placed by Dynasty2468 3 years ago
Who won the debate:Vote Checkmark-
Reasons for voting decision: Mod said so.
Vote Placed by greatkitteh 3 years ago
Who won the debate:Vote Checkmark-
Reasons for voting decision: Con isn't allowed to void attacks, that is only moderator action. Therefore, Con loses conduct, and pro wins.