The Instigator
american5
Pro (for)
Losing
0 Points
The Contender
imabench
Con (against)
Winning
11 Points

Continuing the war in Afghanistan is necessary

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
imabench
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/27/2012 Category: Politics
Updated: 2 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,325 times Debate No: 21537
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (4)
Votes (2)

 

american5

Pro

I believe continuing the war in the middle east is for the good of the United States of America and its people and these are my reasons.

1. We did not start this war we were attacked and took many losses in finance and life America was attacked and was damaged greatly still hurt by the losses of human life and their great towers.

2. America has not lost 2,000 soldiers the casualties are very low in this war who knows how high Taliban casualties are also the Taliban are hiding in caves they are on their heels we can crush them and liberate the country don't pull back and allow them to regroup and re strengthen themselves and make a new attack.

3. The Taliban are on a Jihad they won't stop attacking until one side is dead.

These are my reasons for continuing the war good luck to my opponent.
imabench

Con

I accept this debate and will argue why the US should not continue the war in Afghanistan. Other than that...

Debate Round No. 1
american5

Pro

As cool as the photo was that my opponent posted he has failed to post his argument I will await his responce.
imabench

Con

I apologize for not posting an argument I thought round 1 was to be an acceptance round only argument. Very well then.

The Pro states three reasons for why we should continue the war, I will examine each point before introducing my own arguments.

1 - "We did not start this war we were attacked..... still hurt by the losses of human life and their great towers"

That is all true, however the man behind the attacks (Bin Laden) is dead, along with many of his top advisers in Al-Qaeda (Al-Qaeda was behind 9-11 not the Taliban). Also the regime that controlled Afghanistan who harbored Al-Qaeda (the Taliban) have been removed from power and have been replaced by a US friendly democratically elected government. If our intention for the war in Afghanistan was revenge then I think we have accomplished that goal since the Taliban no longer controls Afghanistan and that the capabilities of Al-Qaeda to attack other countries including the US has been greatly limited in scope.

2 - "America has not lost 2,000 soldiers the casualties are very low in this war who knows how high Taliban casualties are............. the Taliban are hiding in caves........... don't pull back and allow them to regroup and re strengthen themselves and make a new attack."

America has currently lost about 1,800 troops with about 14,000 sustaining injury. Other countries included however and the death toll of troops spikes to 2,800 with over 22,000 injured
http://en.wikipedia.org...(2001%E2%80%93present)
http://www.globalpost.com...

Sources put Al-Qaeda, Taliban, and other insurgents / terrorists killed at 37,000 to 41,000 giving our side a kill ratio of about 19 to 1, which is quite an accomplishment. However the civilian death toll in Afghanistan as a result of ongoing conflict by US occupation is heavy, the number of civilian deaths range from 14,000 to 35,000 (see previous source) so despite the great success of US troops in open fighting with Al-Qaeda, civilians are still dying. In fact just last week suicide bombers attacked airports killing civilians, and the accidental burning of Qur'an's by US troops has sparked conflicts and outrage between US troops and the people of Afghanistan who we are occupying.

The US is serving a far smaller role in protecting civilians since terrorists now resort to suicide bombing to make their mark while the US constantly strains relations between the US and the Arabic country only causing more tension. That being said it would be in the best interests of the US to withdraw from Afghanistan to prevent any further incidents that could cause strain between the US and Afghanistan and let the country learn to fend for itself.
http://www.mercurynews.com...
http://www.thebostonchannel.com...
http://www.nydailynews.com...
http://www.thenews.com.pk...
http://articles.boston.com...

For the record that last one isnt meant to hate on Santorum, its meant to emphasize how large of a role simple accidents play in US foreign policy regarding Afghanistan

As for the idea that if we withdraw they could attack again, there are two factors we need to consider for that to be true. The first is that we can now defend ourselves at home from them since we know what they are capable of, what they want, how they operate, and how we can beat them. Prior to 9/11 we didnt know anything about Al-Qaeda because we had no reason to, following the War in Afghanistan though we, and the rest of the world, are far more aware and prepared to defend our/their shores from a possible Al-Qaeda attack at home, not through more years of bloody occupation in Afghanistan.

The second condition that must be met for Al-Qaeda to pull off a successful attack or launch another campaign is if they have people to recruit, and after US occupation, the recruiting pool is very narrow now. The lifestyle of people in Afghanistan is much different that it was under terrorist Taliban rule, and now these people have other options career wise. Before 9/11, Afghanistan was a country where you worked hard in agriculture or joined your local militia to fight against other militias, now however people have many more career options, many more markets to learn a trade and master, and the potential to even get out of Afghanistan should they get the chance. If Al-Qaeda is to re-strengthen enough to launch attacks against the US, the first thing they need is countries to recruit fighters, and for Afghanistan they are no longer an optimal target for recruitment, and neither are many other places in the world.

Point is, if we live Afghanistan Al-Qaeda wont be able to rebuild and attack us, the world is aware of their existence and how to defend against them and Al-Qaeda currently does not have many viable options to recruit any mroe fighters because of government reforms in the countries they used to recruit from.

3 - "The Taliban are on a Jihad they won't stop attacking until one side is dead"
Just because they (Al-Qaeda not Taliban) are dealing in extremes doesnt mean we have to also. It is not possible for the US and its allies (the few that are still in Afghanistan) to leave Afghanistan until every last terrorist is vanquished, we would never leave! If their goal is to kill all of us, let them try they wont be able to pull off another 9/11 or any major attack now that we can defend against them. The fact that they hide in mountains and caves in an endless mountain range though gives the US an impossible mission if our goal is to eliminate every last terrorist.

Terrorism will never be vanquished, however the US and its allies have done a hell of a job in limiting the potential kind of war these terrorists can rage, and with a better prepared defense within our own border against them, they are much more harmless then they were ten years ago.

Now for my own arguments

1) We should discontinue the war in Afghanistan is because it is a very costly war at a time when the US is trillions of dollars in debt and just now starting to climb out of a recession. The war in Afghanistan places a huge burden on the US budget ($500,000,000,000 and counting) which could begin to be worked back into the US budget for other expenses to help alleviate our budget problem since the War in Afghanistan costs about 5 Billion a month

http://costofwar.com...
http://www.fas.org...

2) The War in Afghanistan is scheduled to end in 2014, which is two years from now, what exactly could we accomplish in two years that we couldnt in the last 10 besides raise more hell?

3) The government has already began withdrawing from Afghanistan, in fact 40,000 troops are expected to be withdrawn in 2012 alone. If the war were to continue then these war veterans would have to stay in Afghanistan for a mission that doesnt have a clear cause anymroe
http://www.huffingtonpost.com...

4) Afghanistan is comparable to the Vietnam War in length, Iraq is not far behind. This is one of the longest wars in American history and just like the other long wars this one is poised to end in a stalemate. Why continue pouring money, troops, and effort into something that, as history has shown before, will only partially end in our favor

5) Terrorism will not die out, and it is a foolish cause to spend billions of dollars to wipe out terrorism in a single country when we could easily defend against the threat here on our own shores and not becoming entangled in these lengthy stalemates.

6) The US has managed the War very poorly and that will not change, we should not stay in Afghanistan if we keep mishandling this situation.
Debate Round No. 2
american5

Pro

1. Yes Osama bin Laden is dead along with many top advisers but not all and also Al-Qaeda is being hunted by US troops right now but we don't to go chasing after them all over the world with tanks and helicopters and armies why bother that's not the kinda of war Al-Qaeda is fighting they have no cities or armies to meet in battle just little attack groups running around all over the planet also the war with the Taliban would have never started if they had just kicked out Osama when he came for their help and it wasn't a big secret we told them if they didn't give us or at least get rid of Osama then we were going to invade and they disobeyed and as far as replacing them with a American friendly government that maybe so but Afghanistan wasn't ruled by the Taliban leaders to start with they had their own leaders but no military to defend them so they jumped to the Taliban's orders and this government still has no stable military so to leave would just be letting the Taliban give orders again also sure we beat up the Taliban and beat up Al-Qaeda really we beat the crap out of the Taliban and gave Al-Qaeda one heck of a bloody nose but that's not enough these two groups are on Jihad they have to be destroyed every member must die.

2. Yes this is an accomplishment and as far as civilian deaths go this is war there will civilian casualties you can't avoid it and we shouldn't be trying to defend these people are not our civilians and are coasting US lives plus many of these civilians are insurgents themselves not always for the Taliban or Al-Qaeda cause but they still attack simply for their hatred of America being there and sometimes for the cause a man from my town was killed in Afghanistan by a man who he was training to be a militia unit and was considered a civilian but he still attacked and killed the US soldier that was training him my point is though is that it is not our job to protect these people we do it out of the goodness of our heart it is their governments job to defend them not ours and as for burning qur'an's those men have been being attacked because that book told their enemies to do so you can't blame them for wanting its destruction.

3. We knew plenty about Al-Qaeda they had attacked us multiple times before just never on this scale that 9-11 had and before we had plenty of defenses and thought we were untouchable before but we were wrong they did it once and because of American ignorance on the topic they can do it again there are different ways of attacking then hijacking our planes and crashing them into buildings also occupation does not have to be bloody America occupies Germany and Japan with our military and that's not bloody at all.

4. not true the recruiting for Al-Qaeda has been no weaker than before we have even had some Al-Qaeda recruits from the US itself and sure Afghanistan has markets now but that's still hardly anything when people hear if the noble Mohammedans cause and its treasures they are excited to join it promises a better life instead of working hard every day breaking your back to be a nobody in a short lived life they can be a hero in the muslim world taking whatever you want or need plenty of wives going and killing Americans for coming to your home and running the show it sounds better than being a merchant or farmer.

5. (Just because they (Al-Qaeda not Taliban) are dealing in extremes doesn't mean we have to also. It is not possible for the US and its allies (the few that are still in Afghanistan) to leave Afghanistan until every last terrorist is vanquished, we would never leave! If their goal is to kill all of us, let them try they wont be able to pull off another 9/11 or any major attack now that we can defend against them. The fact that they hide in mountains and caves in an endless mountain range though gives the US an impossible mission if our goal is to eliminate every last terrorist.)

That kind of thinking is what caught us by surprise in the first 9-11 thinking we were untouchable that it couldn't happen but you know what it did and thousands of our civilians died also we most certainly do have to stay and if it gets worse take Afghanistan as an American territory if we must we could make it a better place and use it for our own good both sides would profit and then that would trap the Taliban trapped in our nation they would become just another gang that we could seek out and crush with our police force and it would but down on their supply lines into the country plus it would make a good outpost for stopping other terrorist groups in the middle east also chasing them out of the mountains is not impossible its just a big job we Americans tend to do that a lot or at least us civilians when the going gets tuff we run and give up we claim it to be impossible and don't even try I personally have done things many people said was impossible but its not.

Yes we have done good so far but war is not punch them in the nose and wait for them to come at you again its beat them down so bad that they will never recover and they will collapse if they don't they will all die we seem to have forgotten that after ww2 we knew it then when we dropped the Atomic bombs but after we seemed to forget.

7. The war only coast a lot because we make it coast a lot war can be profitable we just need to be aloud to loot and pillage and take from the Taliban camps also maybe America wouldn't be in so much debt if we didn't waste money on doing things like rebuilding countries after destroying them and American people buying giant cars and tv's and houses that they can't afford and then paying the people that don't work but can if they want to

8. We should not schedule the end of a war its not a football game its a war you stay until the job is done we shouldn't end it yet

9. The cause is still clear end terrorism and make America better

10. A partial victory is better than no victory also history shows that once it shows victory many other times

11. This will not end as a stalemate if we fight correctly and civilians reporters and politicians keep their heads out of places they don't belong also why let them come here and hit our nation when are already destroying their country also terrorism will fall it just takes time we have had many great victories in the war like the battle of Tora Bora where Osama was almost killed

12. Please point out to me were our generals or soldiers have mishandled a situation in the war if it is because of a Politician or reporter or civilians that just furthers my point on keeping them out.

Best of luck in the next round
http://icasualties.org...
http://en.wikipedia.org...
imabench

Con

I will try my best to dissect the Pro's massive one sentence arguments and offer counter points to each.

1) Eliminating every last terrorist
"Al-Qaeda is being hunted by US troops right now but we don't to go chasing after them all over the world with tanks and helicopters and armies why bother that's not the kinda of war Al-Qaeda is fighting"

So since Al-Qaeda is not fighting an open war against us your saying its foolish to try to hunt down all of them right?

"that's not enough these two groups are on Jihad they have to be destroyed every member must die."

First off, thats pretty contradictory since your denouncing the tactic of trying to kill all the terrorists and then you endorse the same strategy in the same sentence. Second off America cannot kill every terrorist in Al-Qaeda or in the Taliban, Arab extremism has stretched from Saudi Arabia to Somalia to Sudan to Indonesia to Pakistan to Chechnya and so on so on. Point is its impossible to kill every last member of these terrorist groups and its pointless to try since there will always be more of them hiding somewhere. America's goal in Afghanistan was to remove and dismantle the Taliban government in Afghanistan and severely limit the potential Al-Qaeda has to wage terrorist warfare. We've done both of those now and we should pack up and leave rather than turn this war into a crusade to kill every last terrorist which will never end.

2) Military and civilian deaths as a result of the war.
" we shouldn't be trying to defend these people are not our civilians and are coasting US lives"
So we should not take into account the number of civilians killed in this war because they are not OUR civilians.... People are still people Pro, as long as the US occupies Afghanistan civilian deaths will continue to occur as a result of US troops engaging openly with insurgents, terrorists, etc.

" it is not our job to protect these people we do it out of the goodness of our heart it is their governments job to defend them not ours"
We cant let their government handle it if ours is still there pouring billions of dollars into this war to do things the way WE, not they, think it should be done. If people want the Afghanistan government to handle this we should withdraw and let them handle it rather than do everything for them.

" as for burning qur'an's those men have been being attacked because that book told their enemies to do so you can't blame them for wanting its destruction."
You have no idea how Islam works do you...... People werent protesting and attacking us because their Holy book told them too they did it because WE BURNED THEIR HOLY BOOK.

3) Awareness of Al-Qaeda and defending from them at home rather than fighting them in Afghanistan
"they did it once and because of American ignorance on the topic they can do it again"
Have you even been in an airport since 9/11? security measures are extreme and they do a very thorough job of making sure planes dont get hijacked or blown up. The US meanwhile has created an entire AGENCY to fighting terrorism (Department of Homeland Security), the FBI now coordinates with other intelligence groups to track people suspected of terrorism, we have numerous government agencies created just to examine data about terrorists to see if they are terrorists, and the US has avoided numerous terrorist schemes since 9/11. We are no longer ignorant of how they operate and we know very well how they operate, more than enough to prevent another attack like 9/11

" there are different ways of attacking then hijacking our planes and crashing them into buildings"
And we defend against them to if you havent noticed

4) Recruitment for Al-Qaeda
"not true the recruiting for Al-Qaeda has been no weaker than before"

sources showing that Al-Qaeda is struggling to find new recruits and new fighters or is now too weak to pose any large threat
http://topics.nytimes.com...
http://www.washingtonpost.com...
http://www.thedailybeast.com...
http://www.washingtonpost.com...
http://www.npr.org...
http://www.infowars.com...

Al-Qaeda is very much struggling to find new fighters.

5) Extreme aggression towards terrorists by the US
" if it gets worse take Afghanistan as an American territory"
1) Thats illegal since Afghanistan has its own government already
2) This war has already cost us a ton of money and making the place a US STATE would only cause the cost to be permanent
3) That would be the ultimate sign of US imperialism which would piss off a lot of people, including the Afghanis who dont want us there anymore

" that would trap the Taliban trapped in our nation they would become just another gang that we could seek out and crush with our police force"
It would trap us because out new US state lies next to Pakistan on one side, Iran on the other, and more Arab countries to the north so the terrorists would certainly not be rapped, WE would!

"chasing them out of the mountains is not impossible its just a big job"
A big job that we've had 10 years to do and we still havent gotten it done, so impossible is a very good description of what you want to do.

" I personally have done things many people said was impossible but its not."
Was it comparable to eliminating every last terrorist in the mountains of Afghanistan? I doubt it.

" its beat them down so bad that they will never recover"
We HAVE beaten them down bad and with all the Arab Spring revolutions causing democracies to spread everywhere it looks like these terrorists wont be able to climb back to the power and numbers they were once at.

7) The cost of the war
"The war only coast a lot because we make it coast a lot war can be profitable we just need to be aloud to loot and pillage and take from the Taliban camps"
I doubt that the Taliban has $500 Billion worth of loot just lying around in their caves.......

"maybe America wouldn't be in so much debt if we didn't waste money on doing things like rebuilding countries after destroying them"
Since thats exactly what we're doing in Afghanistan that sounds like just another reason why we should leave, because the US has resorted to nation building a nation still fighting itself costing us time, soldiers, and a ton of money.

8) Already leaving
"We should not schedule the end of a war its not a football game its a war you stay until the job is done"
Having an end date gives us motivation to get the job done in the first place. Other than that though this doesnt dismiss the fact that we ALREADY have a withdrawal date and if America were to stay in Afghanistan that would have to be changed, a change that nobody would like.

9) We cannot simply end terrorism Pro and even if we try there is a certain point where enough terrorists are killed so that America can confidently protect itself from them. We have reached that point now and there is no need o continue fighting a war against a group of people who cannot effectively jeopardize US security for a long time.

10), 11) Stalemates
I dont even know what the Pro is arguing at this point but Im guessing hes saying that since Afghanistan isnt a complete loss YET that means we can stay as long as we want and make it a US state if we wanted too. Also reporters dont cause us to lose wars Pro...

12) Bad handling
Cases of bad handling the war in Afghanistan,

Recklessly spending money
Not training the afghan military and police well
Not being able to give it a working economy like we hoped
Friendly fire
Unaccountability of funds and weapons we gave to Afghanistan
Killing civilians
Pakistan
Debate Round No. 3
american5

Pro

1. Wrong I'm saying don't go at them with armies go at them with special forces and also its not impossible take the region under American control cut their resources use the nation for building of America and itself then squash them when they are stuck in what is now your territory also the job isn't done the Taliban can rebuild and re attack same with Al-Qaeda we can't pack up and if we do go on crusade it will end and even if it doesn't its better to have them on the run than to have them attacking our cities.

2. Who cares if people are people we see ourselves as so important but we're not there have been trillions of us to live before and there are billions of us living now what actually makes us so important its not our job to protect them now if they would lets say surrender their nation to the US then I would care for them but until then not our problem.

3. The Mohammedans fight because they believe that's what the qur'an tells them to do they attacked us before we burnt the qu'rans years before

4. We may have learned somethings from 9-11 but we are not untouchable they could make another attack and it doesn't need to be using planes also just because we stopped a handful doesn't mean the Taliban couldn't do damage if they wanted to I also noticed most of your sources are highly American useful for propaganda.

5. 1. Their is nothing illegal in nations there may be things frowned upon but oh well tuff what's the UN going to do come in and arrest America 2. Making it a state we could harvest resources causing it to be profitable 3. The Afghanis will get over it when they aren't starving and living in mud huts anymore and who cares America is imperial in less than 300 years we have been able to build a better nation than most of these dinosaur civilizations like the middle eastern ones

(It would trap us because out new US state lies next to Pakistan on one side, Iran on the other, and more Arab countries to the north so the terrorists would certainly not be rapped, WE would!)
With Israeli forces ready beside us and what are the terrorists going to do send their tanks in on all flanks in a pincer movement or a bottle cap flank no their going to raid our borders get their butts kicked and run away to protect their farms and mud huts so our tanks and professional soldiers don't come marching in and taking over their country unopposed also no I haven't done anything like that but the soldiers doing that aren't alone there is more than one of them there are thousands that seems doable.

7. Maybe not but every bit helps plus the African warlords would pay a pretty penny for the equipment we could get from raiding Taliban camps also your second point just helps prove mine we should take it over and make money off it.

8. Like I said get rid of the withdrawal date tell the Generals want to go home get the job done.

9. If they can ever jeopardize American security again we must continue attacking also we have to kill them all.

10.,11. We can stay if we play our cards right and reporters do cause the loss of wars remember Vietnam reporters rallied the people behind the NVA if anything.

12. I have seen no evidence for this also when have we recklessly spent money
We can't train people that attack us the moment we give them a weapon
Its not our job to give them a working economy
Friendly fire is going to happen in any armed conflict
we shouldn't give them funds or weapons
Who cares about the civilians they are not our problem and we shouldn't protect them
Pakistan will learn the easy way or the hard way not to mess with us.
imabench

Con

1) Eliminating every last terrorist
" don't go at them with armies go at them with special forces"
We DO go after them with special forces when we are the ones on the offensive, and we only go on the offensive against high value targets. It is the army who defends the country when we're playing defense which is why we need BOTH when fighting them

"take the region under American control cut their resources use the nation for building of America"
That would take DECADES to do and the terrorists dont just get their resources from outside Afghanistan, they get it within Afghanistan too. By the way America isnt exactly the best at keeping borders secure (Mexico) so if we cant even keep our own backyard secure how the hell are we supposed to do the same thing in the Middle of terrorist country???

"its better to have them on the run than to have them attacking our cities."
first off, theyre not running their hiding, second there is only so much they can do if they only have a fraction of the forces they had before, and thirdly you keep forgetting that we do know how to defend our cities now.

2) Civilians
"Who cares if people are people"
The US government and the world cares Pro, and just saying that we shouldnt doesnt mean we will just stop caring about them, and it certainly doesnt make you right either.

" its not our job to protect them now if they would lets say surrender their nation to the US then I would care for them but until then not our problem"
Yes it is our problem, if we want their support and approval to help us fight the people who attacked us in the first place then we need to return the favor and protect these people from the very same terrorists who made their lives hell 20 years before we even gave a crap. We also need their support if we want to even operate out of Afghanistan too so protecting civilians IS a priority and even if you dont like it, too bad the US army is doing it right now and if you dont think they should, give a reason why dont just say "well they shouldnt"

3) Qur'an
"The Mohammedans fight because they believe that's what the qur'an tells them to"
Not all Afghanis are mohammedans though, a very large majority of them are regular sunni's or shi'ites who do not follow or support extremist Islam in the first place. They still were upset though because we burnt and because tension between the civilians and our presence in their country is only growing more strained and abusive
http://www.cfr.org...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk...
http://reason.com...

4) Defending at home
"We may have learned somethings from 9-11 but we are not untouchable"
We certainly are a lot harder to touch though, how many planes have been hijacked since 9/11? answer = 0 ;D

" most of your sources are highly American useful for propaganda"
At least I GIVE SOURCES for my information, also I didnt know that the New York Times or the Washington post were "propoganda"

Im aware of your hatred for reporters though so I can see how you think all reporters are spreading propoganda....

5) Annexing Afghanistan???
They have a recognized independent government so if we make it a state without their permission thats an ACT OF WAR.

"what's the UN going to do come in and arrest America"
Just goes to show how the Pro thinks America is right about everything and nobody can say anything wrong about them....

POP QUIZ, what was the last power to do whatever the heck they wanted to do without any care to what an organization or league of nations said?

Answer: Nazi Germany....

"Making it a state we could harvest resources causing it to be profitable"
Afghanistan is mountains and sand there arent enough resources anywhere to offset the cost of a 500 BILLION dollar war, and even so those resources belong to Afghanistan, not the US military...

"The Afghanis will get over it when they aren't starving and living in mud huts"
They're not living in mud huts and starving, do you do any research at all? Afghanistan is just like any other country now they have cars, electricity, etc.
http://travel.nationalgeographic.com...

6) Surrounding us
"With Israeli forces ready beside us and what are the terrorists going to do send their tanks in"
You are killing my brain cells over here. Afghanistan is surrounded by countries that breeds terrorists who could easily slip into Afghanistan and cause Carnage, Israel has nothing to do with and they certainly wont be able to stop them.

7) Cost of the War
So you want the US to take anything that they do confiscate and sell it to African warlords to use against their own people in their own genocides to fund a 500 billion dollar war.... There arent enough camps or weapons caches hidden in the mountains to ever come close to selling it to impoverished African countries to make $500 billion

8) Already withdrawing
The Generals already got the job done! Taliban have been removed from power, Osama is dead, and Al-Qaeda has been severely reduced in power, that was the goal in 2001 and the job was done, it was later we decided to make Afghanistan economically stable, but thats not a job for American generals its a job for Afghani economists. The job is done so now they have a right to come home sicne the mission was completed

9) Future threat
"If they can ever jeopardize American security again we must continue attacking also we have to kill them all."
Thats a ridiculous claim since the Pro wants to kill anyone who is a threat to America, but terrorists arent the only threat. Russia, China, North Korea, Iran, Cuba, ALL COUNTRIES JEOPARDIZE AMERICAN SECURITY. We cant kill off the world because they are a threat. Solar flares are a threat to American security should we blow up the sun? how about meteors, one large enough could kill us all should we send all of our nukes into space to blow them all up?

We live in a world where there are countless threats to American security, including America itself. There is no possible way America can defend itself by killing everyone and everything that is a threat, and staying in Afghanistan to eliminate every last terrorist is not a possible task either since they come from all over the world, even from within America.

10) + 11) Reporters
Reporters didnt cost us the war in Vietnam, we lost Vietnam because the people we were fighting we fighting guerilla warfare and thrived in inhospitable terrain while the ones we were fighting for let us do all the work for them and they were an inefficient democratic regime. After years and years we realized that Vietnam would end at a stalemate at the very best so we eventually began turning the war back over to the vietnamese and then we left after spending billions and billions of dollars on the insanely long war.

For the record, how much in common does Afghanistan have in common with Vietnam after reading all that

I invite the Pro to nonetheless explain how reporters cost us the Vietnam War and how they could do the same with Afghanistan...

12) Why we should leave
US is recklessly giving them money they cannot account for anymore
http://www.huffingtonpost.com...
Police (who doesnt attack us) are poorly trained
http://www.thewashingtonnote.com...
US trying to improve Afghanistan economically
http://www.washingtonpost.com...

All the other solutions the Pro tries to give are his own opinions of what we shouldnt be doing, they are not actual excuses for dismissing these issues because they ARE happening and are very valid reasons why the US should not continue the war in Afghanistan until all terrorists are dead.
Debate Round No. 4
american5

Pro

american5 forfeited this round.
imabench

Con

That was an ill-timed forfeit, Ok got some work to do

List of forfeited arguments
- 1 - Pro forfeits that the US is spending recklessly on the war in Afghanistan to the point where billions cannot be accounted for
- 2 - Pro forfeits that Afghanistan is currently a stalemate
- 3 - Pro forfeits that our continued presence in Afghanistan could turn it into a loss
- 4 - Pro forfeits that America cannot kill every last terrorist
- 5 - Pro forfeits that America is already withdrawing from the conflict in Afghanistan and continuing the war would mean making troops stay
- 6 - Pro forfeits that Generals already accomplished the job they were originally given back in 2001
- 7 - Pro forfeits that this war cannot be funded by raiding Al-Qaeda camps to fund the war
- 8 - Pro forfeits that this war cannot be funded by selling guns to African warlords
- 9 - Pro forfeits that making Afghanistan a US State would make that state surrounded by breeders of terrorists on all sides
- 10 - Pro forfeits that the US would not be able to defend a border three times larger than the US-Mexico border and defend it well enough to stop terrorists from entering the country
- 11 - Pro forfeits that Afghanistan is becoming a somewhat modern country
- 12 - Pro forfeits that Afghanistan has few resources so making it a state to use its resources to fund the war would be impossible
- 13 - Pro forfeits that this war has already cost the US $500 BILLION and would continue to be costly if we continued fighting the war
- 14 - Pro forfeits that making Afghanistan a state to continue the fight would really piss off the world
- 15 - Pro forfeits that making Afghanistan a state to continue the fight is illegal since Afghanistan is an independent country
- 16 - Pro forfeits that America can defend itself better from terrorists at home
- 17 - Pro forfeits that the US is inadvertently straining its relationship between Pakistan and Afghan civilians
- 18 - Pro forfeits that Civilian casualties are ungodly high and continuing the war would raise that number
- 19 - Pro forfeits that the US is doing a poor job of managing this war and continuing it would extend the poor handling of it which would cost us money, troops, etc
- 20 - Pro forfeits that friendly fire will continue to occur if the war is extended
- 21 - Pro forfeits that the US is trying to build nations and that it is costing the US a ton of money, like in Afghanistan
- 22 - Pro forfeits that Al-Qaeda has been beaten very badly and now pose a far smaller threat to American security than before
- 23 - Pro forfeits that Al-Qaeda has more trouble recruiting people to fight
- 24 - Pro forfeits that terrorism cannot be defeated or eliminated

Let me summarize this as best I can. Continuing the War in Afghanistan is not necessary because we already accomplished what we set out to do, and there isnt much else the US can accomplish in Afghanistan that they didnt already accomplish in the last 10 years. America is not out to kill every last terrorist, and thats a good thing to because if we were we would never finish. That is why the War in Afghanistan should not be continued.

I thank the Pro for the debate and I thank all the voters for reading :)
Debate Round No. 5
4 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 4 records.
Posted by Doulos1202 2 years ago
Doulos1202
Being out here right now Con has hit some really good points. Pro, America is not in Afghanistan to take out every single Taliban member or al queda its just not gonna happen, its impossible. There will always be terrorism. The mission now and had been for several years is to rebuild Afghanistan so that they do not need to rely on the Taliban. We offer the local nationals much more than the Taliban ever could. Con is absolutely right in saying that there is not much to do in the next 2 years that hasn't been taken care of in the last 10.

70% of afghans don't want Taliban in power.
There is a 36% reduction in kinetic activity between 2010-2011.
There have been 133 new schools open to the public.
93,000 are now in education.
21,000 girls now attending school.
38 women in government posts (unheard of before the war).
Health care cover 78% of the populace.
1,000 KM of new roads built.
41,400 farmers provided with seed, vegetables, and fertilizer.

there is only so much "hand holding" we can do, They have been given the foundation and they alone need to build off of it.
Posted by american5 2 years ago
american5
Yeah sorry I was rushing through most of it same with the last one.
Posted by imabench 2 years ago
imabench
Dude you need to know how to use punctuation.... the entire first paragraph is one gigantic sentence
Posted by american5 2 years ago
american5
Cool picture in first round Con
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by Doulos1202 2 years ago
Doulos1202
american5imabenchTied
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Total points awarded:05 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro has a severe misunderstanding of the military's mission in afghanistan. Con provided strong reason as to why we should not be in.
Vote Placed by Xerge 2 years ago
Xerge
american5imabenchTied
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Total points awarded:06 
Reasons for voting decision: Pro forfeited last round, leaving Con's case unaddressed. Con also presented a more compelling case in why the US should not continue to fight in Afghanistan.