The Instigator
JaredCM
Pro (for)
Losing
6 Points
The Contender
Gileandos
Con (against)
Winning
24 Points

Death

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 5 votes the winner is...
Gileandos
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/24/2012 Category: Religion
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,049 times Debate No: 20629
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (1)
Votes (5)

 

JaredCM

Pro

Why do so many Christians think that when people die they go to heaven? Because they don't, it even say's in Revelation that in the end times, the dead people and the people in the graves would be raised up to Heaven. How would that happen if all the people that were faithful followers and died were already up in Heaven? It wouldn't work. And it even say's in the Bible that all the dead will until the Lords coming.
Gileandos

Con

I thank my opponent for this debate.

Though I believe the resolution does not match the content of the first round post, I will be certain to address both depending on what my opponent desires to debate.

To the negation of the resolution:
I am extremely against death, specifically ‘good’ peoples death.

Some clear reasons:
1) It is not ‘fun’. See Video as Evidence:

2) It is cost prohibitive. [1]

3) Even if you believe going to heaven is the result of the first death, I am legitimately against the ‘second death’ referred to in the Bible[2]

This is just to name a few and want to clearly point out that I have no problem with evil peoples deaths. That is not within the scope of ‘death’ as posed by the resolution.

The resolution is clearly negated.


Now I do want as a side note to address the first round concerns of my opponent.

- First, my opponent does not believe that people go to heaven upon death. This would be incorrect.

We know that Enoch and Elijah both went directly to Heaven. We also know that Moses and Elijah both in their white robes came back down from Heaven to minister to Jesus on the mount of transfiguration. It is properly understood that Holy or faithful believers go to heaven upon death.

The dead that are brought up to the judgment seat are those in the intermediate state that did not live Holy/faithful lives.

- Second, my opponent asserts that the faithful being in heaven would not work.

How does he know this? Is there a space limit in heaven? Is God not capable of creating a place to house the faithful?He would have to expand this.

I do not mind discussing my opponent’s assertions or the resolution if my opponent would not mind clarifying for either in the next round.

I am hoping for a clear assertion to rephrase the resolution or affirm the resolution.

Debate Round No. 1
JaredCM

Pro

http://www.jesus-is-savior.com...

We will not go to heaven until the Lords coming, why would we go to heaven after death. Because it even says in the Bible that we will not go to heaven until the end times.
Gileandos

Con

I do thank my opponent for another round.

I was hoping some time would be spent on further clarfication but alas, that did not happen.

We see that the resolution stands clearly negated.
1) Indeed Death is not fun
2) Death is cost prohibitive.
3) The second death sucks worse than the first death.

My opponent in the last round cites a weird website with an exclusivity doctrine. They teach they are the only source of truth and that all other Christians are 'false religions'.
They include Lutherans, Episcopalians and even Catholics.

My opponent claims that the select few spoken of at that Lord's Coming should be interpreted as the ALL people.
My opponent offers no such reason to interpret scripture this way.


I have already cited the scriptures of the assumption of Enoch and Elijah straight up to heaven. I have cited the scriptures at the mount of Transfiguration where Moses and Elijah both come down out of heaven, dresssed in their 'overcomers' white robes and minister to Jesus.

These have gone unrefuted.

Clearly a superior interpretation is to recognize there are two groups being discussed. We also saw the saved souls in heaven in Revelation Chapter 4. I could go on but my opponent must address these issues.

So the resolution is clearly negated.
Additionally we see that my opponents concerns of ALL is only a select few.
Debate Round No. 2
JaredCM

Pro

JaredCM forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
JaredCM

Pro

JaredCM forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 4
JaredCM

Pro

JaredCM forfeited this round.
Gileandos

Con

Sadly my opponnent has chosen to leave the world of DDO to wait for his spot in DDO Heaven.
Debate Round No. 5
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
Posted by Tnkissfan 4 years ago
Tnkissfan
Uh huh....... This is what I'd call a skunk!
5 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 5 records.
Vote Placed by KeytarHero 5 years ago
KeytarHero
JaredCMGileandosTied
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Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: This is no contest. Pro forfeited, and even in the rounds that were played out Con's arguments were just superior.
Vote Placed by imabench 5 years ago
imabench
JaredCMGileandosTied
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Total points awarded:06 
Reasons for voting decision: Guitar_Guru has the right idea just the wrong side...
Vote Placed by Hardcore.Pwnography 5 years ago
Hardcore.Pwnography
JaredCMGileandosTied
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Total points awarded:07 
Reasons for voting decision: Guitar Guru voted for wrong side LOL.
Vote Placed by Guitar_Guru 5 years ago
Guitar_Guru
JaredCMGileandosTied
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Total points awarded:60 
Reasons for voting decision: Multiple forfeitures results in losing conduct and arguments. Sources to Con because he had more and used them much more effectively.
Vote Placed by THEBOMB 5 years ago
THEBOMB
JaredCMGileandosTied
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Total points awarded:04 
Reasons for voting decision: obvious reasons are obvious