The Instigator
MySubconsciousMind
Pro (for)
Losing
24 Points
The Contender
ThatGuyWithAFace
Con (against)
Winning
26 Points

Bill and Ted is a time paradox!

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 9 votes the winner is...
ThatGuyWithAFace
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/17/2010 Category: Entertainment
Updated: 6 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,736 times Debate No: 13693
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (4)
Votes (9)

 

MySubconsciousMind

Pro

Ok, I am for the topic, Bill and Ted is a time paradox. With in the movie, they are walking and they met themselves from the future, and they converse with the Bill and Ted of the present. Later in the movie the Bill and Ted of the "present" are in the position of the "future" Bill and Ted's. With this, they have become the future Bill and Ted's, and they meet another set of Bill and Ted's, which means those they have met are now "present" Bill and Ted's. Because the "present" Bill and Ted's have to go through this cycle of going into the pass and all around,(the point of the movie) so those of the "present" become the "future" which makes a new set of "presents". So through out the movie, there will b a time paradox, because those of the "future" have to continue on with their lives, what happens to the new "futures" and the new new "futures"? So the logics and everything is in a spin. With this logical reasoning, i believe that this movie is a time paradox, there is no end of this cycle, which makes time irrelevant to all sorts of beings.
ThatGuyWithAFace

Con

Pro has not offered a definition of what a time paradox is.

Definition: A temporal paradox (also called a time paradox and time travel paradox) is a paradoxical situation in which a time traveler causes, through actions in the past, the exclusion of the possibility of the time travel that allowed those actions to be taken.

Ignoring the fact that pro has misused the phrase "time paradox" in his argument (Bill and Ted were able to travel back to their present time perfectly fine) and there is only speculation as to how time travel works, I strongly disagree with pro's conclusion.

First of all, the way in which Bill and Ted traveled through time was with a telephone booth from the future, with which they entered a specific date and time into. This is where pro's argument falls apart, if they were to enter a specific date and time into the machine, they would travel to that exact moment in time and not any time before or after. (i.e. if they traveled to February 15, 1995, at 5:00 pm, they wouldn't show up again at 5:01 pm)

Also, pro seems to believe that this cycle will keep recurring over and over again, when in fact this is false. The past Bill and Ted will arrive in the present, but what happens to them when they arrive in the present is unsure. This is because they essentially create two separate entities of themselves at one specific point in time. It's possible that the Bill and Ted that return to their present arrive in a separate reality, but again, that can only be left to speculation. It is however, impossible for them to have multiple "past selves" return to their future because the machine was designed to only allow them to travel to one specific point in time. So unless the duo decided to return a minute or two later than their other past selves, (which does not happen in the movie) it would be impossible for them to return to the same present multiple times.
Debate Round No. 1
MySubconsciousMind

Pro

Well, as con is explaining, there is an unknown of which what Bill and Ted after they have had gone into the past had done after returning to their final time. But the thing is that, the machine they used was a telephone booth, but even though it was created in the future, this doesn't mean that when they do return and see themselves again, they just disappear. If the Bill and Ted of the present were to meet the future Bill and Ted, that means that at one point in time that they would have to repeat said events in the movie. But once they have returned to the present they meet themselves again, which means the ones they meet must also go through this cycle. Also, they never just traveled into only one time, they went to multiple time periods. Take into consideration, when they went to the past, at means that everything that was happening never happened. In thinking so, then when they were then returning to their own time, they would meet themselves because then time went to that specific moment. Even though they were going to a specific date and time, doesn't mean that this set of Bill and Ted will disappear once meeting themselves. Also, with knowing that mater that is created can not just destroyed or be lost from nothing, than that is stating that the Bill and Ted's that comes back have to be alive, while the other set are continuing their adventure. Also, if you take into consideration, the movie itself is a time paradox, because the events that happen in that movie caused not significant change in history, but still altered.
ThatGuyWithAFace

Con

It would seem that Pro has misinterpreted my argument. I never said that either the past nor present Bill and Ted will cease to exist, only that it would be impossible for multiple Bill and Teds to return to one specific point in time.

While it is true that the past versions of themselves that Bill and Ted meet when they return from the future have to go through what the future selves went through, it is incorrect to assume what happens to this cycle because the two past selves may have traveled to a separate reality that the future Bill and Ted did not travel to, allowing them to pick up the historic figures as well, and travel back to another separate reality in the present.

Also, this movie takes place in a fictional time line. The future that they travel to is one where they are more or less revered as gods, which is of course not at all what our future shall be. The point being that not enough time had passed to show any significant changes that could have occurred from them pulling the various historic figures from their times because none of the figures shown had any true world changing effects on the world as we know it. It is also not known at what point in their lives they were taken, so it is unclear whether this would affect the important decisions they may have made, or if they were to try and tell other people about their journey to the future, whether or not anybody would believe them.
Debate Round No. 2
MySubconsciousMind

Pro

As con is admitting that, within the movie, that it is unclear to know what really could or is happening, than in the sense of it, no one is truly right. But also, the sense of time is that, we are going through the time line of Bill and Ted. Their time line in the movie is that, they do the events they do and return, which is the set time line of the characters in the movie. So Bill and Ted already set a set path for which they follow. This states that the past Bill and Ted's will go through the said events in the movie, but since going back in time, they set for another copy of their lives to be made for which they can then remet themselves. For which it must continue on forever, and since we can't see the whole span of time within the movie, we can not know for sure that there were no effects from bringing historical characters into the present time. Also, it was possible for multiple Bill and Ted's to return to a specific time because there had to of been a set of Bill and Ted's to of gone into the past and on their adventure to come back to the point in time they were in front of that store. So technically, there were multiple Bill and Ted's to return to the same moment in time because Bill is Bill and Ted is Ted, their beings have not changed only the time period they are in. I don't think anyone would believe anyone if they were to tell another person that they have had traveled in time. The whole ending of the movie because it hasn't shown enough we can make a speculation of what that can or could of happened in the future of their infinite lives. That concludes my argument for this debate, thank you Ryan for debating and we shall finally finish this discussion.

In memory:
"Remember when I asked your mom to prom, shut up Ted!"
"Bogus."
Rockin Beethoven!
ThatGuyWithAFace

Con

Unfortunately, whenever pro and I have this argument, we also end up going in circles. To prevent this, I will skip to my closing statement.

-The time machine will only return them to one specific point in time, not a second before or after. Making multiple Bill and Teds returning to the present impossible
-The movie does not provide evidence for or against whether history was altered due to the actions taken by Bill and Ted
-The science and logic behind time travel at this point in time is nothing more than speculation. We can neither prove nor disprove a whether there is truly a time paradox in this movie

That is all. Thank you Corey for the debate, I look forward to seeing this argument between us finally be resolved.

In memory:
"Take them to the Iron Maiden."
"Excellent!"
"Take them to the guillotine."
"Bogus..."
Debate Round No. 3
4 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Posted by Shtookah 6 years ago
Shtookah
Damn vote bombing for Corey much?
Posted by mattrodstrom 6 years ago
mattrodstrom
Most triumphant topic man...

totally heinous response though.

way to do justice to bill and ted thatguy
Posted by ThatGuyWithAFace 6 years ago
ThatGuyWithAFace
Heh, couldn't resist acting like all of the other debaters on this site.
Posted by Shtookah 6 years ago
Shtookah
ho chit ryan with the definition haha
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