The Instigator
intenzfrost
Con (against)
The Contender
I_just_plant_the_seed
Pro (for)

Can a Christian prove to me why religon is only way to salvation?

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 12/13/2017 Category: Religion
Updated: 1 month ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 302 times Debate No: 105808
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (18)
Votes (0)

 

intenzfrost

Con

I used be a Christian folk, until I discovered the truth. I am simply here to prove
Christianity a joke.
I need to be explained how that's the only path to salvation.
what is the path.
Do you celebrate Christmas or Easter?
what version of bible do you use?
who is Christianity's god?
I_just_plant_the_seed

Pro

First off, the title of the debate is: "Prove to me why religion is the only way to salvation", but it looks like you want me to prove that Christianity is in fact the only path. I am going to assume that this was a mistake, so I will be Pro for the fact that Christianity is the only path to salvation. Please let me know if you want me to switch it to "Religion is the only way".

Secondly, I want to point out the assumptions you make in your statement. First, you boldly state that you have discovered the truth, and that Christianity is a joke. Then shortly after, you declare that you need to know why it is the only path to salvation. This right off the bat assumes that salvation exists, but it also implies religious pluralism, in which all religions are equally valid and there is not one true religion.

But I see a flaw here. The first assumption I pointed out essentially implies that you are right and Christianity is wrong, but then it appears you go on to affirm that all religions equal. Please clear up any misunderstanding here.


Quick summary of the Christian Worldview:

I want to quick make sure we are on the same page with what Christianity actually teaches. Put simply, it teaches that all humanity is desperately wicked, and suffering from a disease (sin). Then God, in His grace, sends His son to be the antidote for said disease. Now people can either accept the antidote or reject it; however, if you reject it, you will still die of your disease.

Rom 3:23-24, Eph 5:8, Jer 17:9, John 3:19, Rom 5:12, Rom 5:19, Job 25:4, Matt 15:19, Gal 5:19-21, John 3:6, Ecc 7:20

If we assume that Christianity is true, then it becomes obvious why people would believe that He is the only way to salvation, so I believe that this debate would be better titled, "Prove to me that Christianity is true". If that is the case, I would be more that happy to give you my arguments, however it is your debate and your call.





Debate Round No. 1
intenzfrost

Con

First off, the title of the debate is: "Prove to me why religion is the only way to salvation", but it looks like you want me to prove that Christianity is in fact the only path. I am going to assume that this was a mistake, so I will be Pro for the fact that Christianity is the only path to salvation. Please let me know if you want me to switch it to "Religion is the only way".


)))))))i Admit im new to all this debate site, so excuse my careless, typing, but thats the least of my concerns, call it what you want, im sure we are both up to speed with our issue at hand.
I see what you mean, but it will take more than your technicalities to win this battle, and perhaps you will rethink your faith? depends whether or not you have a sincere heart and seek him, honestly....
So, i would like to point out you arragantly speak as you have the obsolute truth, clearly entering a debate close minded. another point i would like to point out; you clearly dont know about your own faith, not even in the slightest. Do you know history of Christianity?Do you know Constantine ? Do you know if you affiliate your self as a Christian you willingly accept Pagan traditions. What does YHWH mean to you?
is it a joke? no , its blasphamous!
ill use you own verses

i can break you in such detail i dont know where to begin. first off what edition of the bible do you use?
i use ISR edition, maybe that will enlight you a bit, in its self.
Eph 2;8 for by favour you have been saved (mercy from Most MercyFul, through belief, and that not of yourselvesit is the gift of Elohim(seeking Creator Sincerely lies the gift)
eph5:9For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness, and rightousness, and truth11.and have no fellowship with the fruitless works of darkness( christianity has pagan roots, goes against scripture already.)
Gal 5:19-21 Thats assumming your individual is aware of truth. IF our creator is THE MOST JUST you cant be held responsible for truth you dont know, not reject.
John 3:6 how would you know if your religon is in sin?
Jer 17:9 10 I ,YHWH, search the heart.
John 3:19 sincere hearts!
Rom 3:23-24, in MESSiah YESHUAH




Secondly, I want to point out the assumptions you make in your statement. First, you boldly state that you have discovered the truth, and that Christianity is a joke. Then shortly after, you declare that you need to know why it is the only path to salvation. This right off the bat assumes that salvation exists, but it also implies religious pluralism, in which all religions are equally valid and there is not one true religion.
Religious pluralism? no brother,
for you to understand ill give you a verse
Yob Job 38:2 Who darkness counsel by words without knowledge? that my friend is what you done.

Chrisitainty doesnt even keep his name! when its been written over 6,000 times!.
before you debate about Importance of name YHWH or Yeshuah i would spell it in hebrew if i could, how it should remain, and how it should be kept.
matthew
6
9-"This, then, is the way you should pray: "Our Father who is in the heavens, let Your Name be set-apart
28
17-And when they saw Him, they bowed to Him, but some doubted.
18- and Yeshuah came up and spoke to them saying, "All authority has been givven to Me in heaven and on earth.
19-Therefore, go and make taught ones of all the nations, imersing them in the Name of the Father and the Son and of Set-apart Spirit,
20-teaching them to guard all that i have commanded you. And see, i am with you always, until the end of the age.Amen.
Exodus
20:
7-You do not bring the name of YHWH your Elohim to naught, for YHWH does not leave the one unpunished who brings His Name to naught.
3:
13-And Mosheh said to Elohim," See, when i come to the children of Yisra'el and say to them'The Elohim of your fathers has sent me to you
,' and they say to me, ' What is His Name?'what shall i say to them?"
14-And Elohim said to Mosheh," I am that which I am. " And he said,' Thus you shall say to the children of Yisra'el, I am has sent me to you.'"
15-And Elohim said further to Mosheh," Thus you are to say to the children of Yisra'el YHWH elohim of your fathers the Elohim of Abraham, the Elohim of Yitshaq, and the Elohim of Ya'aqob, has sent me to you. This is My name forever, and this is my rememberance to all generations
Philippans
2:
10-that at the name of Yeshuah every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth
,and of those under the earth,
11- and everytongue should confess that Yeshuah Messiah is Master, to the esteem of Elohim the Father.
Acts
4:
10-let it be known to all of you, and to all the people of Yisra'el, that in the Name of Yeshuah Messiah of Natsareth, whom you impaled, whom Elohim raised from the dead, by Him this one stands before you healthy.
11-This is the stone which was rejected by you builders, which has become the chief corner-stone.
12-And there is no deliverance in anyone else ,for there is no other Name under the heaven given among men by which we need to be saved.

psalm
61;5-8
5-For You, O Elohim, have heard my vows; You have given me the inheritance of those who fear Your Name.
6-You add days to the days of the sovereign, His years as many generations.
7- Let him dwell fover before Elohim. Prepare loving- commitment and truth to preserve him!
8-So i sing praise to Your Name forever, When i pay my vows day by day.
20;7-8 83;18 45;17
Jeremiah16;21
Isaiah 42;8 7;14 45;5 52;6 9;6-7
judges 13;18
romans 8;15
Revelation 1;8
proverbs 30;4 18;10
john1;1 17;1-7 1-51
numbers 23;19
ephesians6;11-14



But I see a flaw here. The first assumption I pointed out essentially implies that you are right and Christianity is wrong, but then it appears you go on to affirm that all religions equal. Please clear up any misunderstanding here.
Revelations states that this book of prophecy should not be added or taken out of, and they took out his very name. and religon based on corrupted versions of bible
are wrong. period, ask you pastor if he knows of YHWH. ask why its not preached.
they are part of an assembly.. for example Assembly of God , if pastor makes assemley mad preaching something they are not meant to teach, they can kick pastor out, if not that members of church will leave because it would take realization of past errors. which they wont, although some have taken risks. and assembleys
have so much money horded, what are they doing \with all that money?


Quick summary of the Christian Worldview:

I want to quick make sure we are on the same page with what Christianity actually teaches. Put simply, it teaches that all humanity is desperately wicked, and suffering from a disease (sin). Then God, in His grace, sends His son to be the antidote for said disease. Now people can either accept the antidote or reject it; however, if you reject it, you will still die of your disease.

Rom 3:23-24, , , Rom 5:12, Rom 5:19, Job 25:4, Matt 15:19,, Ecc 7:20

If we assume that Christianity is true, then it becomes obvious why people would believe that He is the only way to salvation, so I believe that this debate would be better titled, "Prove to me that Christianity is true". If that is the case, I would be more that happy to give you my arguments, however it is your debate and your call.

You may have had a sincere heart coming at this the way you did but, it takes discernment to be able to choose battles.
a close mind cant comprehend this truth, because it takes one to abandon beliefs, renounce the faith, follow scripture to what it acually says, Dont trust MAN, (religion) Seek him with sincere heart and you will find. and you will be lead to correct way of life, apart from religion.
I_just_plant_the_seed

Pro

"So, i would like to point out you arragantly speak as you have the obsolute truth, clearly entering a debate close minded."

This looks like you are accusing me of believing my own view to be true, and I would agree with this. But if you are claiming that if a person believes in their own belief then they will always approach a topic with a narrow mind, are you not bound by this truth also? After all, unless you do not actually believe in your side of the argument, then how are you approaching this debate with an open mind?


"i can break you in such detail i dont know where to begin. first off what edition of the bible do you use?
i use ISR edition, maybe that will enlight you a bit, in its self."

This translation question is nothing but a red herring fallacy. It has nothing to do with the original topic of how there can only be one path to salvation. Even if Christianity is false and corrupted, it does not change the fact that all religions simply cannot be true. And if you were to agree with that statement, then you are declaring that you have found the exclusive path to salvation.

Now ordinarily, I do not sniff at the red herrings, but I will make an exception here. First off, you have a couple; you go on about translations, and about how Christianity has pagan roots. Since you did not specify what they were or what their influence was, I am going to assume that you are talking about the doctrine of the trinity. Please forgive me if you were talking about some other pagan influence, but the trinity seems to be the most common doctrine charged with pagan influence.

1. ISR new testament of john 14:6

1“Let not your heart be troubled. Believe in Elohim, believe also in Me.
2“In My Father’s house are many staying places. And if not, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
3“And if I go and prepare a place for you, I shall come again and receive you to Myself, that where I am, you might be too.
4“And where I go you know, and the way you know.
5T’oma said to Him, “Master, we do not know where You are going, and how are we able to know the way?”
6יהושע said to him, “I am the Way, and the Truth, and the Life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.
7If you had known Me, you would have known My Father too. From now on you know Him, and have seen.
8Philip said to Him, “Master, show us the Father, and it is enough for us.”
9יהושע said to him, “Have I been with you so long, and you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father, and how do you say, ‘Show us the Father’?
10“Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father is in Me? The words that I speak to you I do not speak from Myself. But the Father who stays in Me does His works.
11“Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father in Me, otherwise believe Me because of the works themselves.


Now, most of the verses you have presented are from the new testament and look to be taken out of context. But instead of sniffing around at them, I will let Jesus speak for Himself. And what I see is Jesus clearly proclaiming that He is the only path to salvation, and that He and the Father are one. This is straight from the horses mouth, and I think it is safe to say that either you are misunderstanding the verses you presented from the new testament, or the apostles were misunderstanding the words of Jesus.


So when you ask why I can say that Jesus is the only path to salvation, my response is nothing more than: Jesus said so, and I have good reason to trust Him. And here are my reasons:


1) Jesus is historical -- It is accepted that Jesus was most likely crucified around 30 AD give or take a couple years.

2) Apostles pursuasion -- The apostles definately believed that Jesus rose from the dead and appeared to them, and were willing to die for that fact. They were convinced.

3) Empty tomb -- If anyone wanted to prove the apostles wrong, all they needed to do was present the body. (Now there are theories that the body was stolen or that Jesus was not really dead on the cross, but they are merely ficticious and end up being highly improbable.)

4) Pauls conversion -- Paul was a major opponent of the early apostles, but even so he was converted and became one of the strongest believers in a risen Christ. We also know that he was willing to die for this belief, which further suggests that he truly believed Christ had risen.


Those are my reasons for believing that He did in fact rise from the dead, and Hiis resurrection is the cornerstone of the Christian faith. But if He did rise (And I believe it is reasonable to think that He did), then His claims can be trusted. And I think it is clear that claimed to be the only way to salvation. You can try to give me more red herrings to chase after, but I am not sniffing anymore.


Sources

http://penelope.uchicago.edu...
https://answersingenesis.org...
http://www.research.ed.ac.uk...

Debate Round No. 2
intenzfrost

Con

my point of view is :taken a step back and avoid to be part of main stream have done endless research, trials, trebulation, alot of evil things targeting me, ect.
you are assuming you have my perspective drawn out, but i still have yet to see a acual soild argument? you havent resolved issues i presented nor answered my questions.
your avoiding scripture. you are taking out of context not I. You may ask how i do i continue speaking as if im in total control?, that is because i am, every issuei came across in search of truth, seeking him sincerely asking for understanding, knowlodge to explain why an athiest could use scripture to condtradict verse, and i being defenceless. seeking him did lead me somewhere.
but my perspective is a complicated one, some are destined to find truth, understand truth, gain truth.
my point of view doesnt matter at this point, not until you resolve these isssue.
note these are issue i came across myself and i in fact did resolve them with the discrenment of Set apart Spirit.

1.From begining to end, 6,823 times in the Masoretic Tanak the name of "Yod" "Hei" "Waw""Hei" YHWH is written in Original Text without tampering. Fact!
Humans beings decided for reasons that made sense to them to delete his name and replace it with something more appropriate in their view.
Exodus 3:15 AND ELOHIM SSAID FURTHER TO MOSHEH,'- (in original Hebrew text) YHWH Elohim of your fathers- has sent me to you. THIS IS MY NAME FOREVER, AND THIS IS MY REMEMBERANCE TO ALL GENERATIONS.
What is his name? YHWH
What is his rememberance to us? HIS NAME YHWH
To Who? ALL GENERATIONS
umm does that mean this generation doesnt need to worry about that ? ummm your church or christianity doesnt follow that. is it does? where does it say christiantiy or this generation is an expection. ALL is ALL,, and Forever, is Forever, no exceptions
FOR HOW LONG? FOOOOREVER!!!
Is it blashphamy to not remember his name, hide his name then replace it?
Yes
But He has many names?!... ummmm no! He has titles, which are Names to describe, not Name to replace. MOST HIGH ECT.
LLORD AND GOD ARE PAGAN NAMES!
GOD GOTT ZESUS THEOS PAN LORD LORDO LARD PAGAN

HE IS TO BE DISTIINGUISHED FROM ALL OTHER DEITIES.
A NAME CANT BE TRANSLATED, and if we truley respect love and follow him, why cant we simply keep his name.

2. day of rest is saturday, shabbat. not sunday, SUNDAY SUN- DAY DAY OF SUN PAGAN.
3. YOU KNOW WHATS SUPER IMPORTANT TOO
leviticus 26. after not worshiping other idols, OR associate HIM WITH GODS.
keep the feistes holy dates,
4. Why do christians preach theres a rapture before end day prophecies? There is not 2-3 witnesses(verses) to support that.
5 Christmas is pagan, when Revalation 12. clearly indicated Yeshuah born during warm weather. not cold
Pagan birthdate fits several pagan gods, yet you still think its cool?
psalms20; 7
SOme trust in chariots and some in horses(False gods and names) but we remember the name of Yhwh our Elohim.

6 where does it say rejecting a false name jesus is rejecting YESHUAH in his face?
He already paid for our sins, for all!
for those who do not know the truth they are judged whether they have a sincere heart and bothered to seek him
He is the MOST Mercyful, Most Loving, Most fair

7. why did he utterly destroy nations? and flood, wind destruction.
8. salvation is a individual situation, for you to think your beleif is only way condradicts \Our creator being Fair.
My belief is acually seeking him, pondering his creations, keeping him in mind all day.
following what is written, Learning hebrew to read and undersand acual scripture in purity.

Philipians 2;9-11
Elohim therefore has exalted him and given him the name which is above every name, 10 that at the name of YESHUAH
Every knee should bow, of those in heaven and of those on earch and under earth. .
11 and every tonque should confess that YESHUAH Messiah is master to the esteem of Elohim the Father

Christian trinity is Pagan doctrine,
YHWH is GODHEAD (for you to understand
YESHUAH is Manifistation of HIS Will -GODHAND
Set-apart Spirit Manifistation of power GODPOWER

YESHUAH SAID IF YOU HAVE SEEN ME YOU HAVE SEEN MY FATHER, I DO NOT SPEAK UNLESS FATHER GIVES ME WORDS TO SAY,
HE DOES NOT TAKE AN ACTION UNLESS INSTRUCTED.

OTHER WORDS THEY ARE EXTENTIONS OF FATHER
LIKE HEAD, ARM, LEG ONE
THEY ARE OF ONE, BUT NOT FUNCTION seperatly


the fact that your sources are via web,and not scripture is sad.
I don't blame you, I blame the ones responsible to show us the truth and fail so so bad.knowingly!
I_just_plant_the_seed

Pro

"you are assuming you have my perspective drawn out"

No, all I said was that "You believe you are right, and that I am wrong". I only said this, because you accused me of approaching this debate with a closed mind since I believed I had the truth. But you began this debate by declaring that you had yourself discovered it; thus, I pointed out that you were then restricted by your rule. All I intended with this statement was to show you a contradiction, not to imply that I had your view mastered.

"but i still have yet to see a acual soild argument"

I believe my argument was pretty clear. I gave 5 reasons why I believed Jesus's resurrection to be true, and then went on to conclude that if He was able to rise then He is obviously trustworthy, and if He is trustworthy, then His claims about being the only way to salvation should also be trusted. Since you did not respond to this reasoning, I will assume that you either didn't read my post all the way through, or that you just do not have a strong counter to it.


"you havent resolved issues i presented nor answered my questions."

I have, but I will return to them later in this post so you can see them again.



"Exodus 3:15 AND ELOHIM SSAID FURTHER TO MOSHEH,'- (in original Hebrew text) YHWH Elohim of your fathers- has sent me to you. THIS IS MY NAME FOREVER, AND THIS IS MY REMEMBERANCE TO ALL GENERATIONS."

You have to realize a couple of things.

1) The first name used for God in the bible is Elohim. The first name God identifies himself as is YHWH.

2) Elohim is not used exclusively for God, but is also used in reference to false gods or strong characters. For example, God is called the Elohim of elohim. Elohim literally translates "Strong one", so it is not blasphemy when it does not appear in the Greek New Testament, and is translated to theos, also meaning God. The point is that God's majesty as the "strongest one" is no lost in translation; He is still "Elohim of elohim", it is just translated to "God of gods".

3) YHWH first appears when Moses meets God at the burning bush. You yourself confirm this above. But the crucial part of the name YHWH is that through it, God declares the He alone is God and that He is absolute. This is translated I AM. But once again, the importance of of the name is not lost in translation, it is only the Hebrew word itself. What is important though is that the meaning remains.

4) "A NAME CANT BE TRANSLATED"

James in Italian is Giacomo. Why can't אלהים translate to "God"


Your main contention seems to be that Christians have removed the name of God from the bible, and thus are using a corrupted doctrine. But I believe I have made it clear that although the words have changed (Which I think you can expect with a translation), the meaning and importance behind them do not.


"2. day of rest is saturday
4. Why do christians preach theres a rapture
5 Christmas is pagan
7. why did he utterly destroy nations?"

Here are just a bunch more red herrings which are not relevant to the discussion. I warned you that I wouldn't sniff, so I won't. Sorry.


8. salvation is a individual situation, for you to think your beleif is only way condradicts \Our creator being Fair.
My belief is acually seeking him, pondering his creations, keeping him in mind all day.
following what is written, Learning hebrew to read and undersand acual scripture in purity.

Christianity contradicts God's fairness?! What part about sending your only son to pay the cost for all mankind seems unfair to you? This is more than a slap in the face to Christians, it is a slap in the face to God. The whole message of Christianity is that anyone can have salvation. The bottom line is that Christ is available to everyone as the path to salvation, but it is up to the individual whether he accepts it. (I know I said would not sniff at the red herrings, but this was such a gross misunderstanding of Christianity that I could not help myself.)


Quite frankly, most of the contentions you have been bringing are not relevant to the discussion at hand, and for the ones that are, I believe I have responded to them adequately. But my task is to prove that Jesus is the only way to salvation, and as I mentioned at the start of this post, I believe I have clearly presented some reasonable arguments. It is up to you whether or not you shall respond to them.



Debate Round No. 3
intenzfrost

Con

still you didn't provide scripture to prove your opinion. or to support your beliefs
Don't confuse Titles names and YHWHs only Name
plainly there is a greater truth than the truth you have, I don't claim your not in salvation either, in fact I know you are
and I shouldn't have entered a debate and shove an elevated truth, down someone's throat
my goal was to expose that Christianity holds people down from reaching potential. they teach what congregation wants to hear, not truth that should be taught,
then go to church sunday, please show me where in the bible does it say to go to church sunday.
I_just_plant_the_seed

Pro

My references for my last post will be at the bottom of this one, I forgot to include them.



"plainly there is a greater truth than the truth you have"

How can one truth be greater than another? Truth by definition is exclusive, and you cannot hold two contradictory ideas to be true at the same time. The simple fact is, that we both cannot be right; you are claiming that there are many ways to salvation, and I am claiming that there is only one way. Logically, you cannot affirm that we are both right; this, defies the law of non-contradiction.


"please show me where in the bible does it say to go to church sunday."

Once again, this is another red herring, but I will take the bait. The Christian worldview establishing Sunday as the sabbath does not seem to be biblical. It seems like they took the idea meaning behind the day itself and applied it to the first day of the week. The first day of the week is significant because Christ rose on the first day of the week. But the meaning of the day itself is simply a day of rest which is dedicated to the Lord. So although it is not biblical, it can be seen as a change which was made in response to the new covenant and to honor the sacrifice of Christ.

"Don't confuse Titles names and YHWHs only Name"

I do not think I have. I have shown that Elohim is not exclusive to God, and is even used to refer to false gods, but I have also shown that the significance behind the name YHWH was not lost in translation. If it were impossible to translate names, and if so much significance was lost by the process, then you would be forced to refer to God with the Hebrew letters: אלהים . But I think it is clear that it is possible to translate the name effectively as long as the powerful meaning behind it is also translated, which I believe is the case.


"I shouldn't have entered a debate and shove an elevated truth"

With respect, I do not believe that you have done this. You have only vaguely expressed what this "elevated truth" is, and have completely ignored my argument of why I believe Christ to be the only way. The main case you brought against Christianity is that it has removed the name of God from the bible, and is thus corrupt. But I think I have shown that this is not the case, and all you have done to rebut my argument is declare that I am "Confusing names with titles". However, I think that I quite obviously have only mentioned the names Elohim YHWH, which you brought up yourself. I do not think any other possible title has been brought up.

So I believe that you still have work ahead of you if you are going to prove that you have the truth and I do not, because quite frankly, we both cannot have it.

Debate Round No. 4
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Debate Round No. 5
18 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Snuggle_Daddy 1 month ago
Snuggle_Daddy
Also backwardseden, read the Bible it will give you proof of a god.
Posted by Snuggle_Daddy 1 month ago
Snuggle_Daddy
It's always discrimination against Christian's it seems, never any other religion.
Posted by intenzfrost 1 month ago
intenzfrost
You have no true understanding of his teachings, your on such a shallow water.
Did you know Islamic people came from Abraham father of nations, if you don't know where I'm going with that, it just shows.... you do the minimum for your creator.
Posted by intenzfrost 1 month ago
intenzfrost
Ill give my point of view.
I believe in invoking The name above all names, YHWH and surrender heart body and soul,
and knowing through His Mercy We are saved by YESHUAH ,
rooting out pagan belief, learning Hebrew
I go the extra mile, do you? I have found , I seek, and he shows. under his guidance AMEN.
Posted by intenzfrost 1 month ago
intenzfrost
you call me a liar? ok I accept you don't believe anything I have to say, He says to test all things
to establish truth before 2 or more witness, to seek him with sincere heart.
I'm quoting scripture here, you call scripture lies?
show me 2 or more scriptures that support Changing his name is ok,
show me where it says there's a 13th magical church called Christians mentioned in bible.
it clearly speaks about 12 tribes only, and after we find salvation we must cultivate ourselves unto olive tree.
when does Christianity teach this?
Peter 2;1
dude serious have a chat with your pastor. have him point out my lies and where I quote scripture.
and the rob skiba, he throws out blasphemous versions of scripture that use Pagan name!
Posted by I_just_plant_the_seed 1 month ago
I_just_plant_the_seed
@backwardsseden

You ate missing the bigger picture. Are you asking for what I personally believe to be evil, or what is objectively evil. It is impossible to claim an objective moral law without a transcendent authority behind it. For example, every federal law in the U.S. has the authority of the government behind it. But without an objective moral law, the questions you are asking are merely a matter of taste; it is like asking if I prefer chocolate or vanilla icecream.
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 1 month ago
FollowerofChrist1955
intenzfrost;
Hehe you lie about having been a christian ... yu were not. Call Rob Skiba Himself, he will tell you the same thing. IF it contradicts the Bible, Rob dismisses it intirely ... he says so Himself.

You suggest you fell away from God ... that cannot be true because scripture denies that possibility. It does however identify the frauds who pretend to BE christians at one time. It is This that your a Liar in as shown in scripture.

I submit your Lie from your own words: "I used be a Christian folk,"

What you ARE is a Liar. Matthew proves this in chapter 13.

You never were a christian, you never recieved the seal of God, you are consigned to Hell along with the atheists, that you draw away others makes your damnation even worse!

Better you should claim to be an astronaut because you read a book of space, that would be as accurate as your statement! Your a fraud, nothing more. You never knew God. And do not know him now!
Posted by backwardseden 1 month ago
backwardseden
@I_just_plant_the_seed - Stupid reasoning. Can't you read? Sheesh. Read the last paragraph of what I said here but I worded it wrong and meant to add a few words "god could have started off with AND KEPT..." See but YOUR god only believes in hate, evil destruction, violence, evil, anger, wrath, anger, rage, vengeance, etc etc etc He could have said "I believe in peace, love, harmony, care for each other and whisked it all away. Nah. So your god is a true god of hate provided that you can prove he even exists. Now let me ask you these questions: Do you believe that" Is killing evil? Y____? N____? Is slavery evil? Y____? N____? Is rape evil? Y____? N____? Is hating gays and wanting to stone them to death evil? Y____? N____? Is deliberate genocide for absolutely no reason evil? Y____? N____? Is hating children evil? Y____? N____? Is believing in different gods a warrant for death? Y____? N____? Is not believing in YOUR god worthy of being stoned to death? Y____? N____? All of these your god has freely admitted to and participated in. Is your jesus telling you to give up EVERYTHING including your ENTIRE family and all of your possessions and if YOU will NOT YOU will NOT become one of his disciples, is that evil? Y____? N____? And if not then clearly, why haven"t YOU done it? Do you believe that is perfectly OK for YOUR jesus to tell you to drink poisonous snakes venom and you will be fine afterwards? Y____? N____? Etc etc etc Now you look it up if you don"t believe me. Your god AND jesus are pure hate and they ARE immoral. If you think they are perfectly OK, then you are as immoral as YOUR god AND jesus. So its not just your OT. Its both. And your god and jesus were BY FAR the most self righteous egotists that have even set foot in print. And YOUR jesus IS the most fought after figure in history. Who would want to worship crap like that? Certainly not anyone of intelligence.
Posted by intenzfrost 1 month ago
intenzfrost
looks like people want to argue without knowledge. discernment
what am I lying about? I quote scripture? and version ISR is an edition that sincerely tries restore Scripture properly.
watch rob skiba "who is the church?" youtube
Posted by FollowerofChrist1955 1 month ago
FollowerofChrist1955
Confirmation of intenzfrost LIES by Scripture: Matthew 13

13 That same day Jesus went out of the house and sat by the lake. 2 Such large crowds gathered around him that he got into a boat and sat in it, while all the people stood on the shore. 3 Then he told them many things in parables, saying: "A farmer went out to sow his seed. 4 As he was scattering the seed, some fell along the path, and the birds came and ate it up. 5 Some fell on rocky places, where it did not have much soil. It sprang up quickly, because the soil was shallow. 6 But when the sun came up, the plants were scorched, and they withered because they had no root. 7 Other seed fell among thorns, which grew up and choked the plants. 8 Still other seed fell on good soil, where it produced a crop"a hundred, sixty or thirty times what was sown. 9 Whoever has ears, let them hear."

18 "Listen then to what the parable of the sower means: 19 When anyone hears the message about the kingdom and does not understand it, the evil one comes and snatches away what was sown in their heart. This is the seed sown along the path. 20 The seed falling on rocky ground refers to someone who hears the word and at once receives it with joy. 21 But since they have no root, they last only a short time. When trouble or persecution comes because of the word, they quickly fall away. 22 The seed falling among the thorns refers to someone who hears the word, but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth choke the word, making it unfruitful. 23 But the seed falling on good soil refers to someone who hears the word and understands it. This is the one who produces a crop, yielding a hundred, sixty or thirty times what was sown."
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