The Instigator
Tommy.leadbetter
Pro (for)
Winning
7 Points
The Contender
Max.Wallace
Con (against)
Losing
6 Points

Communism is better than capitalism

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 3 votes the winner is...
Tommy.leadbetter
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 9/14/2014 Category: Society
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 925 times Debate No: 61713
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (10)
Votes (3)

 

Tommy.leadbetter

Pro

Communism-(from Latin communis " common, universal)[1][2] is a socioeconomic system structured upon common ownership of the means of production and characterized by the absence of social classes, money,[3][4] and the state; as well as a social, political and economic ideology and movement that aims to establish this social order.

I argue that this system is better for humanity than the capitalist system. By 'better' I mean:

More sustainable
Happier population
Healthier population
Better technology, science and art
Less crime
Better for the worlds environment

Capitalist system- Capitalism is an economic system in which trade, industry, and the means of production are largely or entirely privately owned and operated for profit.[1][2] Central characteristics of capitalism include capital accumulation, competitive markets and wage labour.[3] In a capitalist economy, the parties to a transaction typically determine the prices at which assets, goods, and services are exchanged.[4]

It's argument is about the two idea's, and their impact on society. Not about whether Stalin was a bad guy or not! Please no Stalin references!

Thank you
Max.Wallace

Con

The most powerful humans on this planet have been communists, I argue that makes them the ultimate capitalists. There is no difference from one to another, they are all tyrants, disguised as saints. Only those with something to gain would follow either.
Debate Round No. 1
Tommy.leadbetter

Pro

Tommy.leadbetter forfeited this round.
Max.Wallace

Con

Why do you quit? The real reason please.
Debate Round No. 2
Tommy.leadbetter

Pro

I apologise for the forfeiture. I deeply regret not being able to respond, and my argument would have only been short. However I was called up to work and have had no time to debate. I mean literally no time, 6 hours sleep amid 40 hours of pressured work. However, here is what I wished I could of said:

I agree with everything you said, apart from the fact that all communists are the ultimate capitalists. They may share many of the same traits, and even be worse, but they are not strictly 'capitalists'. For 'capitalism' is a defined word, who's definition is in contradiction to communists. I don't think my opponent meant this point to be important anyway, so I will leave it here.

You say: "There is no difference from one to another, they are all tyrants".

Who are tyrants? This debate has not mentioned anything about individuals. This debate was meant to be about the two concepts, and which one would be better for society. I assume you are talking about the 'leaders' anyhow, but if you agree that leaders are "no different from one too another" and all tyrants: then surely a system built on communal ownership rather than private ownership, is better as is has less and less powerful 'leaders'.

You then say: "only those with something to gain would follow either".

I Agee with this too. But is this not normal? The reason why people do almost anything, if not everything, is to gain something.

I think the problem is you haven't heeded my opening argument. This argument isn't about whether previous people who described themselves as communists where bad or not, I know they where. It's about whether the communist ideology would be better than the capitalist ideology, for ensuring a better society.
Max.Wallace

Con

normalcy is good in your book? why are you here? because you are normal? Be normal, and you will be rewarded, fools.
Debate Round No. 3
Tommy.leadbetter

Pro

Tommy.leadbetter forfeited this round.
Max.Wallace

Con

Set yourself free. Be abnormal! I hope your work is the real gods will Tommy, not just the ones that most god fearing folk imagine it should be.
Debate Round No. 4
10 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by Max.Wallace 2 years ago
Max.Wallace
Voters usually just vote, with out a contemplative thought in their pea brain.
Posted by Max.Wallace 2 years ago
Max.Wallace
I pray your tyrant, of the capitalist or communist sort, whatever thy be, gives you time for yourself. Who I pray to is not man, or otherwise, I pray for the good.
Posted by Max.Wallace 2 years ago
Max.Wallace
I am arguing the title.
Posted by Max.Wallace 2 years ago
Max.Wallace
Please, go get some sleep, and spend time with your friends and family. My retort will be there in a day or two. Forget about this and have a good time, if your words are the truth. We will gather this conversation up at a later date, in a day or 2, go have some fum, that is living!
Posted by Emilirose 2 years ago
Emilirose
This should be easy for con. Communism does not apply to any of the stated above things. Such as "happier population", and better "technology, science and art". One only has to study the history of communism to establish that.
Posted by cheyennebodie 2 years ago
cheyennebodie
And as far as wages go. Free enterprise is as follows.If you work for a company anf the average joe puts out 30 widgets an hour. And you put our 50 widgets an hour. Then you can walk into the office and say you want maybe 25% raise.A smart man would look at that and see that he is still paying less per widget and give you the raise instead of risking you going to his competitor. Then you have the societal wimps go to government and say to them. If you force by law the company to pay me morethen I will vote for you.Now that is fascism. Then the really lazy freeloaders will go to government and tell them, if you force people with money to pay my bills, then I will vote for you. That is socialism.
Posted by cheyennebodie 2 years ago
cheyennebodie
HOW is capitalism tyrannical.All capitalism is, is two or more people entering into a contract on goods or services and agree on a price. That is all it is. Communism is government forcing prices by control of law.And if a capitalist ( someone who has money ) comes into a foreign nation to buy goods or services, how is that tyrannical.It is again two or more people agreeing on a price.

Communism is government in control. And they would control mainly for political purposes. What would keep THEM in power. And they would stay in power even at the point of a gun. Whereas the capitalist has only weapons he has to keep in business. Price or improvement over the competitor.He cannot come in to my house and force me to buy or do anything.But the lowest government bureaucrat can force me to jump through many hoops just to satisfy him. And if they do not like you can add a lot more hoops. Just try building something under these new international building codes states like Pennsylvania have adopted.Communism has always ended with a firing squad.
Posted by Max.Wallace 2 years ago
Max.Wallace
nice, but capitalism is every bit as tyrannical to the world. The main problem is that so many people are willing to run away. If the communists stayed in their own country and put up a fight instead of running away then what would be the result? If the wanna be capitalists stayed in their own country and fought for that what would happen? Cowardice is the evil. Run away, to a better place, that is the moral of the UN.

STAY AND FIGHT for your birthplace, if you believe you are right.

Run
Run away
RUN RUN RUN>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
To America!!!!!!!
and make it more like where you came from.
ruiners.
Posted by cheyennebodie 2 years ago
cheyennebodie
Another thing. You say that communism is ,more sustainable than capitalism. Then why did the soviet union fall apart like a cheap watch.And why did communist china restore free enterprise to their country.Please answer these things.
Posted by cheyennebodie 2 years ago
cheyennebodie
Then please tell me why every communist country had to build fences ( the iron curtain, the bamboo curtain) to keep people in.If it would have made your utopia , then you would see people beating the door down to get in. And if capitalism was such an awful system, then why do we have to build fences to keep people out.

And I have never heard of anyone fleeing America to go to Cuba. But we have seen people taking rowboats to Florida to get away from Cuba.

Please explain this to me. Is there something I am missing here?
3 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Vote Placed by IronCurx 2 years ago
IronCurx
Tommy.leadbetterMax.WallaceTied
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Total points awarded:31 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro provided a good argument, Con spent his round denouncing Pro for his forfeitures, Pro refuted all arguments Con had against Pro. However Pro did forfeit so a point goes to Con.
Vote Placed by Hanspete 2 years ago
Hanspete
Tommy.leadbetterMax.WallaceTied
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Total points awarded:14 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro had better conduct but I agree with con.
Vote Placed by bladerunner060 2 years ago
bladerunner060
Tommy.leadbetterMax.WallaceTied
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Total points awarded:31 
Reasons for voting decision: Conduct for the forfeits. As to arguments, this actually should have been an easy win for Con, given the number of forfeits. But his rounds made no sense in light of the resolution, so what very little Pro *did* present stands. As always, happy to clarify this RFD.