The Instigator
RightIAm
Pro (for)
Losing
7 Points
The Contender
Ore_Ele
Con (against)
Winning
33 Points

Capitalism is great

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 12/27/2010 Category: Politics
Updated: 6 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 4,191 times Debate No: 14162
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (62)
Votes (6)

 

RightIAm

Pro

Capitalism has its problems but it's the best economic system. Our society runs fine, no extremes people can do what they want within fundemental laws, it's all good. We are basically fairly free. Economics for me is all about the greater good, with capitalism a few get screwed so evryone can enjoy prosperity, free markets rule!! I basically agree with the current system we have, banks stimulate economic growth, it was thanks to the bank that we were living the high life the past 10 years. The banks have to pay there interest to their customers, that requires risk and this time it's gone tits up but it's better than left wing politics where it's sh*t all the time! Capitalism delivers a better quality of life, cheaper goods better wages, people are richer nowadays overall, and we've had capitalist for the past ever so that argument doesn't work. THere are less poor people now than 100, 200 or even 50 years ago!

(Ed)
Ore_Ele

Con

My opponent has neglected to define some terms, so I will, to ensure that we are debating the same thing, and not different things under the same word.

Capitalism - "an economic system in which the means of production are privately owned and operated for a private profit; decisions regarding supply, demand, price, distribution, and investments are made by private actors in the free market"

Free Market - "Any market in which trade is unregulated; an economic system free from government intervention."

Greater - "of major significance or importance." This one has many definitions, ranging from size to quality. However, I feel, that for this debate, we should simply be talking about the quality of its output compared to other systems.

Capitalism advocates that government gets in the way of the free market. Which, by definition, is true. However, I will be debating whether the free market is all that wonderful, and as such, capitalism itself. In the failings of the free market, I can gladly point to our current situation. Th collapse of the housing market, due to poor regulations that did not adequately regulate the market, thus allowing this to happen. I can also point to the dot.com bubble, which grew and popped because it was a new market which did not have proper regulations. We also have the recession of the 80's and the early 90's, from deregulation of the government from Reagan and Bush Sr.

It is also worth pointing out that poor regulations =/= any regulation. If a regulation fails to do what it intended, that only means that that particular regulation was faulty, and not the entire notion of regulations. So we ought simply scratch that regulation and try a different model for it (unless you are a free-market capitalist, who believes in no regulations).

We can see that even in the "high life of the past 10 years" that only the rich have been benefiting. Everyone else has seen their income drop, in respect to inflation.[1] If this type of growth is want capitalism considers "great" and the "high life" then it is rather pathetic. We saw much better growth, and more even growth under Clinton, and other more liberal presidents.

We also see that democrats have a better track record when it comes to growing the economy, and republicans only show that they can grow the debt.[2]

We can also see that democrats and their liberal policies have a better history of growing the revenue compared to spending, which republicans and their conservative policies have a better history of growing spending and not revenue. [3]

I will yield for now and allow my opponent to post his arguments that capitalism is so great.

[1] http://www.epi.org...
[2] http://en.wikipedia.org...
[3] http://cedarcomm.com...
Debate Round No. 1
RightIAm

Pro

Capitalism is the only system that truly represents the achievements of the individual. When it comes down to it, if you work hard and play by society's rules, you will prosper. And before you say, 'Why should we play by society's rules?', ...remember, every one of us has a debt to society. We have free health care, free schooling, a benefits system, the list goes on.
Ore_Ele

Con

In a socialist society, if you work hard and "play by the rules" can will still be rewarded. That is a too common myth about socialism.

One of the biggest faults of a 100% free market is that they claim that people will naturally buy whatever the best value product is, but this is not the case, they will buy whatever they THINK is the best value, regardless to if it really is. This means that companies only need to convince people that they have a better deal, by lying about the quality and price of their own products and their competitors. Without a government regulation of true in advertising, this can lead to extremely dangerous results (tobacco companies telling people that cigarettes are perfectly safe and not addicting), drugs that all claim to be side-effect free.

There are many aspects where certain regulations are needed, in that the free market is not perfect, and so needs guidance. In leaving the free market completely free, these few imperfections cause great issues and serious problems.
Debate Round No. 2
RightIAm

Pro

People who aren't grateful should be taken to a country where people aren't as well off as us, stripped of their possessions and forced to live off whatever they can scrape together. Then we'll see whether they still think that society doesn't look after people.

In the end, it's people who have changed. People have got lazier and more languid. They feel society owes them, and that is what is truly wrong with this country. This ungrateful attitude.
Ore_Ele

Con

"People who aren't grateful should be taken to a country where people aren't as well off as us, stripped of their possessions and forced to live off whatever they can scrape together. Then we'll see whether they still think that society doesn't look after people."

"every one of us has a debt to society."

"with capitalism a few get screwed so evryone can enjoy prosperity."

"this time it's gone tits up but it's better than left wing politics..."

Capitalism isn't really all that great. It has some good features about it, and it has some poor features about it. All in all, we should only take the good, and leave the bad behind, so a partial capitalistic system is better and so a solid capitalistic system is not great.
Debate Round No. 3
62 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by FREEDO 6 years ago
FREEDO
Posted by RightIAm 6 years ago
RightIAm
I kill'd browns wi'd my bare hands.
Posted by Shtookah 6 years ago
Shtookah
How would we know you're a "war hero". Even if you were in the military, that doesn't inherently make you a hero. Sorry..
Posted by RightIAm 6 years ago
RightIAm
Whut? Whut y'all doin' giving a war hero like me zero points? Whut do you mean by it?
Posted by Cody_Franklin 6 years ago
Cody_Franklin
Sure, a failed state like Somalia is an instance of government intervention. However, it's the same as saying that a cat is an instance of a mammal. No matter how many cats you bring me, it won't prove that all mammals are cats. Similarly, there's nothing to suggest that all laissez faire societies would be failed states like Somalia. All As are Bs, but not all Bs are As.

So, what I'm saying is, you're spotlighting horrific cases of statelessness to paint a picture of laissez faire society that's totally unrealistic, in the same way that laissez faire theorists unfairly spotlight Soviet Russia and its satellites to paint an unrealistic picture of socialist society (for proof of that, look to Scandinavia, which is definitely not Soviet-style socialism, but whose problems aren't really relevant to this discussion).
Posted by daniel_t 6 years ago
daniel_t
@Cody and OreEle, are you saying that generally, a failed state is not a place where there is little government interference? Or are you just taking exception the the specific example? If the latter, then which failed state would you rather me use for an example?

Or maybe you are taking exception to me using the whole "if you don't like it, then leave" attitude. If that is it, then yea, you got me. I concede.
Posted by Ore_Ele 6 years ago
Ore_Ele
Cody has a perfect point. A fallacy that is for your side is just as bad (worse, in my opinion) then a fallacy on the other side. Bad logic is bad logic.
Posted by Shtookah 6 years ago
Shtookah
Pro reminds me of this guy
Posted by Shtookah 6 years ago
Shtookah
sorta
Posted by Shtookah 6 years ago
Shtookah
Man below me has a point
6 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Vote Placed by ReptiDeath 6 years ago
ReptiDeath
RightIAmOre_EleTied
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Vote Placed by Shtookah 6 years ago
Shtookah
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Vote Placed by daniel_t 6 years ago
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Vote Placed by darceem 6 years ago
darceem
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Vote Placed by Grape 6 years ago
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Vote Placed by gavin.ogden 6 years ago
gavin.ogden
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