The Instigator
daytonanerd
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
Maikuru
Con (against)
Winning
21 Points

Captain Jean-Luc Picard is superior to Captain/Admiral James T. Kirk

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 4 votes the winner is...
Maikuru
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 6/10/2012 Category: Miscellaneous
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 2,393 times Debate No: 24212
Debate Rounds (1)
Comments (6)
Votes (4)

 

daytonanerd

Pro

This is a one round debate that only allows 3 hours of arguing time. I will stand on the position that Jean-Luc Picard is a better Enterprise captain and is more favorable than Captain Kirk. I stand on this position because it has been shown throughout the Next Generation that Picard is way more of a diplomat than Kirk was, that Picard was a super-smart captain that didn't have to rely on his gut, like Kirk had to, and Picard has the best theme song ever. Kirk never could have inspired anything like this.
Maikuru

Con

Disclaimer: I love Captain Picard. Most people do. I’d go so far as to say I’m probably at a disadvantage here because he’s so popular. Lucky for me, this resolution isn’t about each captain’s popularity, but rather their merits as men and Starfleet officers. In this regard, there can be no debate; Kirk is superior to Picard.

Hold your gasps, stay your hatred, and let me explain.


Pro’s Case

1. Pro’s initial claim is that Picard is a better diplomat than Kirk, though he provides no evidence whatsoever to support this claim. This may be due to the great difficulty of the task; as captains of Starfleet’s flagship, both men were expected to serves as ambassador, diplomat, and negotiator to every alien species encountered throughout their journeys. Despite this difficulty, facts suggest that Picard held no superiority in this regard.

In terms of alien contacts, their records are staggeringly similar. During his initial 5-year mission on the Enterprise, Kirk encountered over 60 alien species and initiated over 20 first contacts [1, Discoveries]. This latter figure mirrors Picard’s exactly, though it took Picard 8 years to achieve it [2]. Considering that Kirk’s mission took place roughly 100 years earlier than Picard’s, when ships were slower and no one had even heard of Starfleet, the similarity of these accomplishments is a testament to Kirk’s skills in diplomacy.


2. Pro goes on to praise Picard’s intelligence and berate Kirk’s more intuitive command style. While I concede that Picard did much to showcase his literary and cultural knowledge, such information is largely irrelevant to an intergalactic command post. When it comes to necessary information for starship captains, such as tactical skills and engineering and equipment repairs, Kirk trumped Picard in every category.

Kirk’s gift for combat tactics and strategies made him one of the most praised combatants in the known galaxy, an honor that extended even beyond Picard’s times. Starfleet officers from over a hundred years in Kirk’s future commented frequently on his legendary battle skills and a number of official Starfleet battle maneuvers were invented by Kirk and bear his name [3, Tactics]. Kirk also survived innumerable encounters with hostile warrior species, including the Klingons and Romulans, who openly regarded him as Starfleet's most capable and feared commander. Again, considering Kirk was outfitted with the earlier and comparatively primitive version of the Enterprise, his victories are that much more glorious and commendable.

Kirk was also known to demonstrate impressive engineering knowledge by personally repairing vital ship systems when necessary [3, Intellect and Personality]. As a Starfleet graduate with command experience on multiple ships, it should come as no surprise that Kirk contained such advanced yet necessary technical expertise. This technological familiarity spanned many years and advancements, as Kirk was able to successfully captain newer crafts after spending years in retirement [3, The wrath and wake of Khan].


3. Pro’s last point refers to a video cataloging Picard’s more interesting dialogue. What he doesn't seem to realize is that Picard owes every word he ever uttered to Kirk and his astronomical popularity. Two decades after the original Star Trek was canceled, it still pulled in the highest ratings of any syndicated show of the era. The thing was a cash cow and tv execs wanted another show. Of course, this enormous success meant William Shatner could demand a ridiculous salary for the new series. Unable to pay out such big bucks, producers opted with the then unknown Patrick Stewart to captain the Enterprise. In other words, Picard was very literally the poor man’s Kirk and his entire history as a character is thanks to Kirk's sheer awesomeness [4, Production]. That’s gotta sting.


My Case

As it was Pro’s burden to show Picard was a superior officer to Kirk and I have, at the very least, shown both officers to be equal, Pro loses the debate right here. In fact, I think I’ve already shown Kirk to be preferable in terms of diplomacy, military intelligence, and popularity. For good measure, though, I’ll throw in one more point.

While both officers were long-term soldiers, they received very different types of military recognition for their service. Kirk received his first command at age 31 on Starfleet's flagship, the Enterprise. He served as the head of Starfleet's armada for a record-setting three decades and earned 10 different decorations and commendations, including Medals of Honor, Valor, Tactics, Heroism, Peace, and Gallantry [5]. During this time, he became the youngest Rear Admiral in Starfleet history and took over as the Chief of Starfleet Operations at Starfleet Headquarters. I'll say that again: he freaking ran Starfleet! [3, Later Career].

What about Picard? Well, he received command of the Enterprise at age 59, captained it for 7 years, and received one commendation. A commendation Kirk also earned, I should point out. During this time, he was abducted by a violent race of machines called the Borg, transformed into their king, and was responsible for the death of roughly 11,000 other Starfleet officers and civilians. Expectantly, that incident put a bit of a snag on his career plans and he was denied a promotion to admiral [2, Captain of the Enterprise].

The verdict? Picard is guilty of being second best to the most decorated, respected, feared, Priceline negotiating, female-alien-orgasm-inducing captain of all time: James T. Kirk.

Give it up for the old school.


References

1. http://tinyurl.com...
2. http://en.memory-alpha.org...
3. http://en.memory-alpha.org...
4. http://en.wikipedia.org...
5. http://en.memory-alpha.org...
Debate Round No. 1
6 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 6 records.
Posted by Knologist_Prime 4 years ago
Knologist_Prime
I enjoy the Star Trek universe, but it's all about the writers, relating to 'us', who, what, where, how, and why of the adventures and characters they create or are directed where to go in the story. So you can't compare the characters according to the bias of the writers. A writer can change the circumstances of the elements of fictional characters. My observation. Heck even Harry Kim can be written to be the Greatest Captain there even was. LOL
Posted by Maikuru 4 years ago
Maikuru
Thanks for the quick debate, Pro. It was fun to debate this. I actually love Picard and prefer him to Kirk any day haha.
Posted by daytonanerd 4 years ago
daytonanerd
And also, the man got FUC*ING BORGED and still came back. It proves his dedication and his toughness.
Posted by daytonanerd 4 years ago
daytonanerd
Coolio, lol. You'll have to provide a good case, because the song is like an Orgasm to the debate.
Posted by Maikuru 4 years ago
Maikuru
Thank you for the debate opportunity, Pro. I will probably be cutting it close to the wire.
Posted by Nur-Ab-Sal 4 years ago
Nur-Ab-Sal
I frakking love that song.
4 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Vote Placed by Xerge 4 years ago
Xerge
daytonanerdMaikuruTied
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Total points awarded:05 
Reasons for voting decision: Con's argument's was more in-depth wih stronger sources to support them which allowed him to negate the resolution that Jean-Luc was superior than James Kirk.
Vote Placed by ScottyDouglas 4 years ago
ScottyDouglas
daytonanerdMaikuruTied
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Total points awarded:06 
Reasons for voting decision: Con blew this one away!
Vote Placed by TheOrator 4 years ago
TheOrator
daytonanerdMaikuruTied
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Total points awarded:05 
Reasons for voting decision: There was really no contest here. If you want to do a one round debate (which is pretty difficult for any instigator), you need to write a very in-depth and well thought out case, which Con did and you did not. The sources was obvious as well.
Vote Placed by Nur-Ab-Sal 4 years ago
Nur-Ab-Sal
daytonanerdMaikuruTied
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Total points awarded:05 
Reasons for voting decision: I liked Pro's video, but Con provided a well thought out response with more reliable sources. The one round debate situation helped Con secure a victory.