The Instigator
candice
Pro (for)
Losing
20 Points
The Contender
InkSlinger4
Con (against)
Winning
34 Points

Christian's believe Marriage is for earth, not heaven.

Do you like this debate?NoYes+0
Add this debate to Google Add this debate to Delicious Add this debate to FaceBook Add this debate to Digg  
Vote Here
Pro Tied Con
Who did you agree with before the debate?
Who did you agree with after the debate?
Who had better conduct?
Who had better spelling and grammar?
Who made more convincing arguments?
Who used the most reliable sources?
Reasons for your voting decision
1,000 Characters Remaining
The voting period for this debate does not end.
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 5/8/2008 Category: Religion
Updated: 9 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 2,516 times Debate No: 3953
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (3)
Votes (17)

 

candice

Pro

Jesus said, "You are in error because you do not know the Scriptures of the power of God. At the resurrection people will neither marry not be given in marriage; they will be like the angels of heaven. But about the resurrection of the dead- have you not read what God said to you, I am the God of Abraham, The God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? He is not the God of the dead, but of the living."
Matthew22:29-33

Please explain to me now, how Mormon's believe you are married in heaven. Not only married to one wife, but MANY. Do the words of Jesus Christ, Savior and Redeemer mean nothing to Mormons? Not only does this scripture disprove Mormon's eternal marriage and Godhood, it ALSO makes they're baptism and marriage's for the dead sacrilegious.

Joseph Smith had 84 (documented) wives. He started practicing plural marriage BEFORE his said "revelation". Then, after the "revelation" he outright LIED about Mormon's endorsing it. Would a true profit of God deny his laws? No.

So, Jesus Christ has said there is no marriage in heaven, and your marriage on earth is not for heaven. So, exactly where does that put YOU? Your Mormon prophet's can change Mormon belief's all they like, but the Lord Jesus Christ never changes. Do you believe in the Bible? If you do, you need to do some real soul searching, because your beliefs highly contradict it.
InkSlinger4

Con

Firstly, I myself have never quite gotten plural marriage, and it has not been practiced by real Mormons in a very long time.

With that being said, your scripture quoting does not in any way disprove Mormon beliefs. It stated, as it seems to me, that no marriage ordinances will be preformed in Heaven. It did not say that people's marriages will be dissolved. Indeed, this would e a sorry state of living. When you love someone, how comforting is it to say that you'll be joined to them in life but then you're on your own? Our Heavenly Father wants us to be happy, and being separated from my family personally, would not be conducive to this.

Neither does it prove baptisms and sealings for the dead to be sacrilegious. Even if it proved marriage wrong, it did not refer to these other ordinances in any way.

You also spelled 'Prophet' wrong. In reference to our first, i'd like some sources before I take what you say at face value. What do mean about lying about Mormons endorsing it? Your argument becomes increasingly unclear.

And, for the record, we do believe in the bible. If we didn't, your whole argument would be null in my eyes.
Debate Round No. 1
candice

Pro

Jesus said (as I quoted before) "people will neither marry nor be given in marriage; they will be like the angels of heaven." So, he said you will not marry, NOR be given in marriage. Meaning, you will not be married. Those are two separate statements. You will not marry, nor will be married. Jesus also says you will be like the angels in Heaven.
You say that "real" Mormons haven't practiced polygamy in a long time… but what about your husband having many wives in Heaven? Current Mormons believe there will polygamy on they're planet.
Angels do not reproduce. A little history about this: In Genesis 6:4, it says Angels (through most translations) were indeed coming to earth and having children with women. Who were giants or heroes of old, and men of renown. BUT, it's proven God wasn't happy with this… because in the very next chapter he decided men were evil, all except for Noah. It goes on to say in Jude, that those Angels that had abandoned they're positions in Heaven have been kept in darkness bound with everlasting chains waiting for the Judgment Day. So, if this displeased God so much, why then would he be promoting it?

It also says, "Before Me there was no God formed, And there will be none after Me." Isaiah 43:10 This does not sound like a God promoting MILLIONS of planets with they're own Gods.

"I told the brethren that the Book of Mormon was the most correct of any book on earth, and the keystone of our religion, and a man would get nearer to God by abiding by its precepts, than by any other book". – Joseph Smith

Christians believe the Bible is complete, and it is all you need to obtain salvation. Jesus Christ is the true way to everlasting life. The closest you can be to God, is excepting Jesus Christ his son into your heart. PERIOD. Also, it says that you only have this one life, and you have not a second chance. In Matthew, Jesus says that if you don't fully except and live through him, he will say " I do not know you". It never says, if you don't live good enough to go to heaven, if your relative baptizes themselves for you, you're saved. Jesus has given us the one and only key. It's up to us to grasp it.

Yes, you do believe in the Bible. Although, as I've stated above obviously your founding prophet didn't really revere it as Christians do. Joseph Smith saying that is blasphemy.

<>

This statement scares me, because it sounds like you would give up the Bible if your prophet asked you to. Is that true? If your prophet said we no longer needed the Bible, would you obey?

I'm confused what you need sources for... please clarify and I will provide them.
InkSlinger4

Con

Your response to my comment about the bible is so misguided, I'm amused. I was referring to to fact that if my religion did not believe in the bible, which it does, your entire argument (being completely based on the bible), would have no effect on my beliefs. Also, I want a source on your info on Joseph Smith's 'lying', and other acts you claim an abomination. If you look Mormons up online, you can find mountains of hate- but that doesn't mean any of it's true. I want truth, not hate.

And Joseph Smith did not say the Bible was blasphemous. He merely said the Book of Mormon was even more correct. Really, that makes perfect sense. Who knows how many times the bible has been changed, translated, tweaked, corrupted? We still believe in its truth, but it would be impossible for it to remain pure.

With the marriage thing: If you know grammar, you will understand that, yes, I mean no one will get married- and that not being married is a completely different thing that is not referred to.

Also, when you say this whole heaven, hell thing: The afterlife is one of our greatest differences, one that we're not discussing. We believe that we don't go to heaven or hell, but to spirit paradise and spirit prison. Spirit prison is not bad, but a place where you learn if you didn't get a chance to during your lifetime. Also, these people can have the ordinances they weren't able to do while they were alive done for them. It's a bit unfair to go to hell just because you weren't introduced to the church, isn't it?

As to your Isaiah scripture, I read the context, and it definitely appears to me that he's referring to the fact that there would be nor was no other savior in this world. Really, he's not talking about God as it applies to ruling the heavens at all.

Your angel thing is a really odd argument. We actually do believe that if you are not married you will become an angel, so that's all well and good, but your example is not at all applicable. Please explain more if you want me to take it seriously.
Debate Round No. 2
candice

Pro

candice forfeited this round.
InkSlinger4

Con

You know, I kinda feel bad that you missed that. It shows a lack of care on your part.

But then, of course, I don't have to go through with rebutting flawed information.

Suffice it to say, my opponent has not been clear, has not understood clear statements, and has not produced clear evidence. The fact that she has missed an argument cements her confusing debating as something to be deplored.

People on Earth get married because they want to be together forever. When people die, the people still alive usually comfort themselves with the fact that they are then in the arms of their loved ones. Marriage is a sacred ordinance, and it wouldn't be broken up with so little a cause of death- our Heavenly Father wants us to be happy.
Debate Round No. 3
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by candice 8 years ago
candice
sorry about not being on... my mother has cancer and I've been in Oklahoma. I'm totally down for redoing all my debates I didn't get to finish.
Posted by b3rk 9 years ago
b3rk
Candice has dropped off the site since I pwned her in the Joseph Smith debate. Guess She's finally given up her anti-mormon crusade.
Posted by Geekis_Khan 9 years ago
Geekis_Khan
Polygamy was practiced by Mormons because during the beginning of the religion, in the area where they lived at, their was a disproportionate amount of women to men.

The other stuff, I'm not up enough on Mormonism to actually comment on, but there is an argument against the PRO case that CON isn't saying, and it has to do with what marriage was actually viewed as in Christianity originally (HINT: ask a Catholic). But, of course, I'm not going to help either side here. I just wanted to make both debaters aware of something that it seemed both of you didn't know.
17 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Vote Placed by apologia101 6 years ago
apologia101
candiceInkSlinger4Tied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:Vote Checkmark--2 points
Total points awarded:70 
Vote Placed by RacH3ll3 8 years ago
RacH3ll3
candiceInkSlinger4Tied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:--Vote Checkmark3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:10 
Vote Placed by KRFournier 8 years ago
KRFournier
candiceInkSlinger4Tied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:-Vote Checkmark-1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:04 
Vote Placed by mo-yahoo 8 years ago
mo-yahoo
candiceInkSlinger4Tied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:03 
Vote Placed by els21 8 years ago
els21
candiceInkSlinger4Tied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:03 
Vote Placed by mikelwallace 8 years ago
mikelwallace
candiceInkSlinger4Tied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:03 
Vote Placed by gogott 8 years ago
gogott
candiceInkSlinger4Tied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:03 
Vote Placed by sully 8 years ago
sully
candiceInkSlinger4Tied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:-Vote Checkmark-3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:03 
Vote Placed by candice 8 years ago
candice
candiceInkSlinger4Tied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:30 
Vote Placed by ecstatica 9 years ago
ecstatica
candiceInkSlinger4Tied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Agreed with after the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
Who had better conduct:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Had better spelling and grammar:--Vote Checkmark1 point
Made more convincing arguments:Vote Checkmark--3 points
Used the most reliable sources:--Vote Checkmark2 points
Total points awarded:30