The Instigator
BeatTheDevil89
Pro (for)
Winning
15 Points
The Contender
Darkmaff666
Con (against)
Losing
7 Points

Bush's U.S. stimulus package of 2008 will not be very successful.

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 6/12/2008 Category: Miscellaneous
Updated: 8 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 839 times Debate No: 4395
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (2)
Votes (6)

 

BeatTheDevil89

Pro

Since the last debate on this topic was so miserably un-eventful, I decided to challenge Darkmaff666 to a real debate now (lets see if you really worked on your case like you said you would). Again, that the stimulus package as is will not significantly help the looming economic recession. I will prove

I. That such a plan will not help
II. That the waste of money will make things work
III. Why it will not work and what Bush should have done

His plan, like all his other plan for the economy, do nothing for those who really need the help and only provide small benefits to the middle class. House prices are falling, debt is rising, jobs are being lost, gas is outrageously expensive, and money is being squandered by the Bush administration. This so called stimulus package is just another example of that.
Darkmaff666

Con

well just to set mey grounds in this debate i will just say that the economice stimulus act will help out the united states in order to help out the economy we need to get the help from the government in order for that to hppen if t least few dollars go to store nationwide we will be helping the economy grow
Debate Round No. 1
BeatTheDevil89

Pro

Lets look at what is wrong with the economy before we determine the effect of the stimulus.

1) Housing bubble popped which led to the
2) Credit crisis which led to
3) Less shopping and income for the store which led to
4) Lay-offs

The housing crisis allowed people to purchase more things through credit such as second mortgages or taking out equity. This led to a consumption boom that helped the economy. Eventually, people realized that these houses were not worth the prices they were going for and the bubble popped and prices fell. This happened just around the time the credit bills came home. Plus the bubble led to the subprime mortgages (low money down and high interest rates). This allowed people to but mortgages they couldn't afford, making the credit crisis even worse. Not to mention outrageous gasoline prices – this has created a sort of perfect storm that will push us into a recession.

"Citigroup has announced plans to eliminate 21,000 jobs; investment banks in general will shed 40,000. The mortgage industry is in a state of meltdown; and Sprint--how did they get into this?--will lay off 4,000 full-time employees as well as 1,600 part-time and contract workers. " Plus there are the thousands of jobs that the airliners have laid off.

The current package will provide most families with several hundred to one thousand dollars depending of family size. Lets assume that a family of four get $700. Where is this going to go? That's the most important question because were it goes determines the outcome. If it went to someone who has some debt (almost everyone who got the package) then it would most likely go to paying off that debt, therefore not putting it into the economy because it is essentially money already spent that's being paid later. If it is someone very financially stable and frugal, it will either go towards needs or a savings account. The poor and the unemployed would most likely spend this on necessities. But they are only a small portion of the population, hardly enough to compensate for the bad economy.

These payments are also dwarfed by the sheer amount of lost money. Someone who has a second mortgage, lost their job, or is just generally feeling the burden of a stagnant economy isn't going to be helped with a couple hundred bucks.

Moreover, just do they feel included, Congress also proposed an extension of the food stamp and unemployment programs.

"Currently, the food stamp allotment amounts to about $1 per meal, and when four Democratic Congresspersons tried living on that for a week last May they ended up even crankier than if they'd had to sit through a week-long filibuster by Tom DeLay."

"As for unemployment benefits: they last just twenty-five weeks in most states and end up covering only a third of people who are laid off."

Any extensions of these programs would be insufficient unless they were given exorbitant amounts of funds, which Bush would not approve of.

The stimulus package won't work because

1) The package doesn't concentrate on those most affected.

2) It doesn't provide adequate amounts of relief.

3) Doesn't eventually "fix" the credit, housing, or gasoline problem. It just gives a small and short break from those realities.

Sources

http://www.thenation.com...
http://www.thenation.com...
Darkmaff666

Con

you know what this is your win i give up on debate till next school year when i actually care so yeah i don't really wanna i just would love to observe
Debate Round No. 2
BeatTheDevil89

Pro

Ok then, I just need to make the limit so let me say that this string would be a good test to see if people actually vote for the winner of the debate and not just vote this issue.
Darkmaff666

Con

yeah well i would like say that this topic just isn't interesting only due to the fact that this president has made many mistakes before on more would hurt more...right...i man look the economy is slowly going into another great depression slowly "baby steps" right now all we could do is just know that it is and stop it..yeah im just saying...well sorry i didn't try and well good luck with any other debates u may have......
Debate Round No. 3
2 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Posted by alibaba 8 years ago
alibaba
Yeah, they are going to pay the cable bill on the house they just lost.
Posted by tangerineman91 8 years ago
tangerineman91
A large portion of my economics class this year dealt with this issue. The extra money is not intended to directly help anyone. When people have more money, they usually use it (many poor people who don't have any money for food have cell phones and pay for cable tv- my mom has worked with social services). That creates more demand which results in an overall beneficial supply-demand change. The money is not intended to help people pay for mortgage or housing. My teacher, who is a liberal (just to throw that out there), outlined all this stuff.
6 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Vote Placed by Darkmaff666 7 years ago
Darkmaff666
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Vote Placed by Protagoras 8 years ago
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Vote Placed by BeatTheDevil89 8 years ago
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Vote Placed by Olhando 8 years ago
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Vote Placed by InquireTruth 8 years ago
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Vote Placed by gahbage 8 years ago
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