The Instigator
paulsckwon
Pro (for)
Winning
45 Points
The Contender
or8560
Con (against)
Losing
36 Points

Do you think homeschooling should be aloud.

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Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 2/21/2008 Category: Education
Updated: 9 years ago Status: Voting Period
Viewed: 4,445 times Debate No: 2822
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (13)
Votes (27)

 

paulsckwon

Pro

Hello Daniel, as you know this is Paul and i want to say that i am really sorry for rejecting your debate. The reason was because it's so obvious that landmines are not good and also that the fact i agree in banning landmines. So i decided to make a simpler debate, please except my challenge and people who are going to comment thank you ^^ this is my first debate.

I think that homeschooling should be aloud for the following reasons

1. Educational Freedom
Most students have the choice to study what they want, and when they want.

2.physical Freedom
Without revolving around school hours, homeworks, and the school schedule(the schoo caledar) they can have free time going out for vacation whenever they want live their lives how it works for them
3.Religion Freedom
In schools you cannot study and believe the relgion that you believe, however many people think that relgion plays a very important part of who they are. Also parents can incorporate their beliefs in their lives.
4. Superb family relationships
Nearly all the people who does homeschooling can find time to develop loving ties between family members. Also teens benefit a lot, the rebelious and destructive behaviour begins diminish.
5.Being able to rest well
When homeschooling there is no need for lacking sleep. Sleep is vital to the emotional and also the physical. without it, could end up to a devastating day or class.
or8560

Con

Hello Paul, and hello to all the people who are watching this debate.

First of all home schooling means that a parent thinks that a public school's education systems are not sufficient enough and thinks that they could teach better than the teachers in the public schools. However, there are many flaws in this system and I will say that in the following paragraph.

1. If the public school systems are not sufficient enough, why can you just make it better? And you cannot say that public school's education system are less efficient because, the public school's education system is proves by the government and which has been accepted by the specialists who study education of students. How can you say that unless you are an professional in education, that your teaching method is more effective than a professional scholar?

2. The child who does home schooling will not be used to the society. In school, we could build social relationships among people. However, when you do home schooling, it's only you, your parents, and maybe your tutor. This means that when they get in to the real society, they will not be able to get used to it and cry for their mother.

3. You said that the students will have more freedom in choosing subjects. But here's the bad part; what if, they only choose subjects they like, and they don't choose the subjects that are necessary to the education? For example, you don't like math, and you tell your parents that you don't want to learn math and if they don't teach you, how are you going to pass the college test which requires math?

4. You also said about physical freedom and religion freedom. If you have physical freedom, you will just play and do nothing and play things like PSP or Xbox or something like that. They will not be able to study enough to get the best score in the test. Religion freedom means that even if you don't like the religion, you will be forced to believe in that religion. For example, let's say that you like Christianity. But, your parents say that you have to learn Buddhism because they're Buddhists. This is a clear expulsion of the constitution in which it states, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances." It saids congress but, it also means any individual. By forcing the student to believe in a religion is unspeakable.

5. You said that by doing home schooling, it will be able to improve family relationships. I do not think so. If the student has a different view point in a subject, there will even be more fight in a family.

So, we can conclude that home schooling is not very effective and therefore, it should not be permitted. And thank you for listening.
Debate Round No. 1
paulsckwon

Pro

HELLO DANIEL AND THANK YOU FOR EXCEPTING MY DEBATE ^^ AND PEOPLE WHO ARE WATCHING THIS DEBATE I AM VERY HONORED SO LET'S START LOL

first of all, i didn't say that school systems and education is insuffuficent, all i said was some parents believe that they can teach their children better than the teachers. For they are their parents and the fact that they believe they can teach better, for they know more about the child than any other human being in the world. Also if parents are not professional scholars why can't they become one. Long experience of homeschooling will make them a scholar themselves, humans learn from their mistakes and their pasts, not only from colleges or universities where you major it.

second of all, just because you homeschool doesn't mean that you become less socialized. For instance becoming a member of the night scout association is a perfect example for homeschoolers. In the morning the chidlren can study with their parents and at night they can go out for night scout which obviously starts at night and has nothing to do with school. There children don't experience any kind of stress and play certain activities with other children and alows them to meet many kind of people and increase their socialization.

third of all, i don't think you understood my opinion perfectly. Yes i did say that students have freedom. However i did not say that they will not learn what they need to. The child can focus and concentrate on subjects they like, but their parents will teach them subjects that they do not like as well especially if its a subject that is crucial for going to a good university. What i meant was that when you homeschool you can extend and reduce the time of a certain subject freely, unlike schools where you have to follow the subject schedule. So you can spend more time on subjects that you enjoy.

fourth of all, daniel i am not trying to make you sound stupid(not many people understand what i say ^^) but i do not think you understood what i said again. I will give you an example. Let's say that you were homeschooled from a young age. You studied hard and was accustomed to daily studying habit, now if you were that bright and diligent do you think you will just play PSP and Xbox ^^. Let's say that actually you were like that. Do you think your parents will just see you live like that and ignore your misdeeds, NO they wouldn't right?? you will catch it hot by your parents maybe banned from the electronic entertainment devices and walk the right path of being a sucessful person. Same with religion, children can have freedom from it when homeschooled. unless your parents are both step mother and father, they wouldn't force their children to believe in their religion eventhough they don't like the religion. I am sure that the parents will try to help their children to know and be part of the religion they are interested in. ^^

fifth and last of all, daniel^^ family means a group of people who share the same blood and are closely related. If a member does not think what the other person believes and feels conflict from each other, they will try to understand each other and think of the others view. If they truely love each other they might not even fight at all???

Now i want to introduce you to a person who i admire and who learned by homeschooling. His name is Christopher Paolini, the author of eragon, eldest and brisingr which is going to be released soon. He was homeschooled and look at that person now. He is well manered, very smart and also very socialized. Just because you homeschool that doesn't mean that you are going to grow delinquently.

thank you for listening hope you right your arguement soon daniel ^^

Paul Kwon
or8560

Con

Hello Paul, and thanks for responding even with your busy work.

In your arguments, there was a single thing that I wanted to ask you. What IF the parents force their kids to believe in religions, what IF they do not teach properly, what IF they do not have experiences?

First of all how can you say that parents teach better than the teachers. Yes, parents MIGHT be a professional scholar. However, if you are saying that they are going to be a professional scholar, all the parents HAVE to be a professional scholar. And some parents might not have that quality.

Second, you mentioned about night scouts. I strongly disagree with that. Night scouts are only about 3~4hours and compared with the 5~6 hours of daily social time in school, I have to say that it is not that effective as the schools. Plus, night scouts only does sports, recreation and stuff like that. But, school does more than just sports and recreation but, they study together, and work together as a team much more than the night scouts do.(As I said, kids spend about 5~6 hours in school)

Third, you said about the subjects. However, you said, "but their parents will teach them subjects that they do not like as well especially if its a subject that is crucial for going to a good university" I do not think this is a good idea. This means that parents will force kids to study the things that they don't like no matter what of their opinion. I've found that more than 50% of the people thinks that students should decide their own future. In comparison, I've found that only 16% are agreeing that thinks parents should decide their future.

Fourth, HOW CAN YOU BE SURE that parents will care for their child? What about the parents who work until the night? What about parents who can't afford money to do homeschooling? So, which is better? Good education quality with a professional who knows about teaching, or somebody who did NOT have ANY experience about home schooling?

Fifth, you said about families being close. I do not think that parents and kids don't go together that well these days especially with all the modern technology and the Internet. This BIG generation gap will do a lot of impact on the parents and the kids as well as the whole family. Teens, for example disagree with their parents a lot. How are the parents going to teach them if they don't obey their parents?

Sixth, you said about Christopher Paolini. Well... I can't exactly agree with you... He is only one person that is taught by home schooling and became a great person. What about all the people that are great? Some of them like General Douglas MacArthur was in a school, and was not taught by home schooling.

In conclusion, we can say that home schooling is not very effective and public schools are much more better than home schooling.
Debate Round No. 2
paulsckwon

Pro

Hi Daniel and other people who are watching the debate this is the final arguement and daniel i have to say that i really enjoyed the debate, and let the best man win.
PAUL KWON

They wouldn't because they are their children. What kind of a parent would do such a thing, NO WAY i don't believe any parent would do that, and even if it does happen though it is unlikely. I mean.. have you seen a parent force you to believe a religion the child does not want, that it self as you mentioned in the psat is UNSPEAKABLE. Actually Daniel^^ what you said about forcing children to believe religion they don't like actually occur at school. Almost all the private schools have their own religion and few other public schools. Forcing a child to believe a certain religion occurs more often in school than home which i mention again is not unlikely^^. Also i admire your thought of worrying that parents don't have experiences and don't teach properly. However as i say again parents can obtain experiences by spending years of homeschooling. No person can end up with nothing when they have done a certain job for years. Also, it's hardly unlikely. Parents whom both go to work will obviously not homeschool their children, it is likely that one of the parents stays in the house. Now do you think when the parent has full and essential time for his or her child, they won't even be bothered to teach the child and feel that teaching them are waste of time. However if what you say raelly comes to reality, why just sit there and worry^^ there are always solutions except for going to school. The child can ask your parents for a tutor. The child will study with the parent everyday, and everytime they don't understand anyhting, he or she will write it on a piece of paper and when the tutor comes they can ask the tutor the things that keep making you curious.

Night scouting, i don't see the problem. Night scouts are likely to be in a smaller number than schools, so the teachers can pay more attention to a single individual. Also too much social life is stressing, look at your fathers or mothers who are salarests. They often gibe about a coe-worker doing something wrong and that it gets on their nerves. From that, we can learn that being exposed to society is not a simple work. Studying together?? i am not trying to sound rude(seriously believe me) but i don't think students studying together is effective at all. You know why parents tell their children to study when the other don't. It's becaues of the competition. If all students study and don't at the same time, how could you be the best and go to university where not many people go to.

Daniel, this time i will give you a example. Okay suppose that a girl loved the violin. She was the best in her country, but if she didn't know how to multiply numbers well and can't get the subtraction that is used in daily life (such as the super market)do you think she will be able to go to university that she wants to major? Even if you are marvelous in what you enjoy doing, if you can't master the basics there is no path for you nor is there a dream and goal. I don't really understand why you wrote the percentage of parents thoghts for the childrens future. Well, it's not that i wrote that students shouldn't choose their own future. Just because you do a little bit of what you don't like for the basics, doesn't mean your parents choose a future for you.

As i say again, parents who are busy with work will not have the slightest thought of homeschooling at all. Also if the parents don't even have the money to homeschool, WHY WOULD THEY HOMESCHOOL. Actually private schools are way expensiver then homeschooling so i wouldn't put it that way. "What about parents who can't afford to send their children to school" is the right way to say it i think.

Why would internet be a obstacle between parents and children. If that is real are people just going to stay like that for the rest of their lives. Also how could the teens not obey their parents. They are their teachers, guardians, person who really and truely cares for you, and the financial supporter. Teens cannot live without the facilities their parents offer, therefore they cannot disobey their parents.

Daniel i do believe that your write with that. There are many people who are great who has not received homeschooling. But do you know how many students who have homeschooled get their reputation. The fact is that homeschooling started not long ago while schools have existed even before christ himself was borned. More and more people who have homeschooled are becoming famous and many more will follow in the future.

and this is the end of my last arguement, thanks daiel you were a great foe ^^ hehe
or8560

Con

Hello Paul and thank you for spending your time to a good debate.

1. You said that almost ALL the parents would NOT force their child to believe in a certain religion. That is not true. When I searched in the Internet, I found that more than 40% of the parents force kids to believe in a religion or to ban other religions that they don't like. Especially in Korea, if your parents are a Buddhist, according to Confucius (filial piety) you have to believe in that religion. And that goes same with China, India, Japan, and the whole Asia as well. Even in America, who say that they have a religious freedom, they usually believe in the religions that parents believe because the parents are usually making them believe in the same religions as they believe.

2. I cannot agree with your answer for the second paragraph. Like I said, in this modern society, there are a lot of parents who work full-time and cannot have time to teach their own children. Yes, they can hire tutors if they have enough financial status. However, what about people who are poor? I have a friend who is unfortunately in a bad financial status and if he has to do home schooling, his parents will be in a much greater debt than they are already in.

3. Well, night scouts........ Like I said there are too less time to socialize with people and to make friends. And with this much of academy in nations like Korea, I don't think I can go to night scouts. I would rather stay at home in my opinion.....

4. Your point about "Studying together?? i am not trying to sound rude(seriously believe me) but i don't think students studying together is effective at all." is not proven. However, I have proof that if students study together, they have better grades and attitudes. It saids that when students study together, they will learn their own difficulties and their problems and they will help each other to learn from themselves. Which will lead to good teamwork to good friendships with other people. So this is the cycle (Study together-learn their own problem-learn from themselves-good teamwork-make friends-good relationship-make new friends-learn from new friends.....) Which proves that studying together is better than studying alone.

5. I'm afraid that you misunderstood me. I said, "what if, they only choose subjects they like, and they don't choose the subjects that are necessary to the education?" not, "they WILL choose only science and music" But, it's very likely that parents will not choose subjects that they THINK it's useless. However, how can a professional who majored in education and became a professor in education, be compared to a parent? Like I said, not ALL the parents are a professional in home schooling. However, you said that, "as i say again parents can obtain experiences by spending years of home schooling." That is impossible for a parent who has not done home schooling in his or her life. If you are saying that parents should teach, than parents will have to learn the methods of teaching is a appropriate way. Which could take a lot of time and money. Why not let the professionals teach their child?

6. OK, let's say we do home schooling. Then, we will have to fire all the teachers, have them get a new job, and let the teachers work force, which is about more than 4.0 million people including the K~12, and middle school and high school. What will they do? Starve their families? We cannot get rid of public schooling ANYWAY, because the people want home schooling. I found that 92% of the superintendents (people who are in charge of a number of school in a specific region. go look for it in http://www.wikipedia.com... if you don't know) Believe that home schooling is not very effective. Also in a website called VoTe, I found that 73% of the people support public schooling.

7. Your point about generation gap is not very convincing(to me). Fist of all, teenage is a time when you just don't understand your parents. And we will go through it very soon Paul. Also, in the same website, I found that more than 80% of teenagers (accurate vote is 82%) don't understand their parents. Do you think they will listen to them? I don't think so.

8.Yes, there might be more people who become great people will be home schooled. BUT, for now, it's about 100 versus 1.(the great people who were home schooled.)

In conclusion, we can say that public schooling is much more effective than home schooling and I strongly believe in it. Thank you for watching this debate.
Debate Round No. 3
13 comments have been posted on this debate. Showing 1 through 10 records.
Posted by mikaelthemycologist 9 years ago
mikaelthemycologist
or8560, you also mentioned that teenagers will not listen to their parents, does that mean that non adolescent student's could be home schooled?
Posted by mikaelthemycologist 9 years ago
mikaelthemycologist
The problem with public schools (this is why i am home schooled) is that you tend to travel at the pace of what I like to call "the least common denominator" or, the slowest student. This may be why some parents want their children to be home schooled.

You mentioned that the students might not study to the state education standards. In the state of Florida a home schooled student is subject to testing at any time and samples of the students work must be available.
Posted by salocime 9 years ago
salocime
I agree that more research should have been done by both sides. I also find there are a lot of opinions being thrown around with no facts to back them up. The thoughts on both sides are not deep enough, not thought out enough and not brought to a point of irrefutable truths or logic.

Btw, Gen. Douglas Macarthur WAS homeschooled until he was about 13 or so. A point against CON.
Posted by paul_tigger 9 years ago
paul_tigger
I think both of you could have done a better job of researching the topic. Both of you lack sufficient proof to make your argument stronger than the other. However, this could have been easily won on either side if you had provided statistics and data. Do the research and quit with the generalizations.
Posted by paulsckwon 9 years ago
paulsckwon
i didn't mean to say can, it was can't so don't make fun of me if you do i will consider that as you are blind.
Posted by paulsckwon 9 years ago
paulsckwon
Everybody here please vote for the best man.

p.s. to yoon

i don't think you can say we suck. If we suck you suck too don't insult me or daniel. Yes i knew it was a joke but if it makes the listener feel bad, it is a insult. People who are seeing this comment please type in yoon172 and see his debates. Don't write whether he is good or bad just see it please.
Posted by or8560 9 years ago
or8560
I would like to say that the voters in this debate(looking at the comments) all voted on their opinions. PLEASE vote on the skills and the arguments of the debate.
Posted by Mangani 9 years ago
Mangani
How do you argue that something that IS allowed, SHOULD be allowed??? And "allowed"??? Poor choice of words...
Posted by nitrogen85 9 years ago
nitrogen85
Umm, I was homeschooled, and I have to say that I probably socialize more than kids who go to public school. Plus, I had better grades than anyone I knew going to public school. And religion had a lot to do with why my parents homeschooled me. What made you even want to debate a topic where there were no facts or cases against homeschoolers in a negative way?
Posted by Kleptin 9 years ago
Kleptin
Sexylatina beat me to the punchline....
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