The Instigator
nolemane
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
bluesteel
Con (against)
Winning
14 Points

Blink 182 does not deserve the bashing that they get from so many fans of music

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
bluesteel
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 12/31/2010 Category: Education
Updated: 6 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 3,091 times Debate No: 14207
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (0)
Votes (2)

 

nolemane

Pro

I am a huge fan of Blink 182 and people always criticize them for having repetitive chords, all of their music sounds the same, sing about teenager problems when they are 30 and are immature, true punk fans complain that they are not "real" punk, they are not very skilled with their instruments, they are "sell-outs" for changing their style just to make money. I disagree with most of all of this. I am no connoisseur of music or will i ever be, but their music sounds great to me and if that means that they play the same 3 chords the whole time then so be it! I extremely disagree that their music all sounds the same, i have no clue how "i miss you" and "Aliens Exist" sound at all the same, they don't! One of the things i love about Blink 182 is the fact that they are immature even when they are grown up, it gives teens hope that you can still be young and have immature fun when your older, not everything has to be so serious. Some "True Punk" fans hate Blink 182 because they fell in love with their first two albums "Cheshire Cat" and "Dude Ranch", and then they changed. It is a fact that bands change, and i can argue that they created their own unique genre. So for those punk fans who loved their first two albums can't bash them because for some of those fans, it introduced them to the music they listen to today. As for their instrument skills, who cares? I care about results and what goes into my ears. I love the way it sounds so what does it matter? I love Blink and always will. The reason I am starting this argument is because it bothers me that people hate on such a great band that never labeled themselves as a "punk", band. I also want to understand why the haters hate if you catch my drift.
bluesteel

Con

Thanks for the debate nolemane.

==Burden of proof==

My opponent has the burden to prove that Blink 182 does not deserve the critiques they get. To prove they do not deserve these critiques, my opponent must prove that the critiques are not true. It is not enough for my opponent to assert that he likes their music.

C1) Blink only uses 4 cords

See Youtube video

Blink 182 deserves this criticism because it is true.

C2) Concerts

The core skill of any good band is having a good stage presence and delivering for their fans in concert. I was a huge fan of Blink until I paid $100 to see them in concert. It turns out that Tom can't hit the high notes in real life. http://www.blink182.com... They sound COMPLETELY different in concert; all the vocals are flat and weak.

Also, they have no stage presence. Tom just joked the whole time that he and Mark were gay together. He spent no time getting the crowd excited. Each transition between songs was, "So Mark and I were making out last night. Gosh, he's such a homo."

Worst way I've ever wasted $100.

==Rebuttal==

My opponent proving that he likes the band doesn't prove that they don't deserve the criticisms. RoyLatham likes Bill O'Reilly but agrees some of the criticisms of him are valid. I like bacon, but I know the criticism that it is too fatty is "deserved."

Negated.
Debate Round No. 1
nolemane

Pro

I would like to thank my opponent for responding to my debate.

As for the chords, if it produces good music, then what does it matter? There is a reason why their album "take off your pants and jacket" reached number one on the U.S. charts. People enjoy the music. So i fail to understand why this is a good explanation for why they should be criticized.

While I agree that the concerts are not the same experience as some other bands, it is different in a good way. I have been to a blink 182 concert myself, My buddies and I all had a great experience to the 5 concerts that we have been to of blink 182, all in different stages of their career, as i assume you have only been to one, the link you posted was after their reformation and i can understand that people are going to wonder why a persons voice changed over 4 years... You can't criticize for wanting to continue to do something that they love to do. That is why they got back together, and your telling me that people are frustrated with them because they don't sound the same? And if you didn't notice, a lot of their songs they sing are sped up, they add lyrics, and change lyrics, they are adding to the fun and the environment of the concert. They are the only band i know that cracks jokes on stage and really looks like they are having fun at what they are doing. If you can't appreciate that i don't know what you can. If you have listened to their music before, you should know that they were not going to "excite" the crowd, you should have seen this coming. Also, it gives concerts a taste of something else. I As far as i am concerned people i know return year after year to go to their concerts. You don't go back to something you did not enjoy.
bluesteel

Con

Thanks, nolemane.

==BOP==

Extend that the burden to show that criticisms are not "deserved" is to show that the criticisms are untrue. It is 100% allowed for one person to enjoy something in spite of the criticisms being true. I enjoy bacon but acknowledge that the criticism "it's too fatty" is true. Many people enjoy askbob, but acknowledge that the criticism "he's kind of mean to newbies" is true. People like the book Twilight but acknowledge that the criticism "it has shallow dialogue" is deserved. I enjoyed my really comfortable couch, but acknowledge that the criticism "it's an ugly color" is deserved. My opponent asserting that he still likes Blink 182 in spite of the criticisms is NOT proof that the criticisms are not "deserved."

==Rebuttal==

+...+ denotes a quote from my opponent

C1) They only use 4 chords

The problem is that all their songs DO all sound the same. Between their "Enema of the State" Album and their "Take Off Your Pants and Jacket" album, only 3 songs sound really unique (Adam's Song, What's My Age Again, Story of a Lonely Guy). The only reason that these songs sound different is because of the vocals - they all still use only 4 chords. Besides the chorus, the songs The Rock Show and First Date sound so similar that I routinely confuse the two. The rest of the songs on the albums aren't even worth listening to because they're so similar to "every other Blink song."

+ As for the chords, if it produces good music, then what does it matter? +

Vocals aren't all that matters in a song. Pop singers also get criticisms that their songs "aren't real music" because the backgrounds tend to be very cookie cutter. And a criticism being true doesn't mean that a product is not "good." Things can be good in different ways. A chef who only knew how to use 4 spices could produce the rare masterpiece, just like a band that can only play 4 chords. But criticisms of MOST of his food as being too simplistic are valid. All the Blink songs that suck and didn't ever become popular suck because Blink doesn't know how to play more than 4 chords. If they had more complexity, they would produce more unique songs that could stand on the strength of the guitar/bass playing alone.

C2) Concerts

+ i can understand that people are going to wonder why a persons voice changed over 4 years +

Roger Love, the premier singing vocal coach in Hollywood, says in his book Set Your Voice Free that if you are singing "correctly" it should put no strain on your vocal cords. He taught Hanson to continue to sing high without straining their voices. Chester, from Linkin Park, sings "wrong" and has put a lot of strain on his voice, yet he still manages to hit all the high notes. If he didn't, Linkin Park would also not be worth seeing in concert. Chester's vocal are a centerpiece of Linkin Park, just like Tom's WERE a centerpiece of Blink. It is not inherently true that someone's voice should change after only 4 years, unless that person just went through puberty.

+ You can't criticize for wanting to continue to do something that they love to do. +

Actually, you can. Most people are doing something they love. The horrible pianist may be doing something he loves, but that doesn't make him any less bad. William Hung LOVED singing, but that didn't make his songs any better ("She Bangs") and didn't make Simon's crushing criticism on American Idol any less "deserved."

+ They are the only band i know that cracks jokes on stage and really looks like they are having fun at what they are doing. +

They're all inside jokes about the lead singer and bassist being gay together (which they're not). Bad music and stupid jokes for 3 hours - what a waste of time. Go watch a Linkin Park concert, and you'll see what real show-manship is all about.

+ If you have listened to their music before, you should know that they were not going to "excite" the crowd, you should have seen this coming +

I was SO pumped to see them, which is why it was such a huge letdown. They deserve every criticism of their concert performances that they get. Compare them to any other band and that band probably offers a better concert experience.

+ As far as i am concerned people i know return year after year to go to their concerts. +

They're probably all so stoned that they can't even tell what's going on onstage anymore. Anyway, some people liking something doesn't mean criticisms of it aren't deserved. Many people think that the Leaning Tower of Pisa is really beautiful, and they go on vacations to see the tower. However, no one can assert that the criticism "it's crooked" is not "deserved."

Negated.
Debate Round No. 2
nolemane

Pro

i feel like you are arguing just to argue. maybe what this website is all about... I am not arguing to argue, i am honestly trying to understand why people do hate blink 182. i guess they do deserve it, i don't feel like debating an extremely opinionated topic, i love blink and always will. Sure they may not be punk rock, but they are pop punk, a genre that i, and many others, enjoy. I actually enjoy/admire all the cons that you have discussed about them. I like the simplicity of the songs, their immature humor, the lyrics about "f$%king a dog, maybe i am weird, but i love their music, and i know you will say that my opinion alone cannot win this argument, but what you have to understand is i don't want to win this argument, i am honestly trying to get inside of the head of someone who apposes their music, i want to thank you for posing a good argument and I am going to raise the white flag and forfeit. Good debate, sorry for ending it abruptly
bluesteel

Con

Thanks for the honesty nolemane.

Often times on this site I am just arguing for the sake of arguing. But in this case, I'm honestly a former avid Blink 182 fan that was completely alienated by them. The 3rd CD I ever purchased was Blink 182. While I was delighted that Eminem seemed to evolve over time (although he's backpedaled recently as far as maturity level), I was annoyed that Blink didn't seem to bring anything new with their newer music (the problem with only using 4 chords). Also, I'd been to a number of great non-Blink concerts so I thought I knew what to expect out of a concert, but I was annoyed to learn that Blink 182 wastes their fans' hard-earned money with a half-hearted performance. Travis Barker had a really cool drum solo at the end, but the entire rest of the day was a HUGE disappointment.

Hopefully I've provided some insight into why some people criticize Blink 182.

My opponent says he's forfeiting the debate. I guess that means that you all should vote all 7 points to Con.

Thanks for the debate nolemane and thank you all for judging.
Debate Round No. 3
nolemane

Pro

nolemane forfeited this round.
bluesteel

Con

Vote Con.
Debate Round No. 4
nolemane

Pro

nolemane forfeited this round.
bluesteel

Con

Game over

Yay there's bolding now ^^
Debate Round No. 5
No comments have been posted on this debate.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by bluesteel 6 years ago
bluesteel
nolemanebluesteelTied
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Vote Placed by LaissezFaire 6 years ago
LaissezFaire
nolemanebluesteelTied
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Total points awarded:07