The Instigator
Kumquatodor
Pro (for)
Losing
2 Points
The Contender
StevenDixon
Con (against)
Winning
9 Points

Batman is the Best Human

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 3 votes the winner is...
StevenDixon
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/14/2013 Category: Entertainment
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,822 times Debate No: 33722
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (11)
Votes (3)

 

Kumquatodor

Pro

I take the position that Batman is physically the best human. I argue that, though he may not be the best in each physical area (speed, strength, stamina, etc.) he is good enough in all these areas to be considered the best all together, similar to how 4<5, but 4 and 3 together is more than 5.
I think that we shouldn't debate martial arts training because that is largely speculation. This is not a fight.
I debate that Batman is the best HUMAN. Superman is better physically than Batman, but Supes is an alien. People like Captain America doesn't count beause they got to the level they were at through augmentation. So no Deadpool, Captain America, Edward Cullen, Deathstroke, etc.
People like Flash don't count, because they have powers. So no Taskmaker, Raven, etc. People like Iron Man and Green Lantern don't count because their physical prowess come from technology.


First Round is Accepting.
Second Round is Arguments only.
Third Round is Rebutals/Arguments.
Fourth Round is Rebutals.
Fifth Round is Closing Statements.

Definitions

Better-
Superior

Augmentation-
Enhancement through foriegn means (ex: Radioactive Spiderbites, Super soldier Serum, etc.)

Physical Superiority/Prowess-
Level of abilities done including, but not limited to: lifting, running, sprinting, jumping, etc.

StevenDixon

Con

I accept your challenge. I think there are many "humans" that are better. Considering you disqualified others for augmentations and technology you will only be able to argue specifically on the merits of batmans natural physical ability.
Debate Round No. 1
Kumquatodor

Pro

Thanks for accepting this challenge. Let's start

Strength

Batman has shown to be able to lift 1000+ lbs.

http://gothamalleys.blogspot.com...

He is bench-pressing two 500 LBS. weights, and possibly more weights. He is bench-pressing AT LEAST 1000 LBS.

Here, Bruce Wayne is climbing vertically up a brick wall, unsupported, with just his hand/feet. To show just how much strength was involved, Bruce Wayne weighs 210 LBS. according to various sources. We can speculate that the Batsuit weighs 30 LBS. On his hands and feet, he’s lifting approximately 230 pounds.

http://batmanfeats.blogspot.com...

SPEED/AGILITY

Batman catches Impulse

Batman beats the Teen Titans. Notice how he over powers Donna, hits Kid Flash, and Deflects Speedy’s arrow, at the same time.

http://batmanfeats.blogspot.com...

He did this while injured and as a rookie. This shows that Bruce Wayne is, at the very least, a master gymnast.


Batman Dodges Bullets. The suit was weighing him down.

http://www.comicvine.com...

StevenDixon

Con

The topic of the debate is that batman is "physically the best human", all I must do to win is demonstrate that one human is equal or more powerful and the burden of proof is on pro to show that batman is superior than my listed examples . He did not define "power", if this is defined as an inhuman ability then obviously...batman has powers because it is not possible for a person to weigh 210 pounds and bench 1000 pounds, from this we can deduce that's not what he meant. Either way I shall give several examples of better humans.

I would like to point out that batman "dodged" bullets like any Jason Statham, or ordinary action hero character would...by the opponents missing. It doesn't show him dodge, just bullets missing. If that's considered "dodging bullets" then Christ tucker's and jackie chan's characters in Rush Hour can also dodge bullets.

Ozymandias of Watchmen {SPOILER ALERT FOR ANYONE THAT HASN'T WATCHED WATCHMEN}

While this is about physical ability, no one can deny the connections between physical prowess and intellect considering things such as reflex's and every movement you make are dependent on memory and cognitive faculties. Ozymandias's intellect allows him to calcuate every move someone makes as well as every move he makes making him absurdly accurate as well as able to dodge. His speed and reflexes are demonstrated by the fact he literally caught a bullet. . http://www.youtube.com...(rest of bullet catching scene showing that he's faking being shot) Keep in mind before the shot, his hands were completely down.

Ozymandias is characterized as the "pinnacle" (: the highest point of development or achievement : ) of human physical ability. He manhandles Rorschach and night owl with complete ease, while doing so demonstrates his absurd strength by tossing men that are roughly 200 pounds like rag dolls, jumping well over his height and well over 10 feet EFFORTLESSLY(leads one to wonder how far if he was actually trying), and when talking to them after shows not one sign of heavy breathing.(illustrating stamina.)

"Abilities
Due to a lifetime of training and conditioning Veidt has achieved peak of human potential.
Peak Human Conditioning: Veidt ' physical strength is at the very peak of human potential. As a result, he is as physically strong as a human being can be without being classified as superhuman. He was able to throw the Comedian, weighing 225 lbs (102 kg), through the air and out a thick plate glass window. He is capable of punching brick walls and kicking down wooden doors with a single kick.
Peak Human Speed: He can run at speeds at the peak of an Olympic athlete.
Peak Human Endurance: Veidt's body and mind have been trained to the point where he can push his body beyond it's natural limit.
Peak Human Agility: His agility is greater than that of an Olympic gold medalist. He can coordinate his body with balance, flexibility, and dexterity. He also has the ability to leap 50 yards out in a single bound and 20 ft into the air without a running start.
Peak Human Reflexes: Veidt's reflexes border on superhuman level. His reaction speed is 20 kph, which makes it possible for him to dodge gunfire even catch a bullet fired at close range.
Peak Human Senses: Veidt's senses have been trained to react to any attack. He has been shown to dodge bullet because he sees faster than them.
Genius-Level Intellect: Veidt is referred to as the smartest man alive. His mental performance allows his mind to operate in the most efficient and rapid manner possible. One manifestation of this is his tactical genius; the ability to quickly process multiple information streams and rapidly respond to changing tactical situations. Veidt also possesses an eidetic memory, meaning that he never forgets anything and has perfect recall. He is capable of creating numerous technologies to counter Dr. Manhattan. Veidt is able to view a wall filled floor to ceiling with television screens, each showing a different image he is able to pay attention to each one simultaneously.
Polymath: He has studied the following areas:
Biology
Chemistry
Engineering
Geography
History
Mathematics
Physics
Political Science
Technology
Master Martial Artist Veidt is an expert in hand-to-hand combat being very skilled in multiple martial arts. Fighting skills sufficient to hold off both Nite-Owl and Rorschach at the same time. Veidt is one of the finest martial artist earth has ever known. His only defeat came early in his career at the hands of the Comedian, something he never got over. He is well versed in:
Boxing
Judo
Jujutsu
Master Tactician and Strategist: He is an accomplished strategist. He had been widely considered one of, if not the greatest, tacticians on the planet. He is able to create a vast billion dollar International corporation with links to legitimate and criminal organization, all with the single purpose to bring world peace via the threat of a fake alien invasion to unite the nations to bring about world peace
Master Acrobat: His years of training and experience even at age 40 have made him an expert acrobat, gymnast, and aerialist.
Multilingualism: Veidt is fluent in English, Turkish, German, Russian and various other languages not shown.
Peak Human Strength: Veidt engages in an intensive exercise regimen, and because of this, his strength, like all other physical attributes, is at the peak of human perfection. He is shown to be able to bench-press at least 1000 lbs."
Abilities
Due to a lifetime of training and conditioning Veidt has achieved peak of human potential."
http://dc.wikia.com...(Watchmen)

Hercule/Mr Satan from DBZ.

In this video it shows him jump over 20 feet in the air, Dodge every attack that's moving almost faster than the eye can see, do incredible flips(showing acrobatic abilities that I doubt batman could even conceive of), and kicks a man that's clearly 260 pounds+ over 20 feet and horizontally off the stage. I don't believe I need to expand on the amount of strength, agility, and speed it would take to do this. Mr Satan has pulled buses, broke 20 concrete slabs with one strike. In the movie 9 warriors never rest he jumps out of a helicopter with no parachute and breaks a tower of breaking blocks with one chop and lands safely. He pulled 4 buses into a stadium at the same time(an average school bus weights 11,000 pounds to 14,000 pounds). So really...he's atleast 10x stronger than batman, can jump twice as high, can move so fast he isn't even visible. His physical prowess gimps the majority of inhuman superheroes....no human could compete.

http://watchmen.wikia.com...
http://www.merriam-webster.com...
http://dragonball.wikia.com...
Debate Round No. 2
Kumquatodor

Pro

Finding an argument against Ozimandias will be easy; I already have a plan.
Now to plan against Mister Satan. I haven't even heard of the guy. I never watched DBZ.

*goes to DBZ wiki*

No. No. NO! ITS OVER 100!!

Curse you! Your ingenius debating skills has defeated me!
StevenDixon

Con

Tehehehe I would like to thank my opponent for this debate, admittedly my views on batman's physical abilities were based on the movies where he's a slow pile of garbage with seemingly moderate strength. I had no idea he was that strong and fast in the comic books.

As my opponent has forfeit and it is clear batman's physical capabilities are no match for hercule, I would ask everyone to vote con.
Debate Round No. 3
Kumquatodor

Pro

Thank you for debating. I suggest checking the DCwikia. Batman is really overpowered. He knows 127 martial arts, can dodge bullets after they were fired, (as seen in Batman: Under the Red Hood), lift at least 1/2 tons, has an IQ of 192, has outsmarted Braniac, Darkseid, Superman, etc., and has all the money he ever needs, and has a million plans. That's why people say he could take on Superman. I suggest you look into the character.

The psyhological part is awesome. Anyways, he is somewhere around Ozimandias's level (maybe equal, or just lower), but nowhere near Mr. Satan. Good Job.
StevenDixon

Con

DBZ is just way too exaggerated for anything to compete. The non human characters are basically gods.
Debate Round No. 4
Kumquatodor

Pro

I guess that's why Goku vs. Superman is so widely debated.
StevenDixon

Con

Due to forfeit vote for con!!!!
Debate Round No. 5
11 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Kumquatodor 4 years ago
Kumquatodor
I didn't realize that problem. Sorry I've kept the victory from you for so long.
Posted by StevenDixon 4 years ago
StevenDixon
My favorite part about this debate is that the voting period ends in half a year.
Posted by StevenDixon 4 years ago
StevenDixon
Batman could beat both of them up at the same time. He knows a million different martial art and is quicker and faster than both of them....while being able to bench 1000 pounds. It would be embarrassing.
Posted by BennyW 4 years ago
BennyW
it would be interesting to put up real life people against Batman, like Jackie Chan or Chuck Norris.
Posted by Smithereens 4 years ago
Smithereens
Please correct your stances, I am the best human alive and don't let anyone tell you otherwise.
Posted by Kumquatodor 4 years ago
Kumquatodor
Crap... Pictures didn't stay attached.
Posted by Kumquatodor 4 years ago
Kumquatodor
I will post my argument sometime between 11:30-3:00 hopefully.
Posted by Kumquatodor 4 years ago
Kumquatodor
I meant Bruce Wayne, but I think everyone understands I mean Bruce Wayne.
Posted by StevenDixon 4 years ago
StevenDixon
By batman he does me brucewayne, his suit is technology just as tony starks is, so it's not allowed.

I'm wondering if you have something up your sleeve because if not....this is going to be pretty easy.
Posted by Zaradi 4 years ago
Zaradi
Lol Iron Man doesn't count because his abilities come through technology, even though Batman TOTALLY relies mainly on technology to fight crime....gonna sweep that little tidbit of information under the rug there.....nothing to see here.....these are not the droids you're looking for...
3 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Vote Placed by BennyW 4 years ago
BennyW
KumquatodorStevenDixonTied
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Total points awarded:13 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro conceded the debate but I will give him a conduct point for doing so graciously.
Vote Placed by Smithereens 4 years ago
Smithereens
KumquatodorStevenDixonTied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: concession.
Vote Placed by Ragnar 4 years ago
Ragnar
KumquatodorStevenDixonTied
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Total points awarded:13 
Reasons for voting decision: I'm a mind over matter guy myself, yet from round 1 it seems that is out of the area of measurement (batman does have a great mind...). Pro's first source nearly had me convinced batman could not be human, then it got to those actor photos... Conduct for concession, argument to con for bringing up Ozymandias from Watchmen (admittedly I gave zero credit to Mr Satan, who is a cartoon comparable to Popeye in the shortage of convincing evidence that such COULD be human). Sources were too close to call.