The Instigator
slave123
Pro (for)
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The Contender
Uniter
Con (against)
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Do Jinn exist?

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/4/2015 Category: Religion
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 828 times Debate No: 82039
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (14)
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slave123

Pro

In the Name of Allah Most Gracious Most Merciful

Jinn exist.

They are another creation of God.

They were created from smokeless fire.

There are three forms of intelligent life mentioned in the Quran and Hadith,

Angels made of light, Jinn made of fire, and humans made of clay.

Angels have no free will, Jinn have free will, and humans have free will.

Jinn eat and drink like us,

They marry and reproduce like us,

They have different religions like us,

There are Muslim Jinn and Kaffir Jinn,

The evil Jinn are the Satans.

They grow old and die just like us, but they have longer lifespans and can live for thousands of years.

Proof:

1. The Quran,

The Quran is a miracle, since it contains scientific miracles, mathematical miracles, historical miracles, and a linguistic miracle.

The Quran talks about the Big Bang 1400 years ago, how is this possible?

It also contains mathematical miracles such as the miracle of the number 19 in the Quran,

I will give a link that shows many of the Quran's miracles, inshallah ameen,

2. Scientific evidence:

A. Dark Matter




Most of the universe is invisible and is made of what scientists call dark matter,

We can't see it but we can see it's effects.

My theory is that dark matter makes up invisible worlds/planes which we can't see,

Based on my research, there are other planes of existence such as the etheric plane, the astral plane, the mental plane , and the spiritual plane, and many many other planes too,

The Quran says the Jinn are made of smokeless fire,

this could be a means of describing matter as it is on the etheric plane.

B. Undekha Wajood,

In this show they capture lots of evidence of Jinn,

They capture EMF readings at random places in isolated houses and buildings in Pakistan,

What is created these readings? It has to be Jinn ameen.

So all this proves Jinn exist

JazakAllah Khair ameen,

Become Muslim inshallah ameen and believe in Allah swat and His Last Prophet Muhammad saw inshallah ameen

or you will end up in hell forever inshallah ameen

Links:

http://www.miraclesofthequran.com...

https://www.youtube.com...

Uniter

Con

My first debate,so please be kind bruh. So your first piece of evidence is a book that isn't deemed factual by everyone in the world. The Quran may be the book of truth for a muslim, but it isn't for anyone else. Secondly, your dark matter theory is just a theory. If I was an atheist who believed in unicorns, I could say that unicorns are made of dark matter, or live in a realm of dark matter that is why we can't see or find them. Now I've seen a lot of those ghosts shows, and the authenticity of the shows can be questioned. With technology now a days, anyone can fake a demonic voice, or levitate, when In actuality they are being harnessed by strings. A lot of these shows are so that people are persuaded into believing in your faith, by trying to show tangible evidence, when in reality their is none. Now Jinn can't exist, just like unicorns and fairies. It just doesn't abide by the laws of science, and Jinn supposedly have come into our dimension. If this is true then they must be bound by laws of physics and biology. Which is not the case in multiple stories I've read up on the jinn. I've read there are multiple types of jinn, and they live in unpopulated areas, like dense forests, and the dark corners of the ocean. Some can fly, and others can do other mystical stuff that nothing on this earth can do. They can possess bodies, and talk the human dialect as well as their own. I find this to be a nice tale to tell kids to be honest. So based on that I say jinn don't exist.
Debate Round No. 1
slave123

Pro

Bismillah hirahma niraheem

"So your first piece of evidence is a book that isn't deemed factual by everyone in the world. The Quran may be the book of truth for a muslim, but it isn't for anyone else."

Con didn't even consider the miracles of The Quran I mentioned,

In 21:30 The Big Bang is clearly mentioned.

How did a man know the Big Bang theory 1400 years before it was discovered?

http://miraclesofthequran.com...

and there are many more miracles in the Quran which the above link demonstrates.

also it has a historical miracle as it makes the distinction between king and Pharaoh

In the Old Testament, the Egyptian ruler during the period of Prophet Ibrahim (as) and Prophet Yusuf (as) are named "Pharaoh." However, this title was actually employed after the eras in which these two Prophets lived.

While addressing the Egyptian ruler at the time of Prophet Yusuf (as), the word "Al-Malik" in Arabic is used in the Qur'an: It refers to a ruler, king or sultan:

The King said, 'Bring him to me straight away!'… (Qur'an, 12:50)

The ruler of Egypt in the time of the Prophet Musa (as) is referred to as "Pharaoh." This distinction in the Qur'an is not made in the Old and New Testaments nor by Jewish historians. In the Bible, the word "Pharaoh" is used, in every reference to an Egyptian monarch. On the other hand, the Qur'an is far more concise and accurate in the terminology it employs.

The use of the word "Pharaoh" in Egyptian history belongs only to the late period. This particular title began to be employed in the 14th century B.C., during the reign of Amenhotep IV. The Prophet Yusuf (as) lived at least 200 years before that time.216

The Encyclopaedia Britannica says that the word "Pharaoh" was a title of respect used from the New Kingdom (beginning with the 18th dynasty; B.C. 1539-1292) until the 22nd dynasty (B.C. 945-730), after which this term of address became the title of the king. Further information on this subject comes from the Academic American Encyclopaedia, which states that the title of Pharaoh began to be used in the New Kingdom.

for more miracles please check out the link.

"Secondly, your dark matter theory is just a theory."

No it isn't There is astronomical evidence for dark matter.

http://www.quantumdiaries.org...



" If I was an atheist who believed in unicorns, I could say that unicorns are made of dark matter, or live in a realm of dark matter that is why we can't see or find them. "

yes you could, I do not deny the existence of unicorns, I in fact believe that the Prophet saw went to heaven on a unicorn or flying horse.

and as for all other unknown creatures such as bigfoot, chupacabra, fairies, etc. They might be real too,

They could be Jinn in disguise,

My argument is all paranormal creatures come from the same place.

They are all interdimensional.

Jinn, angels, werewolves, vampires, etc

and even ufos are interdimensional,

There is the etheric plane, astral plane, and many other planes which we cannot see.

The invisible matter that makes up most of the universe, which scientists call dark matter, is the matter that makes up these other planes of existence, ameen

"Now I've seen a lot of those ghosts shows, and the authenticity of the shows can be questioned. With technology now a days, anyone can fake a demonic voice, or levitate, when In actuality they are being harnessed by strings. A lot of these shows are so that people are persuaded into believing in your faith, by trying to show tangible evidence, when in reality their is none."

But have you seen Undekha Wajood?

Tell me where are these strange EMF readings coming from?

give me a source and prove it.

Give me an alternative explanation?

and prove it.

I have even seen an american ghost show, called ghost hunters,

and they captured a video of a creature walking through one locked door, to another locked door,

this is impossible for a human,

so this further proves ghosts exist ameen,

here is some more evidence,

https://www.youtube.com...







and there are these weird night crawlers, which are also proof,

s://i.ytimg.com...; alt="" />


" Now Jinn can't exist, just like unicorns and fairies. "

They all do exist.

You can't disprove any of them.

so how can you say you don't believe in them, or they are not real, when you don't have any evidence for your posistion either?

The burden of proof is no longer on me, since I did provide evidence,

the burden of proof is equally on you to prove my evidence is false, ameen

"It just doesn't abide by the laws of science, and Jinn supposedly have come into our dimension. If this is true then they must be bound by laws of physics and biology. Which is not the case in multiple stories I've read up on the jinn. I've read there are multiple types of jinn, and they live in unpopulated areas, like dense forests, and the dark corners of the ocean. Some can fly, and others can do other mystical stuff that nothing on this earth can do. They can possess bodies, and talk the human dialect as well as their own. I find this to be a nice tale to tell kids to be honest. So based on that I say jinn don't exist."

The laws of science???

Who created the laws of science? And why do they hold true?

God created them, and God says there are Jinn in His book, the Quran,

so you are borrowing from my world view?

Also we do not fully understand the laws of nature, or the universe,

tell me what is gravity? Where are the gravitons? Why haven't we seen one yet?

And as I said,

these Jinn are made of a different form of matter or particles then we are.

We are made of atoms,

they are made of some other substance of particle,

All they have to do to enter our dimension, is matterialize.

They just have to transform their matter into our matter so they can enter our world.

Now they may have gotten these abilities from God who is the Creator of all things in our world including natural laws,

Or they may have discovered these abilities using science or whatever.

and about flying,

They just have to change their density or assume a form with wings,

it is not that difficult.

They are a different rare form of matter,

and when they assume physical form, they transfer their matter to terrestrial matter,

and they can manipulate it's density, and assume any form or weight, ameen

So these are the proof of Jinn,

And the ultimate proof is they are mentioned in the Quran

so first prove to me the Quran isn't the Word of God, which you can never do ameen,

because I have proven it is,

It mentions the Big Bang 1400 years before discovery,

this proves the Quran is true,

therefore Jinn exists,

and many people have seen jinn in their various forms and guises.

They have the power to shapeshift.

Are you telling me every bigfoot is a bear?

What if someone sees it close up and it looks nothing like a bear?

And what if it is too big to be a man in a costume?

There are reports like this,

Are they all lying or hallucinating?

There are many witnesses who are reliable, and aren't using drugs, and aren't mentally ill,

so how can they hallucinate without anything causing the hallucination,

and take ufos as further proof,

there are so many reliable witnesses,

pilots, astronauts, military men etc.

Are they lying to put their reputation on the line?

That makes no sense.

These anomalies,

and it is unfortunate atheists are spreading propaganda that only matter exists and only what they see exists,

atheism is an untenible worldview ans full of contradictions,

Only Islam is rational therefore Jinn exist ameen,

more proof,







Uniter

Con

Bruh bruh, showing me pictures of defected creatures and creepy ghosts isn't proof of jinn. It's proof of mutation. And that ghost pic doesn't mean jinn exist. It may mean ghosts exist, but it most certainly doesn't mean jinn do. Ghosts and jinn are two totally different things. And you can't just show me a couple of stuff about your book, and expect me to all of a sudden fall head over heels for it and say it is the truth. The reasons leprechauns don't exist, is because it's not possible to slide, let alone sit or even feel a rainbow. Unicorns aren't real because horses with horns can't fly. And jinn aren't real because Fire will always create smoke, so a smokeless fire being can't exist on earth. I'm not trying to be rude or anything, It's just not sensical to assume that stuff like that can exist on a planet where physics, and biology don't allow for such things to occur.
Debate Round No. 2
slave123

Pro

Bismillah

"Bruh bruh, showing me pictures of defected creatures and creepy ghosts isn't proof of jinn. It's proof of mutation. And that ghost pic doesn't mean jinn exist. It may mean ghosts exist, but it most certainly doesn't mean jinn do."

Do you know what Jinn even means?

It comes from a root word Janna, which means to hide or conceal.

Jinn are an invisible race of shapeshifters.

ghosts, leprechauns, fairies, unicorns, they are all the same thing.

I use Jinn as a collective term,

since you can't see Jinn in their true form.

Read John Keel.

He proved that ufos, lochness monster, bigfoot, Mothman, etc are all the same thing,

and are all what he calls ultraterrestrials.

The concept of ultraterrestrials matches that of Jinn,

They are both shapeshifters and can come in any guise.

"Ghosts and jinn are two totally different things."

No they aren't

they are the same thing. They are the same shapeshifters.

Ghosts are Jinn in disguise.

Ghosts can't be spiritis of the dead since why do they wear cloths.

do cloths have spiritis too?

Contradiction.

Also if everyone killed becomes a ghosts where are all the ghosts?

Ghosts are not spiritis of the dead, they are shapeshifters in disguise, these shapeshifters the Quran calls Jinn, ameen

". And you can't just show me a couple of stuff about your book, and expect me to all of a sudden fall head over heels for it and say it is the truth."

You did not even consider my argument that the Quran mentions the Big Bang 1400 years ago,

21:30

tell me how did an uneducated man living in the desert 1400 years ago know about the Big Bang?

You haven't adressed this point ameen,

"The reasons leprechauns don't exist, is because it's not possible to slide, let alone sit or even feel a rainbow."

That is a myth asscociated with them.

That doesn't mean the leprechauns themselved don't exist,

They are the same as the little green men of ufo lore,

perhaps the rainbow was really a ufo beam of light?

People still see leprechauns,

Read John Keel' The Complete Guide to Mysterious Creatures,

in that book he proves they are real and are the same thing,

They are ultraterrestrials in different guises.

"Unicorns aren't real because horses with horns can't fly"

Again they are shapeshifters,

We don't fully understand the science behind such beings, but that doesn't mean they don't exist,

They might as well be manipulating their atoms so they are less dense then air and are therefore able to levitate ameen,

"And jinn aren't real because Fire will always create smoke, so a smokeless fire being can't exist on earth. "

Have you read anything I wrote?

I said the smokeless fire need not be fire,

it could be a form of energy, plasma, ether, etc

My view is it is a different form of matter,

We are made of atoms,

They might be made of a different form of matter, that is different then our matter, which is why we don't see them,

but by manipulating their atomic structure to suite our dimension, they can come here in any form.

And the existence of dark matter proves my theory, since science shows there are other forms of matter we can't see.

And dark matter is proven to exist due to it's gravitational affect on galaxies ameen.

" I'm not trying to be rude or anything, It's just not sensical to assume that stuff like that can exist on a planet where physics, and biology don't allow for such things to occur."

We barely understand the laws of physics and biology,

Tell me how did the first life form appear on earth?

Give me a rational and provable explanation?

And create life from nonlife to prove your point, ameen

And tell me where did the laws of physics come from?

And why are they finetuned for life,

why are they the way they are?

Tell me what is gravity, and why haven't we found gravitons yet?

God created all these,

and He created Jinn,

so you are borowing from my worldview in all your arguments.




And this is one more peice of evidence^

They proved these aren't flares and are ufos, ameen,

and ufos are Jinn,

as John Keel proved,

so tell me what were the tinley park ufos,

your atheism is inconsistent,

my islam is consistent, ameen

be Muslim accept Islam ameen
Uniter

Con

Dude, my homie, my bruh bruh, you keep saying that these jinn are real, and you show me your book as evidence, and some people saying that Bigfoot, ufos, and other cryptic creatures are all the same. But you aren't proving they exist. You are claiming that they exist, just like you and multiple theists claim god exists. But like multiple theists, you have no tangible evidence, and in an age where science dominates all, with out evidence that can be seen, or observed in someway, then your claims remain claims. You don't prove jinn exist with pictures from the History Channel's Ancient Aliens show, because even with those pictures, the debate on whether aliens exist still continues. If you want to prove jinn exist, by saying that jinn are the orbs in the sky, and ghosts in pictures, and the cryptids in legends then you have to first go prove all that stuff exists. And since we have no proof Bigfoot or the Loch Ness monster exist, you have no proof that jinn exist. John Keel is crazy for using his time to prove that those creatures, that have yet to be proven to exist, are all the same. You can't take people's claims to seeing these creatures as proof they exist.
Debate Round No. 3
14 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by shalal12 1 year ago
shalal12
Salam
Jinns do exist.
It can be easily proven from Islamic books.
Why are you so interested in Jinns?
Posted by Uniter 1 year ago
Uniter
It's interesting to see a debate within a debate. Slave123 for someone who is so adamant on his own beliefs, you don't understand the prophet's tolerance on religion. He didn't go to people and straight up say 3 doesn't equal 1. If you want people to convert learn your history, don't be those muslims who just who blindly follows his mosques imam. Read your own books, read the commentary of the Quran. Learn why each verse was released, who they were released about. Learn about other faiths. The prophet knew everything about christianity, and judaism. Bobcampus, I respect your beliefs and all, but it makes no sense for god to be able to die. God is a being superior to us. I like Islam's way of saying that a Human Being is limited and god is unlimited. Islam accepts the fact that god cannot be understood, he unlike humans cannot be put into a physical manner. I would give the same advice to you, learn more about other religions, before coming to the consensus that your religion is the true one. In my opinion Shia Islam makes more sense than Sunni islam, but I can say that with conviction because I had the opportunity to learn about both.
Posted by BobCampus 1 year ago
BobCampus
I am not trying to be disrespectful, but please use better grammar.
Posted by BobCampus 1 year ago
BobCampus
I think you my be confused about who God is. God is an omniscient being. He knows everything, and every possibility. He can be either physical or spiritual. Like I said before, we may not yet be able to comprehend the trinity. Mainly because it is so alien to us.
Posted by slave123 1 year ago
slave123
Sorry but 3 doesn't equal 1 unless you divide 1 into 3 parts but your aqeeda says God is indivisible ameen
Posted by BobCampus 1 year ago
BobCampus
As for the Bible vs Quran, the bible provides significant amounts of data the Quran does not. Sure, there are contradictions in the bible. But you have to remember that the bible was inspired by God, but written by men. That means that what it teaches is true, but not everything is going to be spot on, because of human error. The bible has many examples of science, such as the earth being round, the earth freely "hanging" in space, water currents, deep ocean trenches, a near infinite number of stars, that the stars in Orion's Belt are moving farther apart (""Can you loosen Orion's Belt?" (It's in Job, look it up)), that blood is the life source of the body, that you should wash wounds in running water, that meat that you carry around for too long can make you sick, and that everything is made up of particles (Hebrews 11:3 "By faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that the things which are seen were not made of things which are visible."). These are just some thoughts to ponder.
Posted by BobCampus 1 year ago
BobCampus
A am a Christian. I see more emotional and physical evidence for Christianity than any other religion. Yes I was raised in Christian church, but don't make any assumptions. I was, for a year, sort of an agnostic. I didn't know what I believed in. I spend hours of studying and researching and have found more evidence for the Case for Christ, so to speak, than any other religion. I will try to explain the trinity as best as I can. Copper pyrite is made of three different elements, Copper, Iron, and Sulfur. It is made up of three different things, but they have bonded to make one single material. Though it is made of three elements, it is still one compound. If a physical example doesn't make sense, I could go for emotional. A person can have many different emotions, and moods. But they will always be the same person. I try not to second guess God, but it also might just be that our human brains cannot comprehend Him. God is to us like a parent is to a child. As a child, we think like a child, behave like a child, and act in childish ways. When we see adults reward or punish, we may be confused. Why would they make a decision like that? That answer might be, that we cannot yet comprehend God, his ways, or the trinity.
Posted by slave123 1 year ago
slave123
Are you Christian? Do you believe in trinity? Tell me how does 3=1?
Posted by BobCampus 1 year ago
BobCampus
Jinn do not exist. Not that I know of anyway. I don't see any mention of them in the bible, there is no scientific evidence, and there has not been any physical evidence of "Jinn". Before I go any further, I would like to say that I recognize you as a person. I would hope that you treat me in that same respect. I believe Christianity to have the most evidence. You may not believe that, but I do. The Bible and the Quoran both come from the same place, respectively. They just both took a different path between the two sons of Abraham. In 1 John 4:1 the Bible says, "Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world." Be careful what, or who, you acknowledge. For any Christians reading this post, be careful what spirits you let into your life. Look for the Strait and Narrow path. God bless.
Posted by slave123 1 year ago
slave123
Would any of you guys like to be muslim let me know inshallah
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