The Instigator
Crazy4Steelers07
Pro (for)
Losing
42 Points
The Contender
mongeese
Con (against)
Winning
46 Points

College Football D-I should have a Play-off System

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 13 votes the winner is...
mongeese
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 6/8/2009 Category: Sports
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,260 times Debate No: 8560
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (8)
Votes (13)

 

Crazy4Steelers07

Pro

The BCS: The Bull Sh*t Championship. Look at any sport, where do computers and peoples opinions play any factor in who wins a championship? The best team is decided on the field, and through a play-off. Look at the MLB, MLL, MLS, NBA, and NHL they all have play-off systems. The NHL, MLB, and NBA all even have play-off systems for their minor leagues teams (NFL, MLL, and MLS don't have minor leagues). Each sports uses their own system, but they all work and at the end no one can doubt that the team that survived the test of the play-offs is not truly the Champion. The BCS has left a bad taste in everyone's mouth, because of all the hype and prestige that college football gets: The championship is rigged. When the Magic where facing the Cav's in the Eastern Confrence Finals, everyone wanted to see Kobe/Lebron, Stan Van Gundy (The Magic Coach) angerly replied to reporters on the question of everyone wanting to see those 2 in the finals, "This isn't the BCS where people get to vote [on] who gets to play. This is real sports where it's decided on the court."

But WAIT, these are just kids where talking about�€�poor little college althetes who could in no way stand the tests or pressure of a play-off system. BS, look at NCAA College Football FBS-Subdivision, NCAA College Football D-II, NCAA College Football D-III, NCAAB (D-I, D-II, D-III), NCAABW (D-I, D-II, D-III), College Soccer (Men's and Women's), College Volleyball (Men and Women's), College Baseball, College Softball, College Hockey (Men and Women's), College Lacrosse, and even College Water Polo. Let's even look below college, in all division of High School football in every state of America, and Washington D. C., High School football teams span the rigiourous test of a play-off system to win a state championship (When my high school team won state last year we played in 6 play-off games), also High School Basketball, Volleyball, Soccer, Baseball, and Softball teams all compete in play-offs. When everyone at every level, everywhere is competing in a play-off what's stopping D-I college football?

The Plan: Have one 16-team play-off system seed 1 through 16. The winners of each 11 conferences getting an automatic bid (The champion of each conference) and 5 at large bids to be determined by a committee similar to the basketball selection committee for the NCAA Basketball Tournaments. The System would see games staged the week after the conclusion of the regular season with the 1 vs. 16 seed, 2 vs. 15 seed and so on. The tournament would be standarded bracketed with the one seed hitting either the 8 or the 9th seed in the second round. The first two round would be played with the lower seed having the home field advantage, where the semi's and final's would be held at neutral sites (Most likely the Rose, Orange, and Fiesta bowl locations). [Please, keep in mind this is only the most ideal and competative format. Their are dozens of other possibilities for a play-off system, I am only suggesting one to fall back on in this debate. Simply because any voters or my challenger disagree with the system I am proposing doesn't mean you should vote against me. You have to see the logic of my analysis based on why we need a play-off system, not which one is perfect.]

Contention #1- Stuck on an Outdated Bowl System
Dan Wetzel may have said it best, when he stated, "Ignore outdated bowls games. BCS bowl games are the single worst deal in American sports." Basically the bowl system works like this: Copurrate sponsors set up and run bowls, make huge profits on advertising and sales while dishing some money to the teams participating. I have nothing against using bowl games to celebrate a winning season for a college football team, if anything it's a good reward for having a successful season, But the problem resides in the fact that no one is willing to think outside of the Bowls for any practical solution. The Rose Bowl, and Orange Bowl, and Fiesta Bowl hold so much history in college football to let them slip the way side would just be terrible. Not when the real solution is better. As far as bowl games are concerned: They can remain. As long as teams are eligible and willing to participate in then why not host them? But this must be done con-current with a play-off where the best teams compete against each other to produce a champion.

Contention #2- The Season Would be TOOOOOO Long
Again, I really want to talk to the people that feed America this bull. What if I could tell you that with in a college football play-off the season would be shorter, fewer teams would have to play/practice as long, and thus midigate the risk of injury? Ok, so eight teams would play and extra game, four two, and two three. A relatively small price to pay: a total of seven extra games for over a hundred schools in D-I. However, the play-off system could have some sense about it, and start the week after the conclusion of the regular season: taking away the month of practicing and extra workouts coach put their players through because they are playing in a bowl game Jan. 7th when the season ended the first weekend in December. Also conferences, like the Big Ten would not have to play with the severe handi-cap of taking almost 2 months off before playing in a BCS game just because they finished their seasons earlier due to more compact scheduling. People argue that to many kids would miss class (and final) with this 'longer' season: 1) I just shortened it 2) The real toll on students is preparing for the games, if the have games after exams they still have to practice before and during exams. 3)No system, even the current bowl one, can work around every schools exam schedule.
If I still haven't convincied you look at this: Due to the way college football runs its clock, there are about 10 percent more plays in a college game than a pro one (135 to 122), which means they're already playing an extra game, game and a half now. Change the clock timing, and boom you shave the number of games being played by almost 50 across D-I, and then you add 7 extra. That saves 43 games players could get injured in a season plus adds a play-off, nice.

Contention #3- College Football Would Be Fair
How would you like to play in a league, where at the beginning of the season the coach sits your whole team down and says, "Look guys, I don't care if we blow everyone out by 50 points, Go Undefeated, and winn the MAC. The Truth is we can't win a championship this year, because we don't have a �€˜history' of being good." Why even have teams in a league who can't win? You laugh, and say �€˜everyone has a fair shot'. Go bring that up with the people from Utah, the only undefeated team in D-I this year, where is their Championship? Or what about Boise state in '07? Or Utah(again) in '04 (or Auburn in '04)? What happened their? You know what happened, the system is rigged (and Flawed). It is fixed towards the big schools, who will draw the big crowds and get the big rating and consequently make the big bucks for the cooperate sponsor's of the BCS games (Tostitos, FedEx). A play-off system would allow un-bias and fair results by allowing champions of smaller conferences to play with the big boys, and if they lose so what? At least they had their chance, but when they win that would be something else. The magic of the NCAA Basketball tournament resides in the �€˜Cinderella' run of a huge under-dog. Why not allow that in College Football?
Furthermore, the BCS fails to account for any senerio where three or more teams go undefeated in the regular season, a play-off would.

Quite simply their is only one solution. College football must change over to a play-off system. If they want to keep their credibility, or even pretend they are a 'real' sport. I D-I is so competative. Then prove it, what are they scared of? In America we have a system, one system to determine the champion, the best, and that system is a play-off.
mongeese

Con

So, you say that the people who run D-I have the opportunity to have more fairness, better football, and more profit?
Then why don't they have this yet?
They must obviously have a reason.
Perhaps they can't have a play-off system.
They might be locked into a contract.
They might not have enough time.
They might be unable to afford it.
I don't know.
But they do.
They might be unable to do a lot of things.
Perhaps they don't want to have a play-off system.
They might like the current system better.
They might have more profits under the BCS.
They might appreciate the fan excitement from voting.
They might want their students to study for finals rather than watch football.
I don't know.
But they do.
They might want a lot of things.
However, there must be a reason why they have the current system they have, as opposed to a new one.
If play-off systems were so beneficial and viable, as you claim, then College Football D-I would already have one.
But they don't.
They either can't do it, or they don't want to do it.
Obviously, they know more about this stuff than you do.
But they shouldn't have something that they can't have.
But they shouldn't have something that they don't want to have, when they want something else instead.
Therefore, College Football D-I should not have a play-off system.

America is a capitalistic country. It runs on capitalism. People shouldn't have something forced upon them by the fans that lowers this profit. College football is already unprofitable, and is paid for by the American taxpayers. Any money they save by using the BCS actually keeps more money from being taken from the rest of America.

Obviously, either they don't want to have a play-off system, or they can't have a play-off system. Therefore, they shouldn't have a play-off system.

I will now address my opponent's attacks.

"When everyone at every level, everywhere is competing in a play-off what's stopping D-I college football?"
Nothing's stopping them. They just decided to make a different choice. It's not nice to make fun of things because they're different.

The plan: let College Football D-I have whatever system they choose, because it is their choice, not yours. Their choice is BCS. Therefore, College Football D-I should have a Bowl Championship Series system, and not a play-off system.

The arguments involving the "outdated bowl system" and a season that is "TOOOOOO Long" can apply to both a play-off system and a Bowl Championship Series system.

There is then an argument about the fairness of the BCS, and how it is rigged for the teams that get more votes. The solution is simple: remove the polls. Let the teams have to work hard in the season to make it to the finals.

"Quite simply their is only one solution."
There are two: play-off and BCS.

"College football must change over to a play-off system."
No, they can do what they like.

"If they want to keep their credibility, or even pretend they are a 'real' sport."
Apparently, in my opponent's mind, they don't. However, that doesn't matter.

"Then prove it, what are they scared of?"
They aren't scared of anything. They just want more money so that they can have better colleges.

"In America we have a system, one system to determine the champion, the best, and that system is a play-off."
It may be the most accurate, but it's not the cheapest, and it's not the most convenient. The BCS is more efficient due to its needing less time, money, and effort.

In conclusion, due to an irrefutable syllogism of pure logic, College Football D-I should not have a play-off system.

Vote CON.
Debate Round No. 1
Crazy4Steelers07

Pro

I was kind of hoping to find a new opponent in this debate....I just like the topic its fun. But I'm seriously not re-debating the same person on the same side again. Go read our other debate and vote on that one.
mongeese

Con

"I was kind of hoping to find a new opponent in this debate....I just like the topic its fun."
You could have told me that before I accepted the debate.

"But I'm seriously not re-debating the same person on the same side again."
Yes, you are. We are debating. This is a debate.

"Go read our other debate and vote on that one."
No. The two debates are separate. Use the other debate to decide who won that debate. Use this debate to decide who won this debate. There are even different resolutions.

My opponent has conceded my logical syllogism. He has conceded the resolution. Vote CON.
Debate Round No. 2
mongeese

Con

My opponent apparently does not want to debate this again.

He has conceded.

He even conceded the first time.

Vote CON.
Debate Round No. 3
Crazy4Steelers07

Pro

College football is unprofitable? http://www.fanblogs.com...
Its extremly profitable. And a play-off would make it even more profitable.

Oh, and by the way. The reason its america's bussiness how College Football runs the BCS is because, as I stated. Its Illegal....http://sports.espn.go.com... I stated Ubstruction of Trade, because its rigged.
mongeese

Con

"College football is unprofitable?
Its[sic] extremly[sic] profitable. And a play-off would make it even more profitable."
That list just shows revenue. It doesn't say how much the colleges actually paid.

From "Economic Facts and Fallacies," page 119:
"On the contrary, [football and basketball] and other sports more commonly cost more money than they bring in... In 2006, Ohio State became the first academic institution to spend more than $100 million on its many athletic programs."

Furthermore, with play-offs, it would cost more money to set up all of the games, and get the teams prepared, and whatnot. The BCS remains more profitable, and more efficient.

"Oh, and by the way. The reason its america's[sic] business[sic] how College Football runs the BCS is because, as I stated. Its[sic] Illegal.... I stated Ubstruction[sic] of Trade, because its[sic] rigged."
You have a source fail. Your source doesn't directly open up into anything legible.
Furthermore, I proposed the removal of polls from the BCS, which would undo any "rigged" components.

Plus, it probably isn't illegal.
http://sports.espn.go.com...
"'This issue has been looked at before,' Swofford said. 'We're confident that it complies with the law.'"

In conclusion, my opponent has still conceded the resolution. Vote CON.
Debate Round No. 4
Crazy4Steelers07

Pro

W/e a play-off is better vote pro, if u vote con have fun with your BCS, but don't watch any of my Play-offs every again. Obviously, since they suck: Don't watch them. And I won't watch your rigged BCS, 'cause its stupid and not right. Make your choice, but game seven of the Penguins/Red Wings....mine all mine....have you sixty point blow out championships. I'll take my play-off. ('cause its better)
mongeese

Con

"W/e a play-off is better vote pro, if u vote con have fun with your BCS, but don't watch any of my Play-offs every again."
BCS isn't mine, and play-offs aren't yours.

"Obviously, since they suck: Don't watch them."
My opponent concedes the resolution. Vote CON.

"And I won't watch your rigged BCS, 'cause its[sic] stupid and not right."
You are entitled to your own opinion, I guess.

"Make your choice, but game seven of the Penguins/Red Wings....mine all mine....have you sixty point blow out[sic] championships."
Yours, all yours? College football belongs to the colleges. Be glad that you even get to watch.

"I'll take my play-off. ('cause its[sic] better)"
That's nice.

My opponent gives no real reason to vote PRO.

My syllogism of logic still stands.

Then why don't they have this yet?
They must obviously have a reason.
Perhaps they can't have a play-off system.
They might be locked into a contract.
They might not have enough time.
They might be unable to afford it.
I don't know.
But they do.
They might be unable to do a lot of things.
Perhaps they don't want to have a play-off system.
They might like the current system better.
They might have more profits under the BCS.
They might appreciate the fan excitement from voting.
They might want their students to study for finals rather than watch football.
I don't know.
But they do.
They might want a lot of things.
However, there must be a reason why they have the current system they have, as opposed to a new one.
If play-off systems were so beneficial and viable, as you claim, then College Football D-I would already have one.
But they don't.
They either can't do it, or they don't want to do it.
Obviously, they know more about this stuff than you do.
But they shouldn't have something that they can't have.
But they shouldn't have something that they don't want to have, when they want something else instead.
Therefore, College Football D-I should not have a play-off system.

The resolution is negated. Vote CON.
Debate Round No. 5
8 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 8 records.
Posted by mongeese 5 years ago
mongeese
Why is Barack Obama president of the U.S.?
Posted by wjmelements 5 years ago
wjmelements
Why does PRO have points?
Posted by mongoose 5 years ago
mongoose
"Somebody gave my opponent spelling and grammar?"

Of course! "Somebody" is an idiot!
Posted by mongeese 5 years ago
mongeese
Somebody gave my opponent spelling and grammar?
Posted by mongeese 5 years ago
mongeese
Conduct: CON
PRO continued to resist the need to put up an argument.

S/G: CON
"I stated Ubstruction of Trade, because its rigged."

Convincing Arguments: CON
"In conclusion, my opponent has still conceded the resolution. Vote CON."

Sources: CON
PRO had one internet source, while CON had logic, an internet source, and "Economic Facts and Fallacies."
Posted by mongoose 5 years ago
mongoose
You know, you could block him from accepting your debates.
Posted by mongeese 5 years ago
mongeese
Why not?
Posted by Crazy4Steelers07 5 years ago
Crazy4Steelers07
sERIOUSLY Y WOULD WE DO THIS AGAIN
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