The Instigator
Nathaniel_B
Pro (for)
Losing
5 Points
The Contender
WinBoat
Con (against)
Winning
7 Points

Black Lives Matter is stupid.

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/12/2017 Category: Politics
Updated: 1 month ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 685 times Debate No: 104978
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (22)
Votes (2)

 

Nathaniel_B

Pro

Black Lives Matter is not really about attempting to protect Black people. Blacks killing Blacks is the highest percent of Black deaths in America, if Black lives matter, they should be targeting real issues in Black communities across America. My opponent must provide evidence to refute this argument. Also would like to mention that there is a number of Whites in the group as well, which disturbs and confuses me.
WinBoat

Con

Taken from the wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org...

"Black Lives Matter (BLM) is an international activist movement, originating in the African-American community, that campaigns against violence and systemic racism towards black people. BLM regularly holds protests against police killings of black people and broader issues of racial profiling, police brutality, and racial inequality in the United States criminal justice system."

This is, and was the original and still is the intent of BLM (Black Lives Matter). Just by the quote alone is enough to conclude this argument, but for entertainments sake, and for the viewers reading, we can discuss Black Lives Matter which obviously isn't "stupid".

First off, it's important to know that nearly every single political group out there has bad apples (people) and just because there are some bad apples, there is far MORE good apples in this group, and protesting for a cause. The cause itself is pure, it's a group of people black, or white raising awareness of how blacks are mistreated by police which is obvious, mistreated by the court system compared to whites which again is obvious with blacks getting longer sentences.

So to call this political group "stupid" is actually an insult when the intent is raising awareness and again just because there is bad people in the group, it doesn't make the group bad. There are plenty of good people in this group, and that's important to know.

The tactics you see being protested regardless of how questionable they might be is still for a POSITIVE cause. Sure there might be looters in the group (bad apples) but they are in every group, and again there is a bigger majority of GOOD protesters regardless how you view them. There are many videos of positive protests online showing them protesting peacefully. You might see the negative videos because social media in itself focuses on the negative, this includes youtube.

Blacks killing each other is irrelevant.
Debate Round No. 1
Nathaniel_B

Pro

Wow! My first opponent! Now to continue!

"The cause itself is pure, it's a group of people black, or white raising awareness of how blacks are mistreated by police which is obvious, mistreated by the court system"

How are Blacks mistreated by cops? Then again, it isn't race that is the factor in how the cops treat Black people,it is how they respond to requests by the officer.


Now let's look at this: "What was disclosed was Darren Wilson, the officer involved, had acted in self-defense and had reason to fear for his life. Brown fought with Mr. Wilson and tried to take his gun."

Why were the Black Lives Matter morons saying that Brown was innocent when clearly he wasn't?

"Black Lives Matter perpetuates — both online and at their rallies. The group, and all of its umbrella organizations, has claimed that every 28 hours a black man is killed by a police officer."

From the sources listed here, should prove how the group is incredibly stupid.

"The Washington Post’s fact-checker gave the claim four Pinocchios, saying the victims studied in the report were not all unarmed, and they were not all killed by the police. Ouch."

Constantly lying, its stupid.

"
A Harvard study has also disproved Black Lives Matter’s notion that there’s racial bias in police shootings."

Again, no such thing as "Black Lives Matter" it is clear.

"The Black Lives Matter movement also purposely avoids black on black crime — it seems that black lives matter only if they’re killed by whites."

"
Blacks killing each other is irrelevant."

Is that not something that they should be concerned about considering that they push "Black Lives Matter"?

" You might see the negative videos because social media in itself focuses on the negative, this includes youtube."

Stop lying. Provide a link to a video showing them in a peaceful protest.

Source:https://www.washingtontimes.com...;
WinBoat

Con

My opponent opens his argument and rebuttals by these statements he made and I do quote

"How are Blacks mistreated by cops? Then again, it isn't race that is the factor in how the cops treat Black people,it is how they respond to requests by the officer. "

Then he goes on to bring up the Darron Wilson/Michael Brown controversy which I agree is a bad example. However, dead people do not speak, so no one knows what happens, and it's common for police officers to lie. (Personally, I don't care about Brown being shot, he was a thug that was cause on tape).

First off... It's common knowledge blacks are mistreated by police, and the court system. My opponent says it's how they respond to the officer and while that is true for the most part, there are lots of online videos clearly showing the officers abusing blacks, taking advantages of blacks. And I will show the readers more than a few sources, including ones I read yesterday from Yahoo's home page.

Now let's look at this: "What was disclosed was Darren Wilson, the officer involved, had acted in self-defense and had reason to fear for his life. Brown fought with Mr. Wilson and tried to take his gun."

https://www.youtube.com... Rodney King gets beaten by multiple cops
https://www.youtube.com... In this video Police shoot an unarmed therapist trying to take care of his patient
https://www.youtube.com... Eric Garner dies (graphic)
https://www.youtube.com... Just 4 days ago people, police planted cocaine in a black mans wallet. How long have they been doing this?

And so much more but little characters to work.
https://www.youtube.com... showing peaceful movements and protests.

The group was made for injustice towards blacks by police, and court. Not blacks killing blacks, and yes that's irrelevant.

BLM is not stupid. There are stupid people within the group. Over 100 people every year are killed by cops.
Debate Round No. 2
Nathaniel_B

Pro

"First off... It's common knowledge blacks are mistreated by police, and the court system."


Can you verify that this is true? I'm pretty sure this is a lie in itself.

You can't keep bringing up these things and not prove them to be true.

https://www.youtube.com...... Eric Garner dies (graphic) I watched the video, and is there proof he died? You have to show a link to a autopsy image that shows how he (if he did) died.

"BLM is not stupid. There are stupid people within the group. Over 100 people every year are killed by cops."

And you can't back that up either.
WinBoat

Con

My opponent presented a poorly third round. Yes, what I said is true. I provided evidence.

Yes, Eric garner did die. https://www.youtube.com... (video of him dying) notice the cop in the greenish shirt.

Yes, over 100 people are killed every year by cops (Didn't say black people specifically, but they do make up the majority)

https://en.wikipedia.org... official statistics and as you can see, nearly every year, over 100 people are killed by police.

There are many cases of which black people get longer sentencing in court systems than white people.
https://newsone.com...
http://www.abajournal.com...
http://gawker.com...

Obviously, blacks get longer sentences, not sure if my opponent has been living in a cave all these years, or has never had internet up until now, but it's common knowledge by almost everyone I know that blacks do indeed have it the worst in the court system.

My opponent has not provided any proof to his claims, he has only said that the group BLM is stupid. I have provided solid arguments and reasoning why the group was formed, which was for a positive cause meaning that it isn't a "stupid" thing. Rather its for a good cause, but it does have many stupid people in the group, also they do protest some of the wrong deaths like michael brown, trayvon marton, who were thugs, or that 12 year old boy who had a toy gun in his waistband.

Those wrong acts of protesting should NOT define what the group was originally based upon, and the idea of the group. Whether you like it or not, Black lives DO matter and the group is not stupid.
Debate Round No. 3
22 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Joshua213P 2 weeks ago
Joshua213P
more us citizens are killed by us citizens than isis kills americans however news sources and police/swat forces are more concerned with preventing terrorism (?)
Posted by KZC 2 weeks ago
KZC
I don't like the BLM campaign. The fact is that they get offended when it is not just about their lies. Blue Lives Matter has developed as a response to police shootings. There are police out there risking their lives to protect others. Of course there are police who abuse their power, but that is not the majority. Looking at the statistics, black populations have higher rates of crime, which matches how there are more blacks getting arrested or dying. You may base this off race, but it is just as racist to say that black lives are worth more. Police also will shoot when they thing the situation is progressing toward violence regardles of race. If anyone were put under the same stress as the police, there would no doubt be violence ensuing.
Posted by whiteflame 1 month ago
whiteflame
*******************************************************************
>Reported vote: BryanMullinsNOCHRISTMAS2// Mod action: Removed<

7 points to Con. Reasons for voting decision: Con by default.

[*Reason removal*] Not an RFD.
************************************************************************
Posted by Nathaniel_B 1 month ago
Nathaniel_B
+Debating_Horse Thanks man! I do see that Black Lives Matter is nothing but a bunch of liars and race-baiters.
Posted by Debating_Horse 1 month ago
Debating_Horse
I am on (pro)'s side. I wish I could vote though! I'm attempting to get my phone number connected so I can vote!

You did good Nathaniel!
Posted by Nathaniel_B 1 month ago
Nathaniel_B
As "Lucas Guidi" pointed out in a comment from one of your sources

"This headline is false. According to the article this is based on, "On average, blacks receive almost 10% longer sentences than comparable whites arrested for the same crimes." 60% is the difference between the AVERAGE prison sentence for whites compared to blacks, NOT for the same crimes."

And the Eric Garner case, HOW DID HE DIE? You said he died, but did NOT prove how he did.

"Trip

"853 armed"

Why is the amount of people that are armed higher than ones that are not armed?

Black Lives don't matter, and the group is a bunch of liars and race-baiters.
Posted by WinBoat 2 months ago
WinBoat
@ Free_Human_Being

You are wrong. BLM is based upon a premise that blacks are discriminated, and targeted by white cops, and the court system. This is not a falsehood. It is a fact. I provided some sources in the 2nd round such as a white cop planting cocaine in the wallet of a black man.

But the point everyone ignores is the court system giving blacks harsher sentencing than whites. This should be clear as it's seen all the time, and admittedly joked about in comment sections. "If this had been a black man, he would have gotten life", and it's true, because you see these harsher sentences.
White cops do target blacks.

Do I blame them? No. Blacks make up the highest crime rate in the US. Racial tensions rising cause of social media always race baiting.

Whether you like the group or not, it was made for a political cause to bring awareness of how blacks might be mistreated. So this goes back to the question, is the group stupid? No. Are there stupid people in the group? Yes. However, that does not make the cause stupid.
Posted by Free_Human_Being 2 months ago
Free_Human_Being
@WinBoat

The idea of BLM is based upon a premise which assumes a falsehood, therefore; their mere existence is illogical.
Posted by WinBoat 2 months ago
WinBoat
@ Free_Human_Being

While you provide good information. That is just a problem with BLM. Notice, my argument is for the idea of BLM, and what it was supposedly founded on. So the supposed idea is a positive cause. My opponent has argued it's a stupid cause (everything about it from the idea, to the practices of their protest and the people within it), but any positive cause cannot possibly be stupid if that makes any sense.

It's like saying a certain sports team is stupid just cause you aren't a fan of them and they beat your team and that the team you hate does whats best for it's state and yadda yadda (yes this is a very bad example, comparison but I can't think of any at the top of my head right now). Maybe a better comparison is saying Hiter was great when in fact he wasn't or something, but again I am not in the right mind right now to form these comparisons and point I am trying to make.

I'm trying to say that the group BLM although it has many stupid people in it, and regardless of the misinformation, the group was still originally made for a more positive cause. Now regardless of how wrong their facts are, even if they are 100% wrong, their idea (BLM) was still for a good cause originally.

Yes all lives matter would have been a better name, but their group is for blacks being mistreated by police which I provided more than enough sources to show that. Also, mistreated by the court system which is a well known fact, and you cannot deny. Most people know blacks will get harsher, or longer sentencing in the law of court than whites. You cannot possibly tell me you don't know this is a fact.

As for the white cop killing black man. It's a grey area, there is blacks killed for no reason, or mistreated poorly (like the cop putting cocaine in the black guys wallet) and there are a lot of thugs who refuse to follow the orders and get shot due to their own stupidity. Either way, BOTH OF THESE STORIES does not change the originally idea of the group BLM.
Posted by Nathaniel_B 2 months ago
Nathaniel_B
+Free_Human_Being Hey man you understand! :D
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by Debating_Horse 1 month ago
Debating_Horse
Nathaniel_BWinBoatTied
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Total points awarded:50 
Reasons for voting decision: For me, I see that Nathaniel had sources that really did make the Black Lives Matter seem a foolish/stupid cult of people. On con, he has failed to prove how Eric Garner died while being apprehended by police officers, this is one reason why I leaned more to pro (Nathaniel) having better sources, if the con person had proved how Eric died, I would have voted "tied" on reliable sources. Con also used "Wikipedia" which the site cannot be used as a "most reliable" source for information, though the con person did have somewhat good arguments, I still see that Nathaniel did good on this debate.
Vote Placed by jc1996 1 month ago
jc1996
Nathaniel_BWinBoatTied
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Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro seems dodgy on the issue of Black Lives Matter, Con presented clear and concise facts to disprove it. Therefore, Con prevailed because the matter at hand is derogatory and disgusting. Black Lives Matter is not a stupid organization and they campaign against oppression and promote equality among races.