The Instigator
1Historygenius
Pro (for)
Winning
4 Points
The Contender
AntiState
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points

Biggest Military Mistakes

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after 1 vote the winner is...
1Historygenius
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 7/9/2012 Category: Politics
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,804 times Debate No: 24663
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (3)
Votes (1)

 

1Historygenius

Pro

Subject
In this debate, the two debaters will each present a military action that they consider a mistake during a war and contributed to that country's defeat or extended the end of the war in that country's victory.

Rules
1. There are not attacks or rebbutals, basically you just present a mistake, explain why you think it had a huge impact, and then continue to the next round. Whoever has the most biggest mistakes will be decided by the voters.
AntiState

Con

This is a captivating debate and I look forward to the military mistakes the opponent will present. I look forward to an educational debate. I would guess the first round is for acceptance only therefore I anxiously wait for your argument.

Good luck!
Debate Round No. 1
1Historygenius

Pro

Attacking Kursk

War: World War 2

This miliary action essentially cost the Germans the war. After the famous Battle of Stalingrad, it looked like the Soviets were going to run over the Germans. However, believe it or not, Germany could still fight. At the battle of Kharkov, German field marshal Erich von Manstein won an amazing victory againts the Soviets (usually Stalingrad is given too much credit by amateur historians when it really was not as much of a turning point as Kursk), that is considered a great example of defensive mechanised warfare. However, after that, the German dictator Adolf Hitler made a mistake. He ordered an offensive to take the German city of Kursk which lay in bulge controlled by the Soviets. Then he delayed the offensive when he decided to have the German commanders wait several months for the brand new Tiger tanks. The Soviets found out about the offensive a dug-in deep in he bulge with a series of defensive lines. When the offensive began, these lines bent, but were not destroyed. The Soviets gathered over 2 million men and 5,000 tanks to fight 800,000 Germans and 3,000 tanks. While he Soviets lost far more casualties, they could take them and still fight the Germans back, killing 250,000 of them. It was also the greatest tank battle in history. When he battle was over it was the turning point of the war as the Germans were defeated. Those extra Tigers could have played a role in more of a defensive war to stop the Soviet steamroller and ground them down in a longer war.
AntiState

Con

Pearl Harbor

The date July 26, 1941 Franklin D. Roosevelt has just made it illegal for any United States company to sell any raw materials or oil to Japan. It cannot go unnoticed that Japan depended heavily on the United States for its oil,[1] without the oil Japan received from the United States the Japanese Empire only had 18 months of oil supply left. Japan noticed the United States was taking the side of the Allies, Japan saw an attack on their soil by the United States inevitable. Noting this Japan attacked the closes American naval base to Japan, Pearl Harbor.[2] On December 7, 1941 Japan attacked Pearl Harbor[3] but the Japanese would soon realize that this attack would not be long celebrated, in the words of the Japanese Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto "Japan had awakened a sleeping giant." This attack is seen as the turning point for the war in the pacific, after the attack on Pearl Harbor Japan switched from an offensive strategy to a defensive one. After this attack the United States entered a war-time industrial boom that brought the United States out of the Great Depression and would later be utilized to ultimately crush the Japanese Empire. This attack would later lead to a form of warfare which would not only obliterate Japanese cities but as well create a new form of warfare, nuclear warfare. The United States on August 6-9, 1945 the United States made history by becoming the first country to ever utilize nuclear weapons in war. The United States dropped two atomic bombs one in Hiroshima and Nagasaki, these bombs are estimated to have killed over 200,000 people and destroyed the industrial cities of Japan, Hiroshima and Nagasaki.[4] 1942 the United States began a series of air raids on Tokyo, air raids which are considered to be the most destructive ever seen in warfare. An example of this air raid is on March 10, 1945 the United States with the use of B-29's[5] destroyed 267,000 buildings and killing over 100,000 people.[6] The attack on Pearl Harbor had devastating effects on Japans economy, people and future. The attack on Pearl Harbor by Japan will always remain as one of the biggest military mistakes in history.

Sources

[1] http://www.takelifeback.com...
[2] http://www.maps-pacific.com...
[3] http://en.wikipedia.org...
[4] http://en.wikipedia.org...
[5] http://images.wikia.com...
[6] http://en.wikipedia.org...
Debate Round No. 2
1Historygenius

Pro

Invasion of Afghanistan

War: Soviet War in Afghanistan

On December 24, 1979, the Soviet Union deployed forces in Afghanistan to assist the Marxist-Leninist government against the Afghan Mujahideen guerrilla movement. The Soviets hoped to prop-up the Afghan government, gain "global reach", to gain access to the Indian Ocean, and to control is own population (the USSR had a large amount of Muslims and having a country like Afghanistan at its doorstep brought concern). However, the Soviets lost. The Mujahideen were determined and imaginative fighters, they refused to fight the kind of war that the Soviet commanders wanted. The US also supplied and trained them. One thing the Soviets used highly was Hind helicopters, but so much for air superiority when the US gave them Stinger ground-to-air missiles. The Soviet Union was also in economic trouble, the Americans were building up their SDI programs which caused he Sovies to spend vast amounts of money on new weapons. The Soviets were also only safe in their securiy perimeters as the Mujahideen used the high ground and small villages. The war would be known as the "Soviet Union's Vietnam War" and for 9 long years they failed to stop resistance and eventually withdrew.

For more watch this documentary (part 4 does not work in my computer for some reason, but you can watch that to).

http://news.bbc.co.uk...
http://www.guardian.co.uk...




AntiState

Con

Napoleons Invasion of Russia

If Russia has taught the world one lesson is that it is unconquerable. Napoleon would soon realize this when he attempted to invade Russia, resulting in a complete destruction of his army but overall this disastrous invasion would turn the tide of the Napoleonic War. June 24, 1812 Napoleon crossed the Nerman River with the largest army ever seen over half a million soldiers.[1] Russia avoided a confrontation with Napoleons army instead continued to retreat cities and burn the cities in the way, leaving no supplies for Napoleons army behind. Without any actual military confrontation Napoleon had already lost two thirds due to hunger, desertion and fatigue.[2] Finally when Napoleon reaches Moscow he finds the city to be empty and his attempt to force Alexander I into negotiations had failed. Realizing the Russians would not surrender Napoleon instead commanded his army to retreat and start the march home. A march home which as well devastated the French troops and supplies.[3] Napoleon walked out of Russia with a tiny fraction of the troops he had walked in to Russia with, thus leading to the downfall of the First French Empire.

Sources
[1] http://en.wikipedia.org...
[2] http://www.geographia.com...
[3] http://upload.wikimedia.org...
Debate Round No. 3
1Historygenius

Pro

Micromanaging the Vietnam War

During the Vietnam War, President Lyndon Johnson, led the American army for most of the war. Unfortunately the troops, LBJ watched opinion polls and it is hard to fight a war if you wach polls. Commanders could not attack high value targets unless LBJ allowed it. So he needed a briefing on every high value target and the Americans were always a step behind in the war. The North Vienamese used gurrelia tactics against the Americans as well which contributed to the US defeat. LBJ's micromanaging of the war was one of the main reasons the US lost in Vietnam.

http://en.wikipedia.org...
http://history1900s.about.com...
http://www.digitalhistory.uh.edu...
http://listverse.com...
AntiState

Con

Bay of Pigs Invasion

On April 17-19 the United States invaded Cuba with the intentions of overthrowing Cuba's leader, Fidel Castro. The year is 1959 and Fidel Castro has just overthrown the Cuban dictator Batista,[1] the United States immediately became worried with the growing friendly relationship between Castro and Nikita Khrushchev leader of the Soviet Union the eastern enemy of the United States. With this in mind the CIA began to plan an invasion of Cuba during Eisenhower's Administration within three months of John F. Kennedy's presidency the CIA trained 1,400 Cuban exiles and landed on Bay of Pigs.[2] Within three days Cuba defeated the Cuban exiles and put to shame the United States and the CIA. This invasion not only put John F. Kennedy's Administration to shame but as well the United States intelligence, reliance, and strength was questioned. During this time the United States was in the midst of a Cold War, the United States in every way had to prove its superiority to its enemy the Soviet Union. Truly a military defeat by a third world country is no way to show the world of your grand strength. This military action by the United States put to shame face of the western world, the United States.

Sources
[1] http://www.fsmitha.com...
[2] http://www.jfklibrary.org...

ttp://www.youtube.com...
Debate Round No. 4
1Historygenius

Pro

Invade Gallipoli

World War 1

By 1915, World War 1 had ground to a halt. The trench lines stretched through Russia, Belgium, and France and no one was making progress. The German Navy had also successfully blocked all trade routes between Russia and Britain and France. So British Lord of the Admiralty Winston Churchill had a plan. The plan was for a third front to be opened up by attacking Germany's ally, the Ottoman Empire in the Middle East. Then they could reach Russia through the Middle East and bring them supplies. The Gallipoli Campaign took place from April 25, 1925 to January 9, 1916. On theory the idea was good and the plan called for British and French troops to march from Gallipoli to the Ottoman capital of Istanbul. However, the invasion failed. The Ottomans were able to prepare for a land assault and 220,000 troops from the British and French Empires were killed. The Ottomans suffered to with 251,000 of their troops dead.

This campaign was a major failfure for the Allies. While they still won the war, they could not get to Russia and bring supplies nor could they capture Istanbul. It was a failed plan that led to the war in the Middle East to go on longer and contributed to the ultimate defeat of Russia.

http://en.wikipedia.org...
http://listverse.com...
AntiState

Con

AntiState forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by Wallstreetatheist 4 years ago
Wallstreetatheist
Interesting "debate"
Posted by Wallstreetatheist 4 years ago
Wallstreetatheist
Accidentally killing 6 millions Jews and 8 million other in the holocaust would be on my list along with the US intervening in WWI.
Posted by Maikuru 4 years ago
Maikuru
Starting a land war in Asia would be on my list.
1 votes has been placed for this debate.
Vote Placed by TUF 4 years ago
TUF
1HistorygeniusAntiStateTied
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Total points awarded:40 
Reasons for voting decision: Kind of more Facts posting, than actual debate, but I think History genius definitely knows his stuff in this area, and agree that Kurst was a huge mistake. Conduct for the forfeit.