The Instigator
JayDaylDayJay
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
JustinAMoffatt
Con (against)
Winning
9 Points

Bobba Fett Is NOT a Badass

Do you like this debate?NoYes+0
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 3 votes the winner is...
JustinAMoffatt
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 7/9/2013 Category: Miscellaneous
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,783 times Debate No: 35429
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (4)
Votes (3)

 

JayDaylDayJay

Pro

First round for acceptance only. I am talking About the Bounty hunter, Bobba Fett from Starwars Movies only. No alternate universes.

Round one: Acceptance
Round two: Argument
Round three: Rebuttal
Round four: Closing Statements

Con will be arguing that Bobba Fett IS a Badass.

Definition of Badass: a highly offensive term meaning tough, intimidating, or powerful.
JustinAMoffatt

Con

You have offended the honor of my vod, Boba Fett.

I accept.

I'm Justin, and I will be arguing that Boba Fett is a Bad---, even in the events of the movies alone.

It's on.
Debate Round No. 1
JayDaylDayJay

Pro

"Bounty Hunter"

In all that we have seen in the movies Bobba Fett caught NO bounties. Like, if he is a bounty hunter, who did he catch?

Last resorts.

When Darth Vader set up some bounties hunters to catch Han, Leia, the Droids, and Luke He SPECIFICALLY pointed out Bobba and said "no disentegrations" ( ) This means that Bobba Fett is SO bad he has to go t the last resort every time he tries to hunt someone.

Cloud City

When Bobba Fett found them HE called up Darth Vader and Darth Vader caught Han Solo ( sorry for horid quality only video I could find ) When Han entered the room he shot at Vader, the threat, not Bobba. Bobba just merely stood by him.

Jabbas Palace

All Bobba did was hang around and party, when it was time to defend Han and kill Luke all he did was to try to fight a horrible Jedi and get killed by a blind guy! His equipment is horribly defective, and a staff made him jet pack away and fall into the only sandpit hundreds of miles way from any other pit with a deadly monster in it. Then he dies. (I am aware that in the EXTENDED universe he gets out, but in the movie he dies and doesn't get out.)
JustinAMoffatt

Con

Let me clear something up. While we are debating Boba, according to what we see in the movies, we cannot disregard what is implied or known outside of the movies. My opponent commits both errors in his reasoning.

First, the fact that we do not see Boba Fett's previous kills/captures means nothing. We also didn't see Yoda's previous 900 years of existence, Darth Vader's hunt of the last of the jedi order, or Sidious removing the need for the senate through a long and (no doubt) infinitely slow process of political shifting. However, it is implied that these things did happen, and to assume they didn't because we don't see them on film is preposterous. According to the movies, Yoda still trained Jedi long before the events of the movies.

Second, just because we are debating the movies, and not EU (Expanded Universe), doesn't mean we disregard the EU entirely. Can I bring up Boba's deeds after the events of the movies to support my arguments? No. But my opponent knows that Boba wasn't killed by the sarlaac, and the movie never says he was, so he can't use that as an argument.

P1: Bounty Hunter

Boba Fett is clearly a bounty hunter of much prestige int he galaxy. Otherwise, Darth Vader would not have wasted his time hiring the mandalorian's services. My opponent must understand that Boba's past accomplishments still remain, because the movies establish them as a known precedent. I have explained how his point is invalid.

P2: Last resorts

Boba is a man who gets the job done. This is why Vader specifically spoke to him. Boba will follow the contract to the letter, but nothing more. If Vader hadn't specified that he wanted Han Solo alive, then Boba would've fulfilled his contract by disintegrating the smuggler instead. It's only the logical thing to do as a bounty hunter. In fact, it's Boba's reputation at getting most killings done thoroughly (what's more "dead" than disintegrated?) that earns him the extra command from the dark lord.

P3: Cloud City

Boba Fett was hired to do exactly what he did. If you recall the video you brought up just before, about "no disintegrations", Vader emphasized the word find. Again, Boba Fett followed his orders to the letter. He fulfilled the contract, and then let Vader take it from there, as was their agreement. The only reason he even stayed was because he had yet another job that he was working.

Also, if you realize, Boba Fett was there for backup in that situation. Boba was the silent death threat that prevented further action on the part of our dashing heroes. Why were they so scared of him? Because he's a bad-ss, that's why.

P4: Jabba's Palace

I believe my opponent forgot Boba's actions as yet another "silent death threat". He even earned high praise from Jabba for his bravado in a hostile situation. Boba guaranteed that Princess Leia's corpse would hit the floor before that grenade went off. I do not have a clip, seeing as how it is not on youtube, ( :( ) but and Star Wars aficionado should have knowledge of this scene. Combined with the fact that Boba did not, in fact, die here, these events only boost Boba's legendary levels of awesomeness and bad-ssery.



Now, since I've refuted/turned all my opponent's points, I will provide some Con Points to this argument.

P1: Boba Fett is a walking arsenal.

What screams intimidation more than a gun? A bigger gun.
What screams intimidation more than a bigger gun? A flamethrower.
What screams intimidation more than a flamethrower? A backpack missile!

Who has all of these and more on him at all times? Boba Fett.

http://www.bobafettfanclub.com...

P2: The Mandalorian armor is the definition of bad-ss.

Mandalorian armor, such as what Boba Fett wears, is intimidating, powerful, and tough.

http://starwars.wikia.com...

The blank and dark facemask pierces souls. The charred armor betrays a history of severe and intense conflicts, all of which Boba has survived. The wookie hair braids show an experienced hunter is udnerneath the suit. The tattered cape shows that you can shoot at Boba Fett, but he won't die. He's even got a jetpack! Mandalorians don't mess around. Why? Cause they're bad-asses. They mean business. Boba Fett is a fine example of this.

P3: Slave I

Boba Fett is the bad-ss owner of a bad-ss ship, the Slave I.

Just how bad-ss is it? Check it out.



Sadly, the audio in that clip is unavailable. However, it is not needed to prove my point. The ship's bad-ssery only proves that Boba is that much more of a bad-ss.


For all these reasons, and many more I could offer, Boba Fett is a bad-ss.

Your move, Pro. May the force be with you.
Debate Round No. 2
JayDaylDayJay

Pro

I accept that we can not throw out the inference of it. And am sorry for not realizing this before, now let us continue.


P1: Bounty Hunter

While we can infer he caught a few, but we can not infer that he caught a lot, only a few enough to be called on by Darth Vader, and we cant even be sure he called upon them. What if he just posted up a flyer at a bar, and while Bobba was drinking his sorrows away he saw it and drunkinly drove there.

We were TOLD Yoda lived his previous 900 years, and did train other Jedi. We were never told about how Bobba caught bounty's.

P2: Last Resorts

There are two sides of a bounty, Life/Death you can bring them in alive and get MORE money or you Can kill them, take a photo and get LESS money. If Bobba Fett was a GOOD bounty hunter, he would capture them alive to get more money, instead of getting less since he cant do anything but fire a laser at someone.

P3: Cloud City

First off I want to hear about this other contract that he was there for. Secondly if Han saw him as the biggest threat in the room, he'd have shot him first, not Vader.

P4: Jabba's Palace

I'm sorry to sound like a dou*he but if you don't have the clip I cant take your word for it, And neither can the spectators of this debate. I would like to infer that when he fell in the Pitt, his horribly taken cared of armour/equipment would be crushed by the sarlac's teeth. For when Han Solo hit him just by turning around with a pole he flew off, hit the sand vehicle and fell in. That says that he doesn't take too much care in his equipment.








C1: Bobba Fett is a walking arsenal.

If your equipment is horribly taken cared of, why would this even matter?! If you're about to shoot a missile and it jams? That doesn't scream Bad-ss, that screams L0ser.

Two, don't EVEN bring up a site for this, I am JUST going by this from the movies, if you have a clip from the movie that says he has a flamethrower on him, go ahead. Post it.

C2: The Mandalorian armor is the definition of Bad-ss.

As I said do not bring up any other sites. Only movies clips.

C3: Slave I

That is, his "FATHER'S" that he got after he died. I agree JENGO Fett is a bad-ss but not Bobba. Bobba Fett is also just another CLONE he is an unaltered exact replica of his father, raised as a son. The same clones that also died by the hands of EWOKS ( I like the ewoks FWI I have nothing against them ) So all the clones are technically his brothers. And apparently all these apples fell TOO far from the tree.




JustinAMoffatt

Con

We are debating Boba Fett's bad-ssery during the timeline of the movie events. We are debating him based off of what is shown/implied through the movies. Outside sources should be allowed so long as they pertain to what is shown in the movies. (E.G. I used a picture to show Boba's armor and arsenal, which is fully displayed in the movies, from an outside site. This is reasonable, seeing as it was just showing his equipment he had on screen.)

Also, my opponent agreed that we must accept EU facts, even if they can't be the reasons why Boba is a bad-ss. However, these points can be used in support of arguments.

P1: Bounty Hunter
Darth Vader, dark lord of the sith, the emporor's right hand, the one who cleansed the galaxy of the jedi order, and the death of Obi-Wan Kenobi and the Emporor himself. You think that Vader, or the galactic empire, would prefer to hire random thugs rather than use their own army? No. Those bounty hunters were the best of the best. It'd be preposterous to assume otherwise. Also, the EU clearly states Boba has an impressive kill/capture count already.

http://starwars.wikia.com...

However, I feel the use of EU (while already conceded) will be constested (as any smart debater would) again, due to the fact that you've practically handed me the victory with it. This is fine. My point stands without it. But it's the cherry on top.

P2: Last Resorts

(Sigh) That's how bounties work in our galaxy. That's not how they work in Star Wars!

http://starwars.wikia.com...

And obviously Boba Fett could capture them alive, just like he was asked to! He proves his own competence by completing the very mission you speak of. Vader was just making himself clear to Boba because Boba would've been too efficient (disintegration) if he hadn't specified he wanted him alive. (This point also shows Boba had a rep, which would support the refutation of P1)

P3: Cloud City

Um... the other contract was the delivery of Han Solo to Jabba the Hutt... remember now? Haha. It's a pretty pivotal part of the storyline. Basically, Boba (because he's such a bad-ss) kills two birds with one stone.
If you look at your clip, Boba doesn't appear until Vader has disarmed Han. This just goes to show how Boba enforced that Han couldn't run.

P4: Jabba's Palace

No worries, my friend. I just assumed that any Star Wars fan would remember it. It's pretty iconic. No matter! I have found a clip.

http://www.dailymotion.com...

It's at the beginning, and you can clearly see the part where Boba is the only one who remains cool (and a source of power and intimidation) throughout the ordeal.

C1: Arsenal

You have no justification for your claim. As far as the movies go (and the EU), Boba's weaponry was in peak condition. There was never a moment where his missile jammed. Working equipment, like Fett possessed, is bad-ss.

Again, you must go by what is inferred by the EU. If Boba doesn't use the flamethrower in the movies, then I can't quote him using the flamethrower as a reason why he's bad-ss. However, I can quote him owning it as a reason. He does. Therefore, he is bad-ss.

C2: Armor

Wow... I was a bit underwhelmed by the refutation here. Haha. Again, we're not going off of movie clips, but movie events. And you can clearly see his armor in ANY clip. His armor is intimidating on its own, and obviously strikes fear in the hearts of other characters. Therefore, it is bad-ss, and so is he.

C3: Slave I

How he acquired the ship is of no consequence. The ship is bad-ss. The ship is Boba's. Therefore, Boba's ship is bad-ss. The ship is part of Boba's equipment. The ship is bad-ss. Therefore, the ship alone makes Boba bad-ss.

Boba being a clone would also be of no consequence. (The definition of bad-ss says nothing about clones being excluded.) HOWEVER, you have conceded the debate with this useless point. How so?

Well, it's simple.

Who did you just admit was bad-ss? Jango Fett.

Who did you just admit was an "unaltered, exact replica of his father (Jango)"? Boba Fett.

Therefore, Boba Fett is a bad-ss, as conceded by you.



Meh gar takisir ner vod, Boba, gar takisir ni.
Debate Round No. 3
JayDaylDayJay

Pro

I would like to say that we can INFER about it, and from THE MOVIE, not information OUTSIDE OF IT. And just because Bobba is a clone of Jengo does not mean that by edition he is as well. That is why I brought up the clones, if you call him a bad-ss for reason he is a clone of Jengo then you would have to call all the other clones bad-ss as well.


To wrap up, I gave 4 reasons as to why Bobba is not a Bad-ss and provided reasons that are shown in the movie without listing any other resources outside of it. I still believe that Bobba is not a bad-ss from the interpretation from the movie. But as fans make him out to be a bad-ss whenever possible I decided to refute it. I think I have wasted my time seeing as my text was misread than the way I had written it. But to whichever way people have read it, I think I still have some to learn, thank you for debating. And thank you for reading.
JustinAMoffatt

Con

If I am correct, you stated we would be debating Boba Fett according to the movies. However, you didn't specify we couldn't use EU information. Then, you conceded that we must accept the EU in our debate, we just can't debate the Boba Fett of the EU (which we weren't. We were debating the Boba Fett of the movies). I accepted that. However, I see nothing wrong with using outside sources to show greater detail about the Boba Fett of the movies, and most of my points stood (if not all of them) without the support of the EU.

As for the clone argument, it isn't really required for a Con victory. However, it does warrant one. You admitted someone was a bad-ss, and then stated that the very person you're trying to prove ISN'T a bad-ss is an exact clone of that person. Logically, your argument just doesn't make sense. Sorry.

In Conclusion

Boba Fett is a bad-ss because:

He's a successful bounty hunter (P1)

He's got a reputation (P2)

He's street smart AND he's threatening (P3)

He prevented a grenade from going off in Jabba's Palace! (P4)

He owns practically every cool weapon imaginable. (C1)

His armor is scary as all get out! (C2)

His ship, as Pro conceded, is bad-ss. (C3)



So yep. Boba Fett is a bad-ss, even just from the movies. I would like to point out that my opponent didn't argue at all in the final round, leaving my points from round 3 untouched.

Vote Con, or else bad-ss Boba Fett gon' cut you.


-------------------------------------------------------------------

Not to opponent:

Hey, I'm sorry if I frustrated you. I didn't mean to. I just argued the debate as it went, and how I saw it. I believed in my position, and I believe I showed it to be justified according to the confines of the round. I enjoyed this debate, not cause I felt I didn't totally fail, but because it was Star Wars and fun! I would like to do more of these. Maybe we can work something out sometime?

For a fairly new debater, you're catching on very quick. Impressive work. :)

Thanks for debating!
Debate Round No. 4
4 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Posted by JustinAMoffatt 4 years ago
JustinAMoffatt
Well... TYPICALLY you kinda argue with closing statements. Most people I've met will just argue in the last round, but they add a conclusion. Sorry if that was not your intention, but I don't think I did any rebutting anyways. :P so at least it was balanced. Lol.
Posted by JayDaylDayJay 4 years ago
JayDaylDayJay
But i probably didn't realize that "closing statements" Mean you can wright anything as you wrap up, I realize this now. And i will only learn from this experience :P
Posted by JayDaylDayJay 4 years ago
JayDaylDayJay
I didn't argue in round three because it is closing statements, NOT rebuttals.
Posted by JustinAMoffatt 4 years ago
JustinAMoffatt
I've made a typo! I apologize. The second group of "P arguments" should be "C arguments"! XP Leave it to me to make a mistake like that!
3 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Vote Placed by DeFool 4 years ago
DeFool
JayDaylDayJayJustinAMoffattTied
Agreed with before the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Agreed with after the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: After having noted that Fett was defeated by a blind guy turning around with a pole, I was doubtful that any act of fierceness could restore his reputation. However, being an exact clone of the universally dreaded Jango saves him. Using only the movies provides a sampling of Fett's career that is small enough to possibly be unrepresentative and potentially misleading. Even so, his actions in these movies show a person that is at least ornery enough to rub shoulders with outlaws, soldiers, overlords and giant sand lions of rage.
Vote Placed by calculatedr1sk 4 years ago
calculatedr1sk
JayDaylDayJayJustinAMoffattTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: Fun debate! Bobba isn't one of my favorites, so I was pretty openminded. Justin made a strong case and I tend to agree. Any subordinate who stands in front of Vader clearly would not have stumbled in from the cantina. Spending any time in Vader's presence is a quick way to end up dead, but Bobba isn't phased at all. Even if he did die against the sarlac as it appeared he might have in the movie, he still had a battlescarred and successful past, cool gear, killer reputation, and the identical unaltered genetics of the legendary Jango Fett, whose role he followed even though he was orphaned at a young age. The funny part of this debate: competitors preferred to edit it as "Bad-ss", lol!
Vote Placed by ModusTollens 4 years ago
ModusTollens
JayDaylDayJayJustinAMoffattTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: Con effectively refuted Pro's assertions, and I'd like also to briefly point out that being the second biggest threat in a room containing a Sith Lord does not disqualify one from the title of "Badass."