The Instigator
marcusfexix
Pro (for)
Tied
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The Contender
JDC
Con (against)
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Best Assassins Creed character?

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/12/2014 Category: Games
Updated: 3 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 752 times Debate No: 45708
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (4)
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marcusfexix

Pro

For fun and practice, I wish to challenge JDC to a debate about the best Assassin's Creed character. Directly, it must be one of the "Assassins", specifically. While Desmond could be considered, I'm more focused on the actual protagonists, such as Al'tair, Kenway, etc. Also, items such as specific game mechanics, graphics, sound, etc...are not considered for this debate. It is purely about the story and overall worth of the character from a non-technical standpoint.

For purposes of this debate, I am choosing Altair Ibn La'ahad as my character of choice, and will outline why.

Unlike almost any other assassin listed within the games, Altair was born an Assassin, to Assassin parents. He was raised and trained as an assassin from the earliest of ages, coming to know (and in fact, later completely shape and lead) the way of Assassins in an intimate and profound way.

Altair was responsible for pushing back the Templars of his time, rooting out Templars in his order (including his own mentor), and for reshaping the Order from it's days past. He changed how Assassins' approached equipment needs (such as alterations which discontinued the practice of chopping off a finger to equip Assassin-specific equipment), how they approached recruitment and the integration of family as a main component, and many others.

While other Assassins were skilled in their own right, they received the lessons handed down in generations past, many from Altair himself. As almost all of them became Assassins over reasons of revenge against family wrongs, or even simply stumbled into the Order as Edward Kenway, Altair was a purist. He was the quintessential assassin, and a role model for all in the Order.

I believe these, and other items, make Altair the best of the Order, placing him above others and making him without equal.
JDC

Con

First I would like to thank my opponent for inviting me to participate into this debate, my first on this site. I will begin by conceding that I have not plated the Assassin's Creed games, but I do believe that with adequate research one can competently debate an issue with which one does not have personal experience.
As I am taking the con position, I will argue that Connor is the best Assassin's Creed character. I will start by saying that I disagree with my opponent's view that being born an assassin to assassin parents is an advantageous characteristic. Indeed, becoming that which one was not originally is itself an interesting narrative element which often improves stories, including those in video games.
I believe that one advantage that Connor has over Assassin's Creed characters is the story in which he is a part of. Connor is unique among the Assassins in having had direct involvement in the American Revolutionary War. Given the fact that America would later go on to be the world's dominant superpower, there are few things more important that can be imagined than having played a role in its creation. Thus, I beleive that Connor can be considered the greatest Assassin in the series.
Debate Round No. 1
marcusfexix

Pro

I appreciate your response, and am glad we can debate on this subject!

My apologies. Had I known you were not familiar, I would have chosen a different and more equal item for discussion. Next time around, you get to choose! :)

I begin by countering the idea that being born into an Assassin's clan, with Assassin parents, would have not given Altair (or anyone else in the same situation) such advantage. While Conner was skilled and certainly earned his place in the Order, the fact remains that he wasn't born into it and had to pick up the lessons that Altair would have learned somewhat earlier in life. By contrast, Altair was raised in the Order. He was taught, from the earliest of ages, about the philosophy and techniques used by his fellow Assassins. He would have endured rigorous training and exercises, both physical and mental, for a much longer period than Conner. While Conner did enter in later in his childhood, he would still be behind Altair in this respect.

With regards to the narrative, one could claim that such a narrative between the two is better, or worse, due to subjective thinking or reasons. While Conner did follow the path you claim, Altair by contrast had the entire life he'd known, since birth, thrown into upheaval by the Templar Order. This would have been as catastrophic (if not more so) in a story sense. Conner endured loss of family and home early in life, but Altair endured it on a much grander scale, and by the very mentor and father figure he had come to respect and admire. This, in turn, created a situation that Altair personally took charge of, as is illustrated in my next point.

Conner's story would have bearing, in the Assassin's Creed universe, and change the course of American history. However, this is considered, time wise, a small blip on the radar when compared to Altair's contributions, which spanned back to the late 1100's and well into the midway point of the 1250's. His actions, leadership, and changes to the order persisted until (and well past) the birth of Conner, almost exactly 500 years after Altair's death. In this case, such ramifications would be world wide (or at least, as much of the world as was known during such times, which continued to open up via exploration, The New World, etc). Conner's ability to even influence the American history books came about as a direct result of Altair's works. Because of this farther reaching, much more deeply engrained influence for 5 centuries before Conner was even born, I believe this gives Altair an advantage on this point, especially since (according to game lore), Altair's changes and legacy influenced world events as well as the endless battle against the Templars, further changing history.

This is not to diminish the accomplishments of Conner, but to place them in proper context when banked against Altair in these cases.
JDC

Con

I would like to start this round by acknowledging my opponents apology and pointing out that I'm not sure he has anything to apologize for. While he did instigate the debate, I chose to accept the challenge and could have declined it if I saw fit. As it is, I chose to participate in hopes of gaining more experience with debating on this site, and I am doing just that.
I will agree with pro that narrative elements are highly subjective, but the same can be said for any criteria used to judge video game characters. So, to some extent the very existence of this question assumes that such arguments are admissible.I understand your point about Altair's actions enabling those of Connor, but this could be said about any character or person that precedes another. Essentially, a person can influence events in the future but not the past. Because of this a character from an earlier time period will always outrank one from a later period in this regard. To me, this seems somewhat counter-intuitive, so I feel that characters should only be judged by what they accomplish in the context of their own time period, not what happens later as a result of their actions. So I believe that the proposition that Connor is the best Assassin's Creed character remains viable.
Debate Round No. 2
marcusfexix

Pro

marcusfexix forfeited this round.
JDC

Con

As my opponent has forfeited the last round, I have no arguments to respond to. I feel no need to add any further arguments myself, so I will simply request that any observers judge this debate on the basis of what has already been said.
Debate Round No. 3
4 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Posted by marcusfexix 3 years ago
marcusfexix
I totally missed the email and forgot to come back, was my fault entirely lol. Good response though!
Posted by marcusfexix 3 years ago
marcusfexix
No worries, do so at your leisure.

I've played AC4 (98% completion), and it was fun...you get to be a pirate AND assassin, so it works out well. The shanties they sing on the boat will, i repeat, will get stuck in your head.

The gameplay is solid and lives up to the AC franchise. I'm not a big multiplayer person for it though, so i'd be ill suited to describe that well. But i think it's a title you'd enjoy.

Personally...I'm waiting for TWD Season 2, Episode 2 to be released, as well as Dying Light and the Alien franchise game coming out later this year. Also, Thief and Titanfall look pretty solid.

Right now, I'm between watching Crawford squirm about with his sock puppet over there, playing Rift and Killer Instinct on X1 as well as AC4 and Dead Rising 3. I need to find more people to play with in groups for stuff. <_<
Posted by JDC 3 years ago
JDC
@marcusfexix
Don't worry about it! I've heard pretty good things about the Assassin's Creed games, and will likely play them at some point. Anyways, I do have a few ideas about other things that could be debated, and I will instigate a debate one of them after we finish this one.
Posted by marcusfexix 3 years ago
marcusfexix
@JDC

Seriously, didn't know you weren't familiar, so that's totally by bad! I took a guess that you might be, but looks like I failed pretty hard.

Next time, your choice, anything you like!
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