The Instigator
Human_Joke65
Pro (for)
Tied
0 Points
The Contender
mt0203
Con (against)
Tied
0 Points

Can comic book characters be bible characters reincarnated?

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/23/2013 Category: Religion
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,099 times Debate No: 29473
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (5)
Votes (0)

 

Human_Joke65

Pro

Humor me. You say it's just a coincidental correlation at best. Since I have to be all for it, even to the extreme, my position dictates that I wholeheartedly defend this notion with all resources that I can muster. Due to my argument being based on God being the mastermind behind this conspiracy theory, then the amount of coincidences should be overwhelmingly evident of something fishy going on.

Why now? Why wait 2000yrs just to screw with us through comic books recycling biblical heroes? To validate them in a defiant society that worships gods, yet in a compartmentalized manner, namely, fake gods that are recognized for what they are and nothing more, challenging the idea whether it's violating the first two Commandments.

Let's start with. . . God and the Incredible Hulk. Gamma anger caused by radioactive sin proximity. Bruce Banner would be Jesus, as his anger was directly linked to God and blasphemy. Tantrums between Hulk and the Old Testament are not all that dissimilar. God comes off as the Antichrist, while Bruce Banner is always trying to contain the Hulk; like Jesus afraid of being crucified and looking for another way out. Both Jesus and Bruce Banner always staying calm and patient despite those who would attempt to agitate him deliberately. Hulk does eventually get shipped off by fellow Jewish heroes to a distant planet, like Jesus' Ascension to Heaven; whereas Hulk is eventually treated like a gladiator on the planet he crash-lands on, Jesus' Godhood is currently being fought for by new comrades, whatever you want to call them. Both Hulk and God were seen as unconformable monsters, but in a different environment, they are seen as noble warriors, fighting for strangers despite being in survival mode. Their return is not expected, despite that it is should be.
mt0203

Con

First: similarities you've noted are not necessarily indications of comic book characters being directly/indirectly derivative characters from biblical references. It'd be like arguing the following: a piece of paper is made of tree molecules and is therefore a tree. A tree is an organism. I am an organism. I am a tree as well as a piece of paper. While this a=b=c, therefore a=c works logically in the world of mathematics, in reality, these analogies are not applicable. Similarities between two things don't make them alike. This conspiracy theory is a stretch even as a theory.

Oh, and to point out your silliness, let me compare biblical characters to pokemon. Ash Ketchum holds control over other organisms that are coerced in to performing nearly all the tasks Ash wants them to perform. This is a form of slavery. Biblical Egyptians held slaves. Ash is one of the pharaohs of Egypt. Ash's friends also are slave owners. They are the wealthy Egyptian masters. Pikachu is Joseph.. it is one of the slaves. The all-powerful, psychic pokemons such as Mewtwo and Mew represent God. Slowking foretells the future, he is Jesus. Et cetera, et cetera..

"God and the Incredible Hulk. Both Hulk and God were seen as unconformable monsters, but in a different environment, they are seen as noble warriors, fighting for strangers despite being in survival mode."
I have never seen god referenced as a monster or a warrior before today. This is a self-made correlation/claim based on an false, imaginary common view.
Here is are the categorical claims you've made for several biblical characters that rarely, if at all, appears elsewhere:
1. God comes off as the Antichrist *really? REALLY?*
2. Bruce Banner is always trying to contain the Hulk; like Jesus afraid of being crucified and looking for another way out
*Jesus feared crucification? I don't think so. :)*
3. Hulk does eventually get shipped off by fellow Jewish heroes to a distant planet, like Jesus' Ascension to Heaven
*I go to Taiwan, my native home, like Jesus.. this correlation works with almost every single individual in the world*
4.Tantrums between Hulk and the Old Testament are not all that dissimilar. *Prove it*
I think that's enough for you to deal with. Good luck.
Debate Round No. 1
Human_Joke65

Pro

The key to bypassing these mathematical 'limitations' are providing really specific comparisons that fit each other like an impossible prophecy of comedic proportions.

Since you opened the door to biblical pokemon, I prefer Noah's Ark being one large pokeball, and Noah's catchphrase/mission being "Gotta Catch 'Em All! There's a photo circulating this idea that shares my sentiments on the internet. I'm borrowing the large pokeball idea, but the rest is mine, despite anyone inconveniently thinking it up as well.

http://www.google.com...

How is God not referenced as a monster? Never talked to a disillusioned atheist? As for God as a warrior, he does quite the smiting in his OT days, but that isn't as relevant as the New Testament depictions, like Revelation, where he takes the fun out of being the Antichrist.

If Jesus didn't fear the crucifiction, he feared being abandoned by God on the cross and whatever that process entailed.

About Hulk and Jesus' involuntary (Jesus' will was to do his Father's, not his own) departure from Earth are co-unique because of similar circumstances: the monster was uncontainable. Hulk's uncontainability is obvious, Jesus' is mysterious.

The tantrums involve rampaging through 'innocent' people and guilty alike. Innocent by atheistic standards. Hulk's anger is occasionally hyper-rational, almost miraculously by protecting the damsel or hostage, etc. from the bad guys. The 'good' guys think he's bad (God/Hulk); the 'bad' guys KNOW he's good; that's obviously from an atheistic perspective.
mt0203

Con

You've completely missed my point. This has NOTHING to do with atheism, agnosticism, christian/catholicism, buddhism or any religion. My argument revolves around the fact that you have made many absurd claims.
God is a monster? As with all your other unusual analogies that you state as fact, show me evidence, sited (and maybe quoted) from a legitimate source (preferably biblical, but maybe some biblical commentaries from credible scholars)

You also seem to have missed my point about Pokemon. I literally asked my sister to name a random cartoon for me to make comparisons. The point is, you can compare ANYTHING to ANYTHING based on ANY similarity at all. This is what you are doing and this is what I am pointing out explicitly here and implicitly through my examples written above. I apologize for my rude bluntness, but you must be slow-witted to not be able to catch this point and 'refute' my round without actually addressing the points I've made.

Cheeseburgers are loved by many. Jesus is loved by many, according to church teachings. Jesus Christ is an eggroll.
YAY!
*hint* Attack my main points/refutations. Do not ramble on with your original argument that I've already effectively refuted.
Debate Round No. 2
Human_Joke65

Pro

Since you just ignored my explanation of how I justify these analogies, and you can't seem to humor me; I'll restate it clearly. Anything could be compared to anything with a clever punchline to crazy glue them together, but I aim to go deeper than that. Multiple side-by-side parallels that are more compatible than ordinary metaphors. Extraordinary. Abnormal.

Wolverine.....Jesus' Debating Ability
ADAMantium clause: unbreakable conscience, shameless
Healing Factor
Memory Loss: Forgets about Christianity post-rapture

Prof. Xavier....Prophet Jesus
Psychic
X-Men Founder: Church Founder
Not the Leader, but Founder: Cyclops/Pope Leader
Cerebro: Locate own kind
School: Sunday School
Wheelchair: Jesus is Head of the Church Body, Impotent

Captain America....SuperChristian Jesus (Redundant? Only Jesus is perfectly Christlike)
Frozen In Ice: Jesus is serenely stuck in Heaven since the Ascension
Vibranium Shield: Absorb/Deflect Critical vibes with irony
Serum Transforms Puny >> Super: Humble Baptism

I don't have to worry about the math fallacies since that's not my ambition. My goal is to use fiction to exorcise the 'fiction' out of the Bible. How? Juxtaposing two fictional subjects, and if examining them leads to suspicion of foul play, the coincidence is to be a confirmation as to whether fraudulence is present. By the low expectation of success, I had the element of surprise. If only I can gain access to the tool of shock and awe. You could never end with your analogies with random subjects; I have my limits. Mine are less arbitrary.
mt0203

Con

mt0203 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
Human_Joke65

Pro

http://www.biblegateway.com...

http://theosophical.wordpress.com...

As for God being a monster, these scholars precede my accusation.
mt0203

Con

mt0203 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
Human_Joke65

Pro

The focus on Jesus as the primary subject for comic book parallels...is not intentionally subliminal.

Daredevil....Paul
Blindness
Legal Background

Batman...Moses
Batcave Mt. Sinai
Utility Belt...Moral Gadgetry
Scare Evildoers
Prince of Gotham/Egypt
Runaway for Training

The parallel unison of cooperation within the comic book universe and biblical network of intertwinement are meant to inspire an attempt to adapt to the evolving culture that prefers fake gods over real ones. Combining them may confuse initially, but when they do become initiated, the fear of abnormal coincidence should begin to subside.
mt0203

Con

mt0203 forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
5 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Posted by mt0203 4 years ago
mt0203
I love how the sources in round 4 point to the exact same person and the exact same book. "Scholar's'" :D:D some random PHD from an unpopular/random insitution of education. Read your sources carefully before sourcing them. It's about as credible as: " God is a carrot. My dad, two years ago, wrote a book titled: "Is God a Carrot?", Since he is a PHD of english, his statement, from now on, can be taken as absolute evidence/reference to anything/everything related to God being a carrot."

That's just absurd.

You were trying much too hard to justify your untenable stance. You shouldn't set such difficult debate parameters on yourself.. It'd attract leeches like me.
Good luck in your future debates. (:
Posted by mt0203 4 years ago
mt0203
You (hilariously) reiterate my attack and put them in a positive light. I have to point this out (read below):

Me: You're comparisons (which are supposed to point to something fishy going on about marvel, Christianity, or whatever it is you were trying to prove) are outrageous.. anyone can make such comparisons. There is no compatibility. HOW are these pointing to something fishy when anything can be related to anything? <-since this is the case, anything and everything that has ever come in to existence is 'fishy'. 'Fishy' to what ends, under what context? This was never established and is, furthermore, unclear.

You (very verbosely): My comparisons are outrageous. They are out of the world. That's why they're compatible.
-continues comparisons and reiterates this statement (again, very verbosely) as a conclusion.-

Me: Wha-?? >_<
-gives up the lost cause-

*note* this comment holds no bearings to my actual debate performance and should be disregarded in the judging. Vote according to your own sentiment/thoughts after reading all five rounds before reading this comment. ^-^
Posted by mt0203 4 years ago
mt0203
"If Jesus didn't fear the crucifixion, he feared being abandoned by God on the cross and whatever that process entailed."
If not a, than b, ignoring possible options of c, d, e, f, g, h... on and on.
If this apple isn't a vegetable, then it's poultry.
Here is a classic example of "If not a, then b" when the correct option would be *c. fruit.*
Stop doing this, it hurts to see a fellow person make such obvious errors. :(
*edit
Posted by mt0203 4 years ago
mt0203
"If Jesus didn't fear the crucifixion, he feared being abandoned by God on the cross and whatever that process entailed."
If not a, than b, ignoring possible options of c, d, e, f, g, h... on and on.
If this apple isn't a vegetable, then it's poultry.
Here is a classic example of "If a, then b" when the correct option would be *c. fruit.*
Stop doing this, it hurts to see a fellow person make such obvious errors. :(
Posted by johnlubba 4 years ago
johnlubba
You have yourself a very wild imagination there my dear fellow.
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