The Instigator
buglyn
Pro (for)
Losing
1 Points
The Contender
ishallannoyyo
Con (against)
Winning
18 Points

Cameras in classrooms

Do you like this debate?NoYes+0
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 4 votes the winner is...
ishallannoyyo
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/28/2012 Category: Technology
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 8,544 times Debate No: 25891
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (1)
Votes (4)

 

buglyn

Pro

So I am going to try to pass this bill in putting cameras in public schools. There is some in the hallways, but if there were cameras in the classrooms, I would think that it would cut down on theft, drugs, and many other crimes that goes on in the classes. Please be honest, because I would love to use anyone's opinions.
ishallannoyyo

Con

I thank my opponent for instigating this debate. I would like to lay down a plan to guide this debate. I will assume that by "cameras" my opponent means video cameras mounted on the wall and clearly visible.

Cameras - video cameras installed into classrooms from Grades K - 12. These cameras will record what happens during the day and then will be viewed by the principal at the end of the school and the principal only to prevent tampering with the tapes

I await my opponent's opening arguments.
Debate Round No. 1
buglyn

Pro

I don't think the principal should look at them everyday, just like if something was to happened, then he could always go back to look at the cameras to see what really happened. Some people say that the government is too involve in our lives anyways, but I think this is a good thing that the government should do. I believe that it would be able to decrease the use of drugs, bulling, etc.
ishallannoyyo

Con

I thank my opponent for his comments. I will now move on to refutation and provide my own arguments.


just like if something was to happen,


Just if what was to happen? The teacher is present at all times, would the camera catch something the teacher couldn’t?


I believe that it would be able to decrease the use of drugs, bullying, etc.


Does bullying and drug use occur in front of a teacher? Does somebody do drugs RIGHT IN FRONT of a teacher in a classroom? Will someone bully a child RIGHT IN FRONT of a teacher? Of course not, this camera would do nothing to reduce any illicit activity.


My opponent hasn’t provided many arguments or evidence, merely an opinion. I have refuted his points, I will now provide my own arguments.


C1: CAMERAS WILL DO NOTHING TO STOP ILLICIT ACTIVITY


The teacher is already present, illicit activity such as drugs and bullying doesn’t often occur in a classroom. Why? Because the teacher is legally responsible to look over the kids. This is clear logic, would you do something against the law in front of a cop? Of course not. This camera will catch nothing and stop nothing, only invade kid’s privacy even more.


C2: INVASION OF PRIVACY


We don’t need to be so suspicious of today’s youth that we need to watch them wherever they are going to make sure they aren’t doing anything bad. We already can search a locker if needed, and teachers already preside over halls and classrooms. This camera will only further the feeling in kids that adults don’t trust them, that adults need to have them watched. We don’t want to foster this mistrust in schools.


C3: COST


CCTV cameras cost upwards of $1000 [1]. In Junior High and Senior High, students have Math, Science, Social, and ELA core subjects. These are generally taught by four different teachers in four different classrooms. That is already $4000 for a single class in a grade. Depending on the school, there may be 3, 4, 5 Grade 7 classes. That is minimum $12 000 on cameras that won’t catch anything! This is a gross misallocation of resources.



I have refuted my opponent’s points, provided my own points and fulfilled my BOP. It is a clear and easy vote CON.



SOURCES:



  1. http://www.cctvcamerapros.com...


Debate Round No. 2
buglyn

Pro

Ok, I see your point. But the teacher is not always in the classrooms, with a class of 40 or more students it is not always easy to see what goes on with every individual student.

1. Proof
Awhile ago there was a basketball coach who cheated on his wife with a girl basketball player. How does this have anything to do with it? If they put more cameras in the school, wouldn't the school been able to find out a lot easier, instead of having to deal with lies.
I know a guy that when the teacher was OUT of the classroom would go on the teachers computer and change his grade! Yea, sometimes the teacher needs to go out in the hallways or go see the principal.

2. Privacy
Yea, we all need privacy, but not all the time. We do need to be watched sometimes. Like I said, if the teacher is not there at the time, then a lot of stuff can happen in the five minutes that he/she is gone. I have heard of perverted stuff going on with students during school! Now that is just sick!

3. Cost
I go to a private school, so my parents have to pay the taxes which go to the public schools. So can they not use the money from taxes to pay for the cameras? They can be updated like every 5 to 10 years. So it's not like they are spending 20,000 dollars every year.
ishallannoyyo

Con

I thank my opponent for his comments.


But the teacher is not always in the classrooms, with a class of 40 or more students it is not always easy to see what goes on with every individual student.


True, but it is pretty obvious if you come into the room and see two kids in the back with clouds of smoke hanging around them what they’ve been doing.


Awhile ago there was a basketball coach who cheated on his wife with a girl basketball player.


There is no source proving this, this could be made up for all I know.


If they put more cameras in the school, wouldn’t the school been able to find out a lot easier, instead of having to deal with lies?


First of all, the resolution is cameras in CLASSROOMS and classrooms alone. Not other areas of the school. Secondly, my opponent has said that the principal would only review tapes if something was to happen, not every day. Thus if no one knew about this and it wasn’t reported then obviously the principal wouldn’t review the tapes.


I know a guy that when the teacher was OUT of the classroom would go on the teachers computer and change his grade!


There is no proof of this, only a personal experience, thus it is not evidence in a debate.


I have heard of perverted stuff going on with students during school! Now that is just sick!


Baseless assumption. Perverted actions (if they even occur) are still not likely to occur in a classroom, but more likely outside of school, behind the school, etc. This is through pure logic, will you commit a crime if you know a police man is coming? Of course not!


So my parents have to pay the taxes which go to the public schools.


Yet teachers continue to be laid off and economic struggles continue to weigh schools down. These cameras will only increase these debts.


So it’s not like they are spending 20, 000 dollars a year.


No, 20, 000 dollars for every class room every 5 years.



I have refuted all of my opponent’s arguments and have defended my own. It is clear for voters to VOTE CON.

Debate Round No. 3
buglyn

Pro

So how would I prove these experiences? It's not like I have it recorded or anything, but I know that they have happened, whether you believe me or not.
I was just saying earlier that the principal would not have to review the tapes after the end of the day. But I did not mean that he/she just views them whenever a problem approaches. I meant, that when he/she is in his/her office then they can just see what is going on in every classroom. But it would be good to have cameras in the classroom because just in case something does happened, and they could always go back to look at what really happened.

There has been perverted things going on in the school, people has had sex and other disturbing things going on in the school. Oh, and doing drugs does not always have smoke, like actual pills. So you would not believe what goes on in the classrooms.

The reason why teachers are being laid off is because of our idiotic president, so that is not our fault. Most schools have money, so most wouldn't be a problem. Oh, and most schools have cameras in the hallways, so it wouldn't be as much as you think. Plus, I think it should be only for middle and high school.
ishallannoyyo

Con

I thank my opponent for his comments. I would like to take this time to refute the arguments brought forth by my opponent.

So how could I prove these experiences? It’s not like I have it recorded or anything, but I know that they happened, whether you believe me or not.

That’s the point, in a debate personal experience cannot be proven, and as it cannot be proven it isn’t evidence. For all I know you could’ve made this up!

But I did not mean that he/she just views them whenever a problem approaches. I meant, that when he/she is in his/her office then they can just see what is going on in every classroom.

Do you think that a single principal would be able to concentrate on administrative duties and watch over 20 monitors minimum at the same time??? Of course not, either the principal would only be watching the monitors, thus taking away from administrative duties and slowing the entire school down, or will only be doing administrative work, not focusing on the monitors, thus rendering them useless. Another possibility is that the principal occasionally glances at the monitors, but in a 40 minute period there is a very short time frame.

There has always been perverted things going on in school, people has had sex

In a classroom? I didn’t think so.

Oh, and doing drugs does not always have smoke, like actual pills

In a classroom? No proof, I don’t think so. This is just like my police analogy (which has remained unrefuted).

The reason why teachers are being laid off is because of our idiotic president

This is unrelated, whatever the matter, schools do not have the money as teachers are being laid off. Over 132, 000 teachers were laid off in 2011 alone! [1]

Most schools have money, so most wouldn’t be a problem.

I have disproved this in the above source and argument.

Oh, and most schools have cameras in the hallways

The fact that schools have cameras in hallways has no bearing in this debate. The hallway and the classroom are very different, in a classroom the teacher is there to supervise, not in the halls. Also, the cameras are not there to catch anything per se, as said in the following source [2] the camera should never make it feel like if a person is attacked that they will be rescued. Thus, their effect in the hallway is minimal as well.

Plus, I think it should be only for middle and high school.

I’m sorry, but I posted in R1 the definitions as you hadn’t, and the definitions were from grade K – 12, you did not dispute this so it was accepted as the definition. Thus, this point (which is really just your opinion) is null.

Bringing up definitions, we have focused this debate on junior and high school, yet what about elementary schools? Does my esteemed opponent think that perverted acts and drugs will occur in an elementary school?? Clearly, the implementation of a camera system in elementary schools is a massive incursion of privacy and a massive waste of money. I beg my opponent to address this point in his final round.

I have refuted my opponent’s arguments, defended my own, and have fulfilled my BOP. Thus, it is clear for voters to VOTE CON.

SOURCES:
1. http://thinkprogress.org...

2. https://www.ncjrs.gov...

Debate Round No. 4
buglyn

Pro

Honey, how old are you? This world is not the same that it was ten years ago. Things happen in school all the time, just ask teenages (there is your proof). Whenever the teacher is writing on the board, students can always pass pills.

The school would not have to worry about money, since Americans will more than likely be paying for it.

Seriously, having teachers getting laid off, has nothing to do with this topic.

This would be a safer place with cameras and I don't see why you do not agree with me. Would you want you child going to a place with bulling, drugs, etc. going on without cameras or proctection.

Whenever I pass this bill in the state of Kentucky, then I will gladly message you and tell you how well everything is going with the cameras being in the classrooms.

I have so much more to say, but I'm in a hurry. I will message you more later.
ishallannoyyo

Con

I thank my opponent for an interesting debate. I would now like to refute the arguments brought forth by my opponent.


Honey, how old are you?


Creeper.


Things happen in school all the time, just ask teenagers


I’m sorry, but I just asked a teenager and they said that this never happens in schools! My opponent has provided no proof that this at all happens in classrooms where teachers are often present. My opponent has not refuted this. This is the exact same as pulling out a gun in front of a police officer. Are you going to do it if you fear being arrested? Of course not! This point has gone completely unrefuted, my opponent has merely said that “this happens”, but has not proved it nor has he provided any evidence to support his blanket claims.


The school would not have to worry about money, since Americans will more than likely be paying for it.


Seriously? The whole point is that America doesn’t have any money to pay for this. Have you heard about the trillion dollar deficit lately? And you think we’ll have money to pay for $1000 cameras for EVERY classroom when we can’t even keep teachers on the job?


Seriously, having teachers getting laid off, has nothing to do with this topic.


Yes it does, it shows the complete lack of money in the system.


This would be a safer place with cameras and I don’t see why you do not agree with me. Would you want your child going to a place with bulling, drugs, etc. going on without cameras or protection.


As I pointed out (with sources and evidence) the cameras in place in schools aren’t supposed to instil a sense of safety. They shouldn’t a child feel safe because there is a camera nearby. Kids aren’t prosecuted if they bully someone in front of a camera. This place would not be safer, this place would lack privacy. Let’s put cameras in the washrooms as sex and drugs might occur there. It makes the place safer! But of course not, because of the massive violation of privacy! Privacy is important too!


Whenever I pass this bill in the state of Kentucky


Good luck with that.



My opponent has provided no substantial evidence, attempted to change his plan, hasn’t refuted my arguments on privacy, cost, and ineffectiveness, and hasn’t responded to my challenge of this bill’s effectiveness in an elementary school. I have refuted all of my opponent’s arguments, defended my own, and it is a clear and easy vote CON.

Debate Round No. 5
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by Jordan56 4 years ago
Jordan56
Good job to both of you. buglyn did okay for a first debate.
4 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Vote Placed by AlwaysMoreThanYou 4 years ago
AlwaysMoreThanYou
buglynishallannoyyoTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: The cost argument alone is a powerful argument against the resolution, but Con also did a pretty good job showing that cameras are unlikely to provide enough of a benefit to be worth the steep charge.
Vote Placed by Smithereens 4 years ago
Smithereens
buglynishallannoyyoTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:03 
Reasons for voting decision: Cons material was far stronger.
Vote Placed by Jordan56 4 years ago
Jordan56
buglynishallannoyyoTied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Who had better conduct:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:-Vote Checkmark-2 points
Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: Con clearly proved why it would be a violation of privacy if video cameras were to be used in the classroom. He dismantled pro's argument like an expert. Pro mainly gave unsourced personal experiences that did not help his case. Pro, though you may think it is true, we have no way of knowing unless you provide resources. That is why personal experiences does not work in a debate like this. You have to figure out a way to debate without using personal experience and instead find factual sources.
Vote Placed by hghppjfan 4 years ago
hghppjfan
buglynishallannoyyoTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:-Vote Checkmark-0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:-Vote Checkmark-2 points
Total points awarded:15 
Reasons for voting decision: I was tied before the debate, but now I realize cameras should not be in classrooms. I always give conduct to the one who seems like they are trying their hardest, which I give to Pro. Spelling and grammer I almost never look into, so I tie you. The rest go to con becuase he made good commets and provided resourses for them.