The Instigator
Willoweed
Pro (for)
Winning
10 Points
The Contender
Liquidus
Con (against)
Losing
0 Points

Corporal punishment

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
Willoweed
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/15/2011 Category: Education
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 23,662 times Debate No: 19312
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (3)
Votes (2)

 

Willoweed

Pro

School and home corporal punishment(example spanking) on children should be banned.
I will let my opponent present his/her arguments first or to simply accept and then me present my arguments.
Liquidus

Con

I accept!

My argument? It works!
Debate Round No. 1
Willoweed

Pro

My rebuttal and argument is that corporal punishment on children (Example: spanking) does not work.
Spanking children distracts the child from the real goal; when you spank the children will than focus on the punishment and will not focus on the reason their bad behavior was bad; this means they will continue with that behavior because they don't consider it bad behavior.
Corporal punishment also makes children view aggressive and violent behavior as acceptable increasing their chances of being violent.

A scientific study has found that children who grow up in schools that use corporal punishment performed worse on tasks then those growing up In schools that did not use corporal punishment. Corporal punishment results in children not internalizing rules and standards meaning that the only reason they don't do bad things is fear of corporal punishment; children who do not get spanked are more likely to believe in rules and laws meaning they don't do bad things because they view bad things as bad.
http://scienceblog.com...

Another study found that spanking kids leads to more long-term behavior problems. Meaning spanking does not work but in fact increases bad behavior.
http://www.cnn.com...

Another study found the same results as the first two.
http://www.time.com...
Liquidus

Con

Pro, thank you for your organized arguments.

Counter

A spanking does work.

You stated that spanking children distracts them from the "real goal". You stated that the child would focus on the punishment and not on the reason they were punished. Then you took a leap and made the claim that they will not consider it bad behavior because they focused on the punishment. I think the first thing that must be clarified is the age of the children we are discussing. I will tell you this; when children under go corporal punishment, they MUST focus on the reason they are being punished because the child will always wonder what they could have done differently to avoid being punished. Also, take classical conditioning into count. Because the child recognizes a negative sanction to be in order every time a specific action will be performed, the child learns to avoid performing said action.

You also stated that corporal punishment causes children to become desensitized to violence. I disagree, and here's why: If a child never experiences violence, he can never fully understand it and therefore becomes desensitized to it himself. If a child experiences violence, he recognizes it as negative and views it negatively. Ergo, the level of violence exposed to a child through spanking help to build awareness and character.

Take a look at the difference in our generations. The older generation that was raised with corporal punishment show more respect for the individual and society as opposed to the child today who is disrespectful because he knows he can get away with it.

That's the key here, getting away with it. If a child learns quick that a negative punishment will follow the breaking of a rule, the child will learn quickly to change his actions.

I think we all can agree that nothing works better than a good old fashioned spanking.
Debate Round No. 2
Willoweed

Pro

1)The problem is that corporal punishment only provides a negative sanction on the specific circumstance. For example if a child punches another kid then corporal punishment only provides a negative sanction for punching another kid instead of kicking another kid. The corporal punishment directs focus on the major goal which is that hurting people is a bad thing; and in fact since corporal punishment is a form of hurt corporal punishment actually helps defeat the goal to make children understand that hurting people is a bad thing.

2)You said that "You stated that the child would focus on the punishment and not on the reason they were punished. Then you took a leap and made the claim that they will not consider it bad behavior because they focused on the punishment.".
I didn't actually take a leap considering the fact that I posted several studies that support my claim and its conclusion.

3)Again I did not just state that corporal punishment causes children to become desensitized to violence; I posted proof that corporal punishment causes children to become more violent and more likely to commit a violent crime.

4)You make the claim, "The older generation that was raised with corporal punishment show more respect for the individual and society as opposed to the child today". I'd like to point out that you saying something is don't make it true. All you've done is put out a claim with nothing to support it. And now ill post some evidence that your claim is incorrect.
The fact that crime rates have been steadily dropping ever since corporal punishment has been decreasing contradicts your claim.
http://www.census.gov...
Also states/countries with corporal punishment have higher crime rates than those who prohibit corporal punishment.
http://www.census.gov...
http://www.nationmaster.com...
http://en.wikipedia.org...

5)I also would like to reiterate that I posted proof that corporal punishment does not work; I posted proof that it increases violent and bad behavior, and is detrimental to the mental development of children.
Liquidus

Con

I thank you for your speedy response.

However,

Your sources fail to link the topics to the subject matter. Your studies are non-extensive, and the details are not fully provided. They also lack substantial evidence. One study showed that all people were connected by 6 degrees of separations but we know that its not true.

You have also failed to refute my arguments. You simply tried to discredit them. I again make the following statement: Corporal punishment works.


I await your attempt to refute my original arguments while providing factual evidence.
Debate Round No. 3
Willoweed

Pro

You claim, "Your studies are non-extensive, and the details are not fully provided"
How is this not fully provided and full of details?

The study, led by community-health-sciences professor Catherine Taylor, was the first to control for a host of issues affecting the mother, such as depression, alcohol and drug use, spousal abuse and even whether she considered abortion while pregnant with the child. After controlling for all these factors — each of which can contribute to a child's aggression — spanking remained a strong predictor of violent behavior. "The odds of a child being more aggressive at age 5 increased by 50% if he had been spanked more than twice in the month before the study began," says Taylor.
…………………………………….
Read more: http://www.time.com...
Based on interviews with the mothers of about 3,000 children, researcher Murray Straus of the University of New Hampshire found that corporal punishment is counterproductive, resulting in more antisocial behavior by children in later years.
…..
Researchers analyzed survey data from 807 mothers of children ages 6 to 9, taken in 1988 and 1990. They compared levels of antisocial behavior among spanked and unspanked children over that interval.
The more spanking a child received at the beginning of the study, the higher level of antisocial behavior at the end, according to the researchers.
…….
Antisocial behavior was defined as cheating, lying, disobedience at school, breaking things deliberately, not feeling sorry after misbehaving or not getting along with teachers.
…………..

Did you even read the sources I posted?

Also how is posting evidence that corporal punishment doesn't work a failure to refute your arguments? I don't need to post an ideological rebuttal to your arguments (even though I did post one) because I posted factual evidence that shows that your arguments are invalid and incorrect

You claim, .I again make the following statement: Corporal punishment works. but the fact is that ALL the evidence (dozens of studies) show that corporal punishment does not work and in fact actually increases violent, and bad behavior and harms a child's mental development.

You may think that you saying corporal punishment works makes it true but the fact is that your argument has no evidence backing it up, and has already been disproven.
Liquidus

Con

You stated " spanking remained a strong predictor of violent behavior. " A strong predictor and a fact are 2 very different things.

Next, if you want some factual information, I will provide some:

http://www.nospank.net...

http://www.foxnews.com...

http://rightwardleaning.blogspot.com...

http://www.writework.com...

http://www.helium.com...

http://www.circleofmoms.com...

http://www.natchezdemocrat.com...

These sources are from many different views. They actually relate the topic of corporal punishment to this debate almost directly.

You asked for valid sources, I provided.

Now then, as I know we can agree to disagree, corporal punishment is very effective. To do anything else would be to give the child rights to do as he pleases.

In conclusion, I have provided an argument, and I have provided sources. My opponent has failed to use reliable sources and relate those sources to the subject matter. My opponent has also failed to refute my arguments.

I thank my opponent for the opportunity to debate this topic.
Debate Round No. 4
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by MaliCarro 4 months ago
MaliCarro
I can't see how corporal punishment can make a child understand anything. It can only make them fear - I don't think that'll be helpful.
Posted by Liquidus 5 years ago
Liquidus
I think someone needs to beat you........nut........
Posted by Chamaeleon 5 years ago
Chamaeleon
Children should be beaten mercilessly, and then forced to beat each other lest they beaten more. There aren't enough good beatings going around. Why just the other day I saw several kids who were spotless, not a single black n blue mark on them. Disgusting! Corporal punishment should be the first class they teach in school; a pre-requisite for all other classes. Beat those kids y'all!
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by maninorange 5 years ago
maninorange
WilloweedLiquidusTied
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Total points awarded:50 
Reasons for voting decision: It was obvious that Willoweed was providing good, reputable sources. I don't understand Liquidus' refusal to accept their relevance and validity. Furthermore, all of Liquidus' sources either reference a single study, which has flaws that even I, as a person with no psychology background, can identify, or are merely the writings of people who are already aligned on the issue, and don't provide any support for their position. This was an evidence battle, and Liquidus' evidence was far weaker.
Vote Placed by Ore_Ele 5 years ago
Ore_Ele
WilloweedLiquidusTied
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Reasons for voting decision: Con really dropped the ball on this. First issue, he had no sources at all, so all of his arguments had to be taken with a grain of salt. Also, he allowed Pro to strawman and false dichotomy the topic. Just because CP is allowed does not mean that parents or teachers cannot teach children why something is wrong.