The Instigator
Electric
Pro (for)
Losing
15 Points
The Contender
tenjusato
Con (against)
Winning
27 Points

Barry Bonds belongs in the hall of fame, even if he used steroids near the end of his career.

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 12/25/2007 Category: Sports
Updated: 9 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 1,885 times Debate No: 999
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (7)
Votes (14)

 

Electric

Pro

Barry Bonds is a once in a lifetime kind of player. His combination of speed and power and in his earlier years, defense, makes him an obvious hall of fame candidate. He is the only 500-500 player, meaning he has more than 500 home runs and 500 stolen bases. Heck, he's even the only 400-400 player. That achievement alone puts him in the hall of fame right away. There is no doubting this. Let's say 200 of his home runs came from steroids, and that is probably a high estimate. If Barry had 562 home runs, he'd still be among elite company. Yes, cheating is wrong, and steroids are bad, but Bonds is unquestionably a Hall of Fame player.

The same cannot be said for Mark McGwire, whose sole appeal came from his home runs in the late 1990s. McGwire had no speed and was mediocre defensively. To contrast this Bonds has won many Gold Gloves and has stolen more than 500 bases. Bonds is not some marginal hitter that got boosted to Hall status with the infusion of illicit (or semi-legal) drugs. He is an already excellent player who perhaps became the home run king through the use of steroids. There is no question that Barry Bonds is a Hall of Famer. Anyone who says otherwise doesn't understand just how good he was.
tenjusato

Con

Actually he shouldn't. Pete Rose was also one of the greatest players to ever play the game. But he broke the rules. Rules are there to prohibit someone from breaking it. Breaking the rules has consequences and for barry bonds the consequence is that his stats are accepted but he doesn't belong in the hall of fame. Why are there rules to the game if it doesn't matter if any body follows them? sure bonds should be in the hall with his stats before he took steroids but if i cheated on a test and get kicked out of school i can't just come back to that school because i did well before i cheated.
Debate Round No. 1
Electric

Pro

I also believe that Pete Rose deserves to be in the Hall despite breaking rules, so using him as a comparison doesn't strengthen your argument much. Barry Bonds should not be viewed only as a cheater (if he did cheat at all.) There should be an honest study to see what he would have done without being enhanced by steroids, and if those numbers show Hall of Fame caliber, then he should be accepted. If not, he should be denied.
tenjusato

Con

tenjusato forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2
Electric

Pro

Nothing to add. I will close by saying I feel he has not provided any evidence against my claims. The school analogy doesn't work either.
tenjusato

Con

Again why should cheaters be honered as a representation of how great the sport is. In my opinion the Hall of Fame shouldn't be all about stats. Did the player bring positive thiongs to the sport? Was he a good role model? Was he the kind of person that Baseball should be proud of? those all need to be a yes, and for bond sadly, the answers to those questions are no.
Debate Round No. 3
7 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 7 records.
Posted by SocialistRI82 9 years ago
SocialistRI82
I dont need to prove that every other player didn't use steroids. We can't prove it one way or another. What we can prove is that Bonds and others did. thats what the issue is. We know "shoeless" joe did cheat, and hes not in the hall. Rose bets on baseball, hes not in. So how the hell can we let in 'roid heads? The fact is they did it, they knew it was wrong, they didn't care, and when it comes to the hall of fame they should be out.
Posted by Mr_Khan 9 years ago
Mr_Khan
Barry Bonds does not need to be in the Hall of fame, nor does Mark McGuire or anyone else who has used steroids, any sports enhancing drug or any supplement that can make you hit balls harder and further than before. The same goes for any sport, if you do not follow laws, by laws, rules, and anything else that is stated, just leave the sport before you tarnish its reputation and lose credibility for anything.
Posted by spinaltap 9 years ago
spinaltap
I live in SF and I saw Barry play in well over 100 games and countless others on TV. In my opinion he is one of the greatest baseball players of all time. But he looked like an action figure cut from the pages of a comic book. The guy was on so much juice his head got bigger. Literally, his head got 1/2 hat size larger. That just doesn't happen to people unless, 1) they get super fat 2) they have some sort of medical problem that makes their head get larger 3) they get an Al Sharpton hair cut or 4) they're on the juice. While I don't have the blood tests to prove he was on the juice, it was ridiculously obvious that he was juicing regularly. Just about everyone at Candlestick and Big Phone Company park agree on this (at least the ones I talked to while drinking 459 beers during the games I saw). Anyway, he was a great player...probably the best ever....but also a cheater and bad teammate. No way this guy should get into the hall of fame. He belongs in the hall of shame. Hey Barry, many thanks for the memories.
Posted by Mangani 9 years ago
Mangani
You can't prove either:

A) The "all time greats" never used steroids or other performance enhancing drugs

B) Barry Bonds "cheated" by using performance enhancing drugs.

When Mark McGuire and Sammy Sosa were on their homerun race they were accused of using performance enhancing drugs. What they were using was Andro6 and Creatine- the same combination of performance enhancers used by tons of soldiers around the same period of time. These drugs were deemed unharmful and beneficial by the Army, and Andro6 was banned by GNC because it raised testosterone levels by 300% naturally (steroids can raise testosterone levels by more than 1000% and synthetically). In other words a large part of society was not only condoning their actions, but WE were taking the same substances. These drugs did not help us "cheat" in any way, rather they accentuated our individual genetic strengths, ie. some people got big and bulky, others got skinny and fibrous while others stayed the same size but became stronger. We can all be fools and say a healthy diet is cheating because it can do the same for some people... protein, vitamin B, B12, etc... noone can prove the individual "cheating" aspect.
Posted by SocialistRI82 9 years ago
SocialistRI82
The hall of fame is for people who don't cheat. I wonder what the all time greats would have been able to do if they had 'roids. Well they didn't and thats why they are in the hall of fame, Bonds did and thats why i shouldn't. mcguire, bonds, clemens, sosa, palmiero, and anyone else who did it should be kept out as well. pete rose is out for gambling on baseball (never against his team). bonds gets a free pass???? I think not. I think bonds is as bad as the 19?? white sox that fixed the world series. Furthermore, ruth did his numbers in less games than arron or bonds. I still regard ruth as the best all-time, not some meat head bonds who was on the juice for however long.
Posted by Mangani 9 years ago
Mangani
Unless you can retroactively test every baseball player in history, Barry Bonds deserves the honor.
Posted by Rousseau 9 years ago
Rousseau
McGwire was a pivotal point in baseball. Without him, baseball would be unrecognizable. Does this mean he should get in the Hall Of Fame? Maybe, maybe not. Just a thought.
14 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Vote Placed by smelll4545 9 years ago
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Vote Placed by stevster 9 years ago
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Vote Placed by Mr_Khan 9 years ago
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Vote Placed by spinaltap 9 years ago
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Vote Placed by MattMan1 9 years ago
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Vote Placed by SocialistRI82 9 years ago
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Vote Placed by Mangani 9 years ago
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