The Instigator
nyfan57
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
Buddamoose
Con (against)
Winning
6 Points

Best State In America NJ!

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
Buddamoose
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 3/18/2012 Category: Society
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,622 times Debate No: 22101
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (15)
Votes (2)

 

nyfan57

Pro

New Jersey is clearly the best state in America for many reasons. Because of this I think people In new Jersey are generally happier then anyone in the other 49 states. I also think as of recently this is why New Jersey is being ripped on by everyone simply because their jealous of New Jersey.
Buddamoose

Con

Thank you for creating this debate!

As con I will be arguing that New Jersey is not the best state in America. I would first like to point out that BoP(burden of proof) is on my opponent as the affirmative to prove New Jersey is the best state in the United States of America. First I will start by defining some key terms:

Best-�of highest quality
State- One of the more or less internally autonomous territorial and political units composing a federation under a sovereign government
America- United States of America

Before I present my own case I will first refute my peers short case.

"people In new Jersey are generally happier then anyone in the other 49 states"

Yes folks, thats the entirety of his case. So shall we see if New Jersey really has the "happiest" people in the United States? Well this is shocking, according to this national survey the 10 happiest states in the U.S. are:

10) Montana
9) New Hampshire
8) Nebraska
7) Kansas
6) Colorado
5) Alaska
4) Utah
3) Minnesota
2) North Dakota
1) Hawaii

So as you can see New Jersey does not have the happiest people. Now seeing as my peers case is wholly refuted let me present a case of my own:

Contention One: New Jersey is crowded

A) New Jersey Ranks first(the only first position it has in comparison to other states) in population density.
B) New Jersey has no "rural" areas, just urban and suburban, so dont expect any peace and quiet, or nature.

Contention Two: Jersey Shore(tv show)

A) Seriously? Have you seen the show? If not watch this video, and you will see, such a show being based in NJ completely prevents it from being called "best."

Look at that face before you click, does that look like "best" to you? No, didnt think so...

Vote Con
Debate Round No. 1
nyfan57

Pro

Thank you for accepting my debate. I agree with your Key terms But can you please define the term happy in the next round to see if we are on the same page thank you.

I see your list which you consider the ten happiest states and we have yet to define the term "happy". Also I would like to see the source you got this from to see if it is credible.
10) Montana
9) New Hampshire
8) Nebraska
7) Kansas
6) Colorado
5) Alaska
4) Utah
3) Minnesota
2) North Dakota
1) Hawaii.

I could single out every single state on this list in detail and prove why New Jersey citizens are happier. But Ill save that for later rounds. First Ill explain why New Jersey is the best sate which is basically directly proportional to happiness.

First of all we have the cheapest gas prices. When the prices go up this summer I cant wait to hear every other state complain and moan how high the prices are. The most it will reach in New Jersey is around 4.20. Some places already reached this. We also don't have to pump our own gas. From Personal experience going to pump your own gas can be considerably annoying especially if the pump does not except your credit or debit card and you got to go in and prepay. This will approximately take away 30 to 40 minutes of my life each year.

Now to geographical make up of New Jersey. Your right outside the city which is a huge plus if you live in Northern New Jersey. There will always be a surplus of jobs in demand because of this. Also I rather commute into the city than live there. There are many reasons why I am saying this but this is mostly due to air quality and open space two things I'm sure everyone would love to have. Next the climate in New Jersey gives you the best of both worlds. Cold winters which means significant amounts of snow. We have numerous snowboarding resorts all over New Jersey. We also have scorching summers which is perfect for the Jersey Shore. Unlike Northern and Southern states we actually have waves. Whats the point of going in the water to cool off if you can ride waves? Other state don't have these wave things.
We also have a large quantity of lakes located all over New Jersey. Unlike what you said above we also happen to have rural areas. Big Cities pop up all over New Jersey but the more southern you get is directly proportional to more rural areas. And if New Jersey isnt rural enough for anyone, New york state, Vermont, and Pennsylvania are all within a couple of hours away which is a day trip.

As you can see New Jersey is the best state because there are many things to do within its borders as well as on the outside which is like leaving your backyard.

Now to the New Jersey Shore thing, what other state has a TV show named after it? The answers none. TV shows are created to attract viewers interest. Clearly New Jersey is interesting place or else there wouldn't be a TV show named after it. I don't watch the show personally but right there he looks pretty happy to me. Looks like hes having a good time. Whats wrong with having a good time? Also I heard most of the cast is not from New Jersey. I am Pretty sure almost all of them are from New York.
Buddamoose

Con

Source for 10 happiest states list: http://www.businessinsider.com...

Happy- Feeling pleasure or contentment.

Now for refuting my peers contentions:

1) "First of all we have the cheapest gas prices"

Refutation: That distinction belongs to Wyoming sir... The top three cheapest gas prices by state are:
1) Wyoming
2) Colorado
3) Montana

[http://bottomline.msnbc.msn.com...]

2) We also don't have to pump our own gas

Refutation: Yeah those are whats called full-service stations. They're in every state.

3) Your right outside the city which is a huge plus if you live in Northern New Jersey

Refutation: I'm assuming the city you speak of is New York City? Even if thats the case how many cities are there in the U.S? The same could be said of somebody living outside LA or Chicago. So I dont see how that created any sort of distinction of being better...

4) There are many reasons why I am saying this but this is mostly due to air quality and open space two things I'm sure everyone would love to have

Refutation: A) New Jersey failed Federal Air Quality standards.
[http://www.nj.com...]
B) New Jersey is ranked 47th in size, with the highest population density. Other states are larger with less pop. density.
[http://en.m.wikipedia.org...]

5) Next the climate in New Jersey gives you the best of both worlds. Cold winters which means significant amounts of snow. We have numerous snowboarding resorts all over New Jersey. We also have scorching summers which is perfect for the Jersey Shore

Refutation: The entire Northeast Region of the U.S. has the same climate as New Jersey, try again.

6) Unlike Northern and Southern states we actually have waves. Whats the point of going in the water to cool off if you can ride waves? Other state don't have these wave things.

Refutation: So I suppose HAWAII the BIRTHPLACE OF SURFING, doesnt have waves then?

7) We also have a large quantity of lakes located all over New Jersey.

Refutation: Still not the best, Minnesota(the land of lakes) has the most(15,291).
[http://m.wizzley.com...]
8) Unlike what you said above we also happen to have rural areas. Big Cities pop up all over New Jersey but the more southern you get is directly proportional to more rural areas. And if New Jersey isnt rural enough for anyone, New york state, Vermont, and Pennsylvania are all within a couple of hours away which is a day trip.

Refutation: A) Still not the most rural...
B) We're debating about New Jersey, not the surrounding states so that point is invalid

9) Now to the New Jersey Shore thing, what other state has a TV show named after it? The answers none

Refutation: A) Hawaii Five-O, The state of Georgia... Among others
B) Jersey Shore is the name of a location in New Jersey, so better throw in a wholee lot more.

10) Also I heard most of the cast is not from New Jersey. I am Pretty sure almost all of them are from New York.

Refutation: The show is still located in New Jersey, sooo, still a negative.

In summary my peer has still not met BoP. The debate must still be voted for Con.
Debate Round No. 2
nyfan57

Pro

3) Your right outside the city which is a huge plus if you live in Northern New Jersey

Refutation: I'm assuming the city you speak of is New York City? Even if thats the case how many cities are there in the U.S? The same could be said of somebody living outside LA or Chicago. So I dont see how that created any sort of distinction of being better...

Yes I was thinking of New York. New York Happens to one of the most popular cities in America. Where Millions of tourists come each year. It location for Pretty much everyone who lives in New jersey happens to be in a very convenient location because Northern New Jersey has a high population density. Its location is very convenient for New Jersey citizens because of this. If I was to compare both your examples of Chicago And La one could say these cities happen to benefit their states and their states only. Which Is why I used the example of New York for being a luxury for New Jersey.

Refutation: A) New Jersey failed Federal Air Quality standards.
[http://www.nj.com......]
Although It has flunked you might want to take a closer look at your sources.
The Link you used shows air pollution rapidly going down in New Jersey. In the 50s as shown in this article we didn't know how bad air pollution from factories was for the environment. As for the chart on your link though we do see it rapidly going down which is a positive.

I used the example of air pollution to show why I wouldn't want to live in New York City
Here is a better example. http://www.nrdc.org...
Notice how most of New Jersey has clean air pollution levels With the exemption of the south which is mostly due to Delaware and Maryland's air rising up to New Jersey. However Camden creates a lot as well which is referenced in your source.

New Jersey is ranked 47th in size, with the highest population density. Other states are larger with less pop. density.
I don't know what your premise is regarding this I'm guessing by remark that we don't live on top of each other? If I am correct about your premise New Jersey has its compacted areas such as Hoboken but for the most part is widely spaced out with many suburban areas. I rather have a center of town then houses that are spaced out a mile are so a part. I think anyone would agree with this rather then living in the middle of nowhere.

Refutation: The entire Northeast Region of the U.S. has the same climate as New Jersey, try again.

I brought up the climate to show how through various weather scenarios New jersey can still be a very active place. and how the New Jersey Shore is superior to any other beach of the east coast. Also I didn't yet contrast the weather to the west of us which happens to be hit hard by earthquakes and a so called tornado ally as one can conclude from recent events.

Unlike Northern and Southern states we actually have waves. Whats the point of going in the water to cool off if you can ride waves? Other state don't have these wave things.

I meant states on the east coast predominately because you don't get many waves in other east coast compared to New Jersey. I thought Hawaii was rather obvious one can conclude. Sorry for Not saying the east coast specifically when I referenced northern and southern states.

We also have a large quantity of lakes located all over New Jersey.

Refutation: Still not the best, Minnesota(the land of lakes) has the most(15,291).

I didn't intend to support New Jersey because it had a lot of lakes. I brought up the lakes because their are many activities that could be done on a lake. I also sort of used it to reference a rural area.

We're debating about New Jersey, not the surrounding states so that point is invalid
Don't all the states I mentioned in round two act as a luxury from New Jersey therefore it is not invalid. New Jersey Citizens make up New Jersey so wouldn't anything that benefited New Jerseys citizens make up New Jersey?

Back to the New Jersey Shore television show whats the relevancy of the show in your premise? Actually what is your premise? All I see so far is fallacies.
Buddamoose

Con

Well thank you for reading this thus far. I see my peer has gotten confused as to why I have not presented much of a case yet. What he does not understand is he as affirmative has burden of proof in this debate and as of yet has not proven anything. In fact everything he has used in an attempt to prove that the best state in america is new jersey, once refuted by providing factual information, has now become offense in favor of my position, that New Jersey is most certainly not the best state.

My peers case looks like this:

1) The Best State in America is NJ because:
.
.
.
.

Thats it. Do not fall for his excuses or attempts at changing his arguments. Arguments bases all on opinion, and not factual information at all. Every single argument he has brought up has been untrue:

A) "I think people In new Jersey are generally happier then anyone in the other 49 states"

Well I'm sorry but that is outright false. Not only that but it is purely opinion based, he does not factor in any information and in my rebuttal I showed that it was not the true. There are indeed states that are all-around "happier" than New Jersey. So it cannot be proclaimed the best in that aspect. Turn this and use it as offense on my peers case(or lackthereof).

B) "First of all we have the cheapest gas prices"

Another false statement. New Jersey does not have the lowest gas prices so it is not best in that aspect either. Turm this and use it as offense on my peers case(or lackthereof).

C) We also don't have to pump our own gas.

I will explain why this is just a wholly invalid point in the context of the debate. If indeed New Jersey was the only place in the United States, then it could be considered best in this aspect. However it is not the only state with full-service gas stations. Because of this it cannot be proclaimed "best" because it is no better than any other state(so how can it be proclaimed the best?). He does this multiple times and i will list them all out now:

1) Your right outside the city which is a huge plus if you live in Northern New Jersey.
2) we actually have waves
3) As you can see New Jersey is the best state because there are many things to do within its borders .
as well as on the outside which is like leaving your backyard.
4) Cold winters which means significant amounts of snow.
5) We have numerous snowboarding resorts all over New Jersey.
6) We also have scorching summers which is perfect for the Jersey Shore
7) We also have a large quantity of lakes located all over New Jersey.
8) Any example of a benefit of traveling outside the state(something thay can be done in any state.)

D) There are many reasons why I am saying this but this is mostly due to air quality and open space two things I'm sure everyone would love to have.

As I already explained New Jersey is not the best in those aspects at all. They flunked air quality standards, while other states passed. Look at the map of air quality index across the country that was supplied by my peer. There are states with the highest air quality rating, while new jersey has none of the sort. How can it be the best if it is not really the best? Perhaps my peer would like to explain that one. He seems to be missing the point that no matter how much he tries to shade it, the points he brings up are not ways that New Jersey is best at all, and because of this they are examples of why New Jersey is not the best, but rather, that it is not the best.

E) Whats the point of going in the water to cool off if you can ride waves? Other state don't have these wave things.

I just wanted to bring up this point my peer brought forth yet again. I am sure those reading this are amused at his naivet�. Other states dont have waves? There are indeed other states that have waves so how can he proclaim it is best because other states dont have them? He has failed to understand the meaning of
best. OF HIGHEST QUALITY. HIGHEST QUALITY in the sense that no other state is able to compare to its qualities.

As of yet all my peer has brought for has been opinions with no substantial evidence as to why those claims are true. As well as examples of activities, that well, you can do anywhere else. My peer asks what my premise is?

My premise is this, that New Jersey is no better than any other state in comparison of overall quality. I am here in defense of the other 49 states that are sick of elitist attitudes such as this. No state is objectively any better than the other. Such an opinion is merely that, an opinion. Its extremelt prejudicial and demeaning of the other 49 states to even say such a thing. My peer wishes to know why people dislike New Jersey so much, well if he is a shining example of the opinions most people from New Jersey hold, I think we have the answer to his question, because they believe they are better than everybody else, and that, is not a very nice stance to take. Shame on Nyfan, shame on him and his elitist prejudicial views.

On a final note, when comparing objects how do we determine which is best? By a factoring of all similiar qualities and deciding which objects qualities are overal better than anothers. As of yet all my peer has done is bring up opinions that I immediately turned back around on him as untrue and those same claims now work as offense in favor of my case. As such this case must be voted in favor of Con because:

1) Pro has failed to meet his Burden of Proof.
2) Has supplied only opinions with no factual or objective basis.
3) I have provided plenty of offense in support of New Jersey NOT being the best state in turning my
peers claims against him.

Vote Con
Debate Round No. 3
nyfan57

Pro

Alright I can play your game?

Your premise claims to be read Below:
My premise is this, that New Jersey is no better than any other state in comparison of overall quality. I am here in defense of the other 49 states that are sick of elitist attitudes such as this. No state is objectively any better than the other. Such an opinion is merely that, an opinion. Its extremelt prejudicial and demeaning of the other 49 states to even say such a thing. My peer wishes to know why people dislike New Jersey so much, well if he is a shining example of the opinions most people from New Jersey hold, I think we have the answer to his question, because they believe they are better than everybody else, and that, is not a very nice stance to take. Shame on Nyfan, shame on him and his elitist prejudicial views.

You said Contention One: New Jersey is crowded

A) New Jersey Ranks first(the only first position it has in comparison to other states) in population density.
B) New Jersey has no "rural" areas, just urban and suburban, so dont expect any peace and quiet, or nature.

This example shows hear that you are clearly hating on New Jersey and basically contradicting yourself. Referencing the two points you said above. you are clearly bringing New Jersey down so you clearly don't think the other 49 states including New Jersey are equal because you are bringing New Jersey down. Since you solely have to bring New Jersey Down clearly it is the best state. Why Haven't you tried to bring down any other state then if you think Every other state is equal? You also claim I don't have a valid argument repetitively, then why are you attacking New Jersey If I don't have a valid premise?

2nd you still haven't answered how the New Jersey Shore is relevant to your premise which is going against all my claims.
Basically whats the point you are trying to make with the Jersey Shore TV show?

And once again you contradicted yourself "Shame on Nyfan, shame on him and his elitist prejudicial views".
If you intended to show how the New Jersey inst the best state because of how young people look and conduct themselves, which in society can take place essentially anywhere wouldn't this make you a biased prejudicial elitist even more than me? I certainty think so. So Shame on Buddamoose.

For everyone viewing this vote Pro because my opponent is biased with elitist prejudicial views which is stereotyping.
Also Vote Pro because he failed at trying to result to fallacies for his premise which I thought was essentially impossible till now.
Also vote pro because my opponent may just be a robot- "look how he presents all his claims"
Clearly we figured out robots are superior from jeopardy.

I will conclude on why New Jersey is the best state for my closing argument.
Buddamoose

Con

1) My peer has as of yet failed to meet the Burden of Proof.
2) Any claims he has made for why New Jersey is the best stage in the United States
have been entirely refuted, and as such they work as offense against New Jersey.

On a side note, I am afraid my peer has misunderstood the meaning of elitist and prejudice.

Elitist- The belief that certain persons or members of certain classes or groups deserve favored treatment by virtue of their perceived superiority.

I am simply claiming that New Jersey is not the best state, and am adocating for the other 49 states that are offended by such claims of superiority, that New Jersey is the best state in America.

Prejudice- opinion formed beforehand or without knowledge

As I have shown my peers arguments have been purely based on opinion with no knowledge or factual basis to draw from. His views are therefore prejudicial. My case tho has been based upon facts as well as opinions. He wishes to dwell upon the second contention I made. What he does not understand is as of right now it does not even matter what case i present. Mind you the case he has attempted to present is turned and works in my favor as reasons why New Jersey is not the best. Because his case has been entirely turned he hasnt met BoP and is losing this debate.

I also will point out that my peer appears to be becoming frustrated over my lack of case. That is ok, like i have said there is no need for me to even present a case as long as BoP has not been met. Also, as I have said multiple times now what examples he attempted to use as reasons for why New Jersey is best, now work as offense in favor of New Jersey not being the best state in America.

Thank you for reading this thus far, and I ask for just a little bit more patience as my peer is sure to astound us all with absolute proof that New Jersey is the best state in America.

Viva La USA :D
Debate Round No. 4
nyfan57

Pro

Here is why New Jersey the best state.

1. Healthcare. Ranked number one under primary care physicians. 2 We have the 7th lowest infant mortality rate we would be number one but as you mentioned several times New Jersey is largely populated. We also ranked 8th in number of physicians/1000. I'm pretty sure healthy people are happier as well. This is not an opinion.
U.S. Census Bureau 2004-2006 Data

2 Low crime rates. We rank fourth in property crime and 13th in violent crime compared to the other 31 states east of the Mississippi River. Once again like you said we have a high population density. For having such a high density these statistics are amazing.
U.S. Census Bureau 2004-2006 Data.
It's safe to say no crime makes people happier as well this is not an opinion. Unless you're the one committing the crime.

3. Geographic Diversity as I mentioned in round two. We got nice beaches awesome ski resorts in New Jersey as well as many great malls for shopping. If we want to leave and head to New York City or a different shore like Ocean city Maryland its in our back yard. Even many more ski resorts.
4 New Jersey has the best entertainment. We got many sports teams Jets, Giants, Who play in the meadow lands which is New Jersey. Devils, Nets, you name it. Thanks to New Jerseys geographical location we could also see Broadway shows, Yankee games , Knicks games, rangers you name it by leaving our backyard. New Jersey also has Atlantic city and contains the fastest roller coaster in the world Kingda Ka.
5. Education. Ranked Number one for high school and 8th graduation rates. New Jersey also has the fourth lowest student per teacher ratio. Once again an amazing accomplishment for having such a high population density.

New Jersey is on top or near the top in all these lists. Its safe to presume everyone wants good health care, education, entertainment, and low crime rates. New Jersey has all this. The people demand New Jersey! Supply and demand. This is probably the reason why New Jersey has the highest property taxes in the nation. You got to pay the most to live the best. Just the cost of living in New Jersey is expensive.
http://blogs.wsj.com...

No other state can compare to New Jersey because of these five facts. Even though there not all number one on the list I think, actually I know, being up there on these 5 examples alone makes New Jersey the best state. Let's see where every other state ranks on these lists with a high population density.

Once again I would like to ask you what was the point of posting the New Jersey shore clip as your opening argument? It seems you tried to avoid this question the last three rounds. Its seems you are prejudice to people in New Jersey because you think we are all like the cast of the New Jersey Shore. You have not answered this question yet so I presume I am correct.
"Prejudice- opinion formed beforehand or without knowledge"
Once again nowhere in the last 4 rounds have you defended any other state. You are just attacking New Jersey. Just attacking New Jersey does not defend the other 49 states. Do you have any proof that the other 49 states are offended by my remarks?
"I am simply claiming that New Jersey is not the best state, and am adocating for the other 49 states that are offended by such claims of superiority, that New Jersey is the best state in America."
Clearly New Jersey is the best state in America or else you wouldn't have to be defending the other 49 states as you claim to be doing so. In order to defend your position that" New Jersey isn't the best state" you decided the only rational way of completing this task was to defend the other 49 states. Since you had to prove that the other 49 states are greater than one, and failed to do so. New Jersey is the best state. Vote Pro!!!!! Thank you for accepting my debate Buddamoose.
Vote Pro!!!!!
Buddamoose

Con

Thank you Zyhan for such an excellent round. Also thank you for this debate as it has been fun and most entertaining. Now onto his case, i will be dealing with only those points he makes that link New Jersey to being the best state. Sadly all other examples that did not pertain only work as offense in my favor, those are:

1) We have the 7th lowest infant mortality rate we would be number one but as you mentioned several times New Jersey is largely populated.
2) We also ranked 8th in number of physicians/1000
3) We rank fourth in property crime and 13th in violent crime
4) 8th graduation rates.
5) New Jersey also has the fourth lowest student per teacher ratio
6) New Jersey has the highest property taxes in the nation

For clarity that last point is actually a negative. Who honestly wants to spend more money to own property, not I and not many others. Continuing on,

7) Just the cost of living in New Jersey is expensive.

Now for the examples that do link New Jersey.

1) Healthcare. Ranked number one under primary care physicians

Now this might be a link to New Jersey being the best but from experience can we say that having the most of something means that the object is "the best?" No in fact New Jersey ranks 9th in healthcare overall, clearly not the best.[1]

2) Ranked Number one for high school

Number one how? Highest quality high schools? Because that is not true. New Jersey is 4th overall in that aspect, not first.[2]

3) New Jersey has the fastest roller-coaster in the US Kingda Ka."

This is true, yet does being the fastest make it the best? No, in fact Kingda Ka does not even make the list(among steel coasters even so the playing field was reduced as wooden coasters werent counted.[3]

4) New Jersey has Atlantic City

Which is a casino town more or less, I think Las Vegas takes the cake for the best casino town.

Now my peer yet again makes the mistake of listing reasons that are either: Reasons why other states are better, or activities that you can experience in other states.

1) Geographic Diversity as I mentioned in round two. We got nice beaches awesome ski resorts in New Jersey as well as many great malls for shopping.
2) If we want to leave and head to New York City or a different shore like Ocean city Maryland its in our back yard. Even many more ski resorts.
3) New Jersey has the best entertainment.
4) We got many sports teams
5) Thanks to New Jerseys geographical location we could also see Broadway shows, Yankee games , Knicks games, rangers you name it by leaving our backyard.

As I have once more fully refuted my peers case, this means he ultimately has failed to meet burden of proof. The tally for reasons why New Jersey is the best, and reasons why not stands as this,

Best- 0
Not Best- 37(rough estimate)

As such this vote must be voted in favor of Con by default. My own original case(Con. 1 & 2) is entirely irrevelant to the debate as the affirmative has not made a case at all. While every reason he uses is turned and works as a reason why New Jersey is not the best.

On a final note, thank you again Zyhan for starting this devate. New Jersey is a good place to live and even visit I will say that much. But to proclaim it the best is far from rational or reasonable.

Vote Con
Debate Round No. 5
15 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Buddamoose 5 years ago
Buddamoose
*kick mexico's arse
Posted by Buddamoose 5 years ago
Buddamoose
Texas did k
Posted by 16kadams 5 years ago
16kadams
Texas is the best
Posted by Buddamoose 5 years ago
Buddamoose
@Imabench's vote
Posted by Buddamoose 5 years ago
Buddamoose
Ooh thats terrible, I coulda used that as a reason >_>
Posted by Zaradi 5 years ago
Zaradi
Thett, this is the three responses:
1. Everything is bigger and better in Texas.
2. We were our own state for a while, and the US wanted us, not we wanted them.
3. ......
Uhhh.....
Hold on.....
I dunno, I can't remember.
Posted by thett3 5 years ago
thett3
I'm telling you right now--it's three responses I'm gonna make:

wait there whats that third one?

Uhm...

I cant..no I cant remember..

oops.
Posted by 000ike 5 years ago
000ike
thett, your state produced Rick Perry and George Bush, I wouldn't be talking lol
Posted by thett3 5 years ago
thett3
Ike is from New Jersey, even more Con ground!!!
Posted by 000ike 5 years ago
000ike
This is such a easy win for Pro :p
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by 16kadams 5 years ago
16kadams
nyfan57BuddamooseTied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: con showed they had a lot of population, showed other states had more happy people, that other states have lower infant mortality, JERSEY HAS HIGH TAXES (tax=bad), and they have a poor teacher to child ratio. CON WINS.
Vote Placed by imabench 5 years ago
imabench
nyfan57BuddamooseTied
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Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: I was mugged in New Jersey once....