The Instigator
GarretKadeDupre
Pro (for)
Winning
19 Points
The Contender
smlburridge
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points

Catholicism Requires Young Earth Creationism & Geocentrism

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 3 votes the winner is...
GarretKadeDupre
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 12/7/2014 Category: Religion
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 618 times Debate No: 66499
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (5)
Votes (3)

 

GarretKadeDupre

Pro

Both I and my opponent are Catholics, so this is a crucial topic for both of us. I will prove that Catholicism requires it's members to believe that the Creation of the Earth, dinosaurs, and man all took place within one literal week, and also requires belief that Earth is immobile.

I look forward to my opponent accepting my debate!
smlburridge

Con

I'm accepting this challenge under the basis I must prove that Catholicism does not require YEC and Geocentrism (to its members).
Debate Round No. 1
GarretKadeDupre

Pro

Thanks for accepting!

Before I begin, I'd like to emphasize that my opponent is a self-described Catholic, which means that any arguments of his that implicitly deny the truth of Catholicism would be disingenuous, and I hope that voters would frown upon such a tactic (if he even utilizes that strategy, which I trust he won't).

On to my arguments:
  • [I]t is absolutely wrong and forbidden, either to narrow inspiration to certain parts only of Holy Scripture, or to admit that the sacred writer has erred.
  • - Pope Leo XII in his encyclical PROVIDENTISSIMUS DEUS(1)

Catholics must consent to this prohibition, which effectively confirms that the Bible contains not a single error regarding any topic. I'd like Con to explicitly concede to this point, if he doesn't mind.

  • [I]n six days the Lord made heaven and earth, and the sea, and all things that are in them
  • - Exodus 20:11

If Con doesn't want to violate Pope Leo's aforementioned prohibition, he must now concede that this verse from the Bible is 100% true and divinely inspired, and God really did make the universe within 6 days.

  • [I]t is not permissible for anyone to interpret Holy Scripture in a sense contrary to[...] the unanimous consent of the fathers.
  • - Dogmatic constitution on the Catholic faith, Vatican Council I, summoned by Pope Pius IX(2)

Con must now concede that he agrees with the Church Fathers' interpretation of the Bible on every single point where every Church Father was in agreement. In other words, if every Church Father believed Jesus was speaking literally whenever he said, "This is my body", then Catholics must agree that Jesus was speaking literally.

  • The unanimous consent of the Church Fathers, regarding the interpretation of the Bible, was that the Creation of the world took place within a span of time no longer than a single, literal week.

A Church Father is saint that lived before the 8th century, and has been approved by the Church as such. Here(3) is a list of some of them:

  • Clement of Rome
  • Ignatius
  • Polycarp
  • Justin Martyr
  • Irenaeus
  • Cyprian
  • Athanasius
  • Basil
  • Cyril of Jerusalem
  • Ambrose
  • John Chrysostom
  • Jerome
  • Augustine
  • Cyril of Alexandria
  • Pope Leo the Great
  • and Pope Gregory the Great


It's a historical fact that every single of these, and also all not listed, agreed on the Immobile Earth interpretation of the Bible. Doctor of the Church, St. Robert Bellarmine, agrees with me:

  • [T]he Council prohibits interpreting Scripture against the common consensus of the Holy Fathers; and if [you] read[...] the Holy Fathers[...], you will find all agreeing in the literal interpretation that the sun is in heaven and turns around the earth with great speed, and that the earth is very far from heaven and sits motionless[...]
  • - Bellarmine to Paolo Antonio Foscarini, April 12, 1615

Con could easily debunk this crucial argument of mine by quoting a single of the Church Fathers rejecting the immobile Earth interpretation, but he will not, because such a quote does not exist.

I will also assert that every Church Father subscribed to a Biblical Creation which took place over a span of time no longer than a period of one literal week, necessitating Young Earth Creationism. This is another premise Con will be unable to disprove.

Since Catholics must adhere to the unanimous consensus of the Fathers when it comes to interpreting the Bible's passages regarding Young Earth Creationism and an immobile Earth, I have successfully proven the resolution.

(1) http://w2.vatican.va...

(2) http://www.ewtn.com...

(3) http://www.catholic.com...

smlburridge

Con

smlburridge forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 2
GarretKadeDupre

Pro

Con did not even attempt to muster a defense of position, for which I cannot blame him since his position is absolutely indefensible.


smlburridge

Con

smlburridge forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
GarretKadeDupre

Pro

I wish people who accept debates then go offline indefinitely after wasting their opponent's time would get banned for a month as soon as they signed back on and have a dunce hat put as their avatar for a month.
smlburridge

Con

smlburridge forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
GarretKadeDupre

Pro

Please vote for Pro! Thanks.
smlburridge

Con

smlburridge forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 5
5 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Posted by GarretKadeDupre 2 years ago
GarretKadeDupre
Lol thanks Zarroette =)
Posted by OverLordSandwich 2 years ago
OverLordSandwich
Let me help Con out:
http://www.debate.org...
Posted by smlburridge 2 years ago
smlburridge
Alright.
Posted by GarretKadeDupre 2 years ago
GarretKadeDupre
yea'd I rather that, thanks
Posted by smlburridge 2 years ago
smlburridge
Before I begin posting my arguments, do you want Round 1 to be acceptance so we have equal time for rebuttals?
3 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Vote Placed by Zarroette 2 years ago
Zarroette
GarretKadeDupresmlburridgeTied
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Total points awarded:60 
Reasons for voting decision: Con never attempted to rebut Pro's arguments, so arguments go to Pro. Sources to Pro, too, for providing the best ones. Conduct to Pro, too, for Con's round forfeits. Garret, I reckon that you're the best debater of Christian issues on DDO. I've seen you give people like Roy a run for their money on issues that are quite unpopular on this site. Keep up the good work :)
Vote Placed by dsjpk5 2 years ago
dsjpk5
GarretKadeDupresmlburridgeTied
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Total points awarded:70 
Reasons for voting decision: Full forfeit
Vote Placed by lannan13 2 years ago
lannan13
GarretKadeDupresmlburridgeTied
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Total points awarded:60 
Reasons for voting decision: Forfeiture