The Instigator
CJBPrewrather
Pro (for)
The Contender
J-A-Moore
Con (against)

Democratic (pro) versus state (con) socialism.

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/15/2018 Category: Politics
Updated: 6 months ago Status: Debating Period
Viewed: 177 times Debate No: 106720
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (3)
Votes (0)

 

CJBPrewrather

Pro

The reason I support democratic socialism over state socialism is this: I believe that the government should be democratically elected and not forced by the state, but I'm willing to learn. Debate me.
J-A-Moore

Con


Quantifiers:
1) "State socialism" does not necessitate a total lack of democratic function.
2) "Democratic Socialism" is a term that is often poorly defined; but typically uses decentralized democratic bodies to manage means of production.

Important to note:
1) Socialism is a primarily economic, rather political doctrine. Communism which is what I will hence forth call "State socialism", is a political doctrine informed by economic theories of socialism.



A brief argument against Democratic Socialism:

Have you ever seen a co-op survive for more than a generation? It's not a common thing. The means of production, meaning agriculture, an aquaculture for food. Equipment production for tools, houses, the building of the houses themselves. Under Democratic socialism, each farm, factory and so forth would be managed by individual unions, which are inherently democratic in their actions. This is, perhaps a pure form of socialism. It is the goal of Democratic socialists to turn the means of production over to unions in this way.

Reality however is not so kind.

imagine for a moment, you have a city of 1,000,000 people. This city needs food, water, electricity, clothes and other consumer goods. Diapers, medicine and other health goods. All of it has to be produced; by groups of people who form their own voluntary work unions, show up when the group decides and works on what and when the group decides. ... It doesn't take alot to see where this is going.



Brief Argument for Communism or "State socialism".

In contrast. the necessity of the state is in the requirements that goods and services remain consistent through out the territorial agent ( the state). In Employing the state, you are enabling the central command and control of resources, the standardization of schedules, supplies. The state is able to ensure that all factories working for the people are producing what is needed, when it is needed. That all factories have proper access, and that properly skilled persons are working the machines. The heads of the State maybe elected through democratic means, they are however inherently Technocratic and utilitarian in nature.


Summary of brief contrasts:

A State socialism is analogise to taking the best people you can find in each field and having them form a planned operation of government so as to provide goods and service for the betterment of all people. The unions which form with in the factories and the farms serve a communications role as well as important structural roles within the national government.

A democratic socialism is by contrast. to take a group of people of varying skills, put them in a room in order to form a plan, along side other people in other rooms, also of varying skills.. than you take the result of each group in each room and attempt to form coherent and functioning policy out of it.
Debate Round No. 1
CJBPrewrather

Pro

My question is that is it Constitutional to have state socialism?
J-A-Moore

Con

Short answer: No.
Long answer: Neither "Democratic socialism" nor State socialism is compatible with the U.S. Constitution.

Note: "Democratic socialism" is not the same as a Socialist democracy. It may sound like splitting hairs. but a Socialist democracy is a country like Norway, Sweden, France, Etc. Countries with a normal functioning state body but quasi-socialist programs run by the state.
Debate Round No. 2
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Debate Round No. 3
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Debate Round No. 4
3 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Posted by J-A-Moore 6 months ago
J-A-Moore
I doubt either of you know the first thing about the topic.
Posted by BryanMullinsNOCHRISTMAS2 6 months ago
BryanMullinsNOCHRISTMAS2
I know, right?
Posted by Pill_Junkie_Monkey 6 months ago
Pill_Junkie_Monkey
This is like a debate between AIDS and Syphilis. Topkek!
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