The Instigator
MikeyMike
Pro (for)
Winning
75 Points
The Contender
JumperCables18
Con (against)
Losing
1 Points

Consumption of alcohol is not a sin.

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 11 votes the winner is...
MikeyMike
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/22/2012 Category: Religion
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 4,242 times Debate No: 21355
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (67)
Votes (11)

 

MikeyMike

Pro

I'm so very tired of the church constantly giving a bum rap to alcohol and those who consume it, so this debate had to be done.

I will be debating that the consumption of alcoholic beverages is not inherently a sin in regards to the Bible of Christianity. Any generally known orthodox of Christianity can be used so long as it follows the Holy Bible, 66 books, common Bible in use today.

Sin: A transgression of a religious or moral law, especially when deliberate.

Consume: eat, drink, or ingest (food or drink).

Inherent: existing in someone or something as a permanent and inseparable element, quality, or attribute.

First round for acceptance, and for my opponent to post his/her argument if he/she so chooses.

Let's make this a good debate, no equivicating, or silly semantic tactics.

Good luck to my opponent in our mental jousting.
Debate Round No. 1
MikeyMike

Pro

Lmao to my opponent, a thousand thanks for the good troll.

Seeing as my agreed, I don't have to post a strong argument, or any argument at all for that matter, but what the heck, cheers to overachieving.

Jesus turned water into wine.
John 2:1-11-1 On the third day a wedding took place at Cana in Galilee. Jesus' mother was there, 2 and Jesus and his disciples had also been invited to the wedding. 3When the wine was gone, Jesus' mother said to him, "They have no more wine."
4 "Woman,[a] why do you involve me?" Jesus replied. "My hour has not yet come."5His mother said to the servants, "Do whatever he tells you."6 Nearby stood six stone water jars, the kind used by the Jews for ceremonial washing, each holding from twenty to thirty gallons.7 Jesus said to the servants, "Fill the jars with water"; so they filled them to the brim.8 Then he told them, "Now draw some out and take it to the master of the banquet."They did so, 9 and the master of the banquet tasted the water that had been turned into wine. He did not realize where it had come from, though the servants who had drawn the water knew. Then he called the bridegroom aside 10and said, "Everyone brings out the choice wine first and then the cheaper wine after the guests have had too much to drink; but you have saved the best till now."11 What Jesus did here in Cana of Galilee was the first of the signs through which he revealed his glory; and his disciples believed in him (1).


Wine is presented in a positive light multiple times in the Bible.
Psalms 104:14-15-He makes grass grow for the cattle, and plants for man to cultivate--bringing forth food from the earth (2):wine that gladdens the heart of man, oil to make his face shine, and bread that sustains his heart (3).

Ecclesiastes 9:7-Go, eat your food with gladness, and drink your wine with a joyful heart, for it is now that God favors what you do (4).

Alcohol consumption is perfectly fine if done in moderation.
Proverbs 23:20-Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, (5).

Ephesians 5:18-Do not get drunk on wine, which leads to debauchery. Instead, be filled with the Spirit (6).


Sources:
1.http://www.biblegateway.com...
2.http://bible.cc...
3.http://bible.cc...
4.http://bible.cc...
5.http://bible.cc...
6.http://bible.cc...
JumperCables18

Con

Is there a way to end the debate already! You have the arguments, the sources, the unbiased information. We can just call this a friendly victory for you.
Debate Round No. 2
MikeyMike

Pro

Lol I guess, I'll just take the easy win.
JumperCables18

Con

Quite right, governor.
Debate Round No. 3
67 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by RinWindSan 5 years ago
RinWindSan
alcoholism could lead to sin, however like i said before, i think it depends on how much you drink.
Posted by RinWindSan 5 years ago
RinWindSan
let me rephrase: depending on how much you drink.
alcohol itself isn't sin, otherwise Jesus wouldn't have drank wine.
Posted by RinWindSan 5 years ago
RinWindSan
2 much alcohol (if you are religious) IS a sin. it's called gluttony.
Posted by Flame 5 years ago
Flame
"that still doesn't refute what I'm arguing. We're all just agreeing with each other here.."

Not quite, Gileandos is actually using "observation" 1 of "human experience" as evidence. And human experience is one of the avenues of truth.

1 Oran, Daniel, Oran's Dictionary of the Law, pg. 189, Evidence: All types of information (observations, recollections, documents,
concrete objects, etc)
Posted by Flame 5 years ago
Flame
Sorry for double post.
Posted by Flame 5 years ago
Flame
Special revelation has to do with God giving us knowledge through the Bible and the Person of Jesus Christ versus general revelation which represents knowledge from the world literature and science and indeed all human learning and experience. You might as well stop debating, tbh, since philosophical logic is one of the avenues of truth, which falls under general knowledge.
Posted by Flame 5 years ago
Flame
Special revelation has to do with God giving us knowledge through the Bible and the Person of Jesus Christ versus general revelation which represents knowledge from the world literature and science and indeed all human learning and experience. You might as well stop debating, tbh, since philosophical logic is one of the avenues of truth, which falls under general knowledge.
Posted by Flame 5 years ago
Flame
"I personally do not care about your historical data, and made no effort whatsoever to even look into your sources to verify them. My argument is based strictly on the Bible as we know it today."

Hm, oh I see, "the sole authority model:faith against learning" approach. Unfortunate indeed. Your basically saying that faith and learning are antagonistic? Nice. The negative side to that approach your taking is that of the tendency to go against God's general revelation. You do do know there is special and general revelation, right? General revelation represents knowledge from the world literature and science and indeed all human learning and experience. 1

1. Cosgrove, P. Mark, "Foundations of Christian Thought," p. 55-56
Posted by Flame 5 years ago
Flame
"Clearly ur perception of my argument is muddled by something in your head,"

Ad Hominem
"because NEVER in my argument did I argue that the Bible encourages "full strength" drinking."

You might as well have when you you said in plain English this statement, "The Bible portrays wine as a means of social drinking, and to eat with food. The same way many of us do currently." Which I already clearly pointed out is false. Again. you really do not actually believe people today mix wine with water today, or any drinks for that matter do you? O.o

"My argument was that THE ACTION OF ALCOHOL CONSUMPTION IS NOT A SIN IN AND OF ITSELF. Why that's so difficult to understand baffles me..."

Unmixed drinks which is "strong drinks" by Biblical definition is indeed sin. What baffles me is that a pagan has better sense.
Posted by MikeyMike 5 years ago
MikeyMike
that still doesn't refute what I'm arguing. We're all just agreeing with each other here..
11 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Vote Placed by imabench 5 years ago
imabench
MikeyMikeJumperCables18Tied
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Total points awarded:70 
Reasons for voting decision: turns out the con is a multi-accounting troll, all points to the pro
Vote Placed by Neonix 5 years ago
Neonix
MikeyMikeJumperCables18Tied
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Total points awarded:70 
Reasons for voting decision: Incredible. Almost looks like a clone account debate, but I think this one actually ended with genuine admitted defeat.
Vote Placed by Zaradi 5 years ago
Zaradi
MikeyMikeJumperCables18Tied
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Total points awarded:70 
Reasons for voting decision: Reason for my voting decision required? Has it seen what actually happened in the debate round? Screw that. I refuse.
Vote Placed by wiploc 5 years ago
wiploc
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Reasons for voting decision: forfeit
Vote Placed by Wallstreetatheist 5 years ago
Wallstreetatheist
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Reasons for voting decision: Concession
Vote Placed by Xerge 5 years ago
Xerge
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Reasons for voting decision: concession
Vote Placed by popculturepooka 5 years ago
popculturepooka
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Reasons for voting decision: Pretty self-explanatory.
Vote Placed by ConservativePolitico 5 years ago
ConservativePolitico
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Reasons for voting decision: Con was polite.
Vote Placed by johnnyboy54 5 years ago
johnnyboy54
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Reasons for voting decision: Not sure about other denominations, but Catholicism never states that the consumption of alcohol is a sin. Drunkedness maybe but not the consumption of alcohol.
Vote Placed by Maikuru 5 years ago
Maikuru
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Reasons for voting decision: Close one.