The Instigator
LaL36
Con (against)
Winning
7 Points
The Contender
fadhilaharmen
Pro (for)
Losing
5 Points

Does Israel torture Palestinians?

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
LaL36
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 11/18/2012 Category: Politics
Updated: 4 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,351 times Debate No: 27348
Debate Rounds (3)
Comments (1)
Votes (2)

 

LaL36

Con

I'd like to thank my opponent in advance and wish him luck.

Israel is the only country in the world whose judiciary has squarely faced the difficult issue of whether it is ever justified to engage in even a modified form of nonlethal torture unlike the current methods being used by the United States on captured al-Qaeda prisoners in order to obtain information deemed necessary to prevent a ticking bomb from killing dozens of civilians.

On September 6, 1999, the Israeli Supreme Court decided that not only is torture absolutely prohibited but even the types of physical pressure currently being used by the United States sleep deprivation, forced uncomfortable positions, loud music, shaking, hoods over the head are prohibited by Israeli law, even in cases in which the pressure is used not to elicit a confession but rather to elicit information that could prevent an imminent terrorist attack. Prior to this decision, the Israeli security services did sometimes employ physical measures similar to those now being used by U.S. authorities against suspected terrorists.

Another fact to consider is that Israel used the death penalty only once on Eidolf Eichman who implemented "The Final Solution" a plan to kill all Jews
fadhilaharmen

Pro

Thank you my honorable opponent, and first of all I want to apologize about my bad English, since I am only a junior high school student from a country which doesn't use English as their main language.

Israel is indeed torturing Palestinians, you said before that they are allowed to use physical pressure to gain some information about terrorist attack. The fact is Israel do this "legal" physical pressure not only to the man of Palestine. They also do physical pressure to children. And all of us know, that in the laws of war, killing children, women and aged men are prohibited. A source said that a Palestinian boy got shot by Israel army. Isn't this thing called as torturing?

Israel also break convention on the right of child 1989 that was also signed by Israel. In this convention, one of the right of a child is to live and be raised by their family. In fact, now hundreds of Palestinian children are being captured by Israel army, and be tortured in the prison. Isn't it breaking the human right? Isn't this called torturing?

Thanks, once again I do apologize for my bad English.

Debate Round No. 1
LaL36

Con

Sorry, forgot to cite sources for last debate http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org... "you said before that they are allowed to use physical pressure to gain some information about terrorist attack"

I said they WERE. They currently cannot. And bear in mind they didn't do this to innocent people, rather to potential terrorists just like the United States currently does.

"killing children, women and aged men are prohibited."

This is not Israel's agenda. This is due to collateral damage. Israel never targeted civilians. Israel sends leaflets to warn Palestinians. Collateral damage is common in any war. Israel happens to be even better than America at avoiding civilian casualties. Hamas on the other hand, targets civilians and even says so. Their regime is kill all the Jews wipe Israel off the map at all costs.

"hundreds of Palestinian children are being captured by Israel army, and be tortured in the prison."

Those kids are captured because their parents are terrorists and tell the kids to kill themselves. Israel does this for their safety. And Israeli prisons allow the red cross to come. If the red cross saw something significant they would say so. The issue of torture, perhaps better than any other, illustrates the hypocritical double standard applied against Israel. Israel's record on the issue of torture is far better than that of any other Middle Eastern or any Muslim nation, and better than that of most democracies, including the United States, France, and Germany, but only Israel is repeatedly condemned for engaging in torture it is just absurd for Israel to be repeatedly condemned for torture when their own law prohibits it. " A source said that a Palestinian boy got shot by Israel army."

Could you state that source?

SOURCES: http://www.washingtonpost.com... http://shatteredparadigm.blogspot.com...
fadhilaharmen

Pro

Thank you my wise opponent,

Now let me clarify the person who called as a terrorist here. Palestinians are not terrorist. They are only people from a country that want to take their own territory that has been colonized by other country back. According to the united nation resolution 181 year 1947, Palestine deserved 45% of the land, but the fact now Israel has taken more than 70% of the land. Palestine only fight for what they deserve for all this time. I do believe that all of the people of a country with the same condition as Palestine will also do the same thing. And I extremely believe that this thing can't be called as a terrorism action.

About the Palestinian parent tell their children to kill them self. They never do such thing, what kind of parents that will tell their children to kill them self in the middle of the war. The children of Palestine also want to defend their country, and live free like other children in this world. Their law may be prohibit them to do torture, but the fact in the reality things is different. It's children we're talking here about. They can't be judge as a man. They have some special rights that adult men don't have. And by taking their right it means they've tortured them for real.

Israel also make the men prisoner fasting for more than 20 hours without having any meal before it. Which part of Israel action that don't tell us that they are torturing Palestine. And about the red cross visiting the prisoner, could you give me the source?

Thank you, sorry for using Indonesian source.

Source : http://m.republika.co.id...

http://m.republika.co.id...

http://edition.cnn.com...

http://koranfakta.net...
Debate Round No. 2
LaL36

Con

Source for the red cross visiting and that Israel does not starve prisoners. http://www.maannews.net...

First of all at no point did I refer to Palestinians generally as terrorists . Hamas are the terrorists.

"Palestine deserved 45% of the land, but the fact now Israel has taken more than 70% of the land."

Subsequent to that resolution 5 Arab countries started a war called the " War of independence". Israel gave back land for peace such as the Sinai peninsula and Gaza. Every rocket that Hamas launches breaks the peace treaty.

"And I extremely believe that this thing can't be called as a terrorism action."

By just about every democratic countries' standards, Hamas is a terrorist organization. Initiating wars is terrorism. Targeting civilians is terrorism. Calling for the mass destruction of all Jews Is terrorism. Teaching kids hate and to kill Jews is terrorism.


"About the Palestinian parent tell their children to kill them self. They never do such thing, what kind of parents that will tell their children to kill them self in the middle of the war."

Ever heard of martyrdom. They use this to justify a suicide bombing. Hamas encourages their kids to blow themselves up. Watch this video of a kid suicide bomber and what Israel does to prevent it

This seems the exact opposite of torture.


"Their law may be prohibit them to do torture"

You are ignorant. Terrorism for Hamas, Hezbollah, Al-Quieda etc. all are in the name of Islam. Their law is Islam and they are doing terrorism in the name of Islam. Notice that before a suicide bomber blows himself up, he/she says "Allah Akbar" which means G-d is great.

"It's children we're talking here about. They can't be judge as a man."

I am not judging the children, I am judging the people raising the children who are raising them to be terrorists and suicide bombers.

"And by taking their right it means they've tortured them for real."

First of all, they don't take away their right. Second of all, this wouldn't be torture. Torture: To afflict severe pain to body or mind. This is from dictionary.com.

"Israel also make the men prisoner fasting for more than 20 hours without having any meal before it."

It is clear you are ignorant about Israeli prisons. Read this article.
http://www.timesofisrael.com...


"Which part of Israel action that don't tell us that they are torturing Palestine."
The fact that they allow Palestinians to come for treatment.the fact that they send leaflets to Gaza. The fact that they send aid to gaza. None of this embodies terrorism.


Before anyone says YouTube is not a reliable source, see the video and realize that there is nothing fake about it.

Sidenote: You didn't provide your source in regard to Palestinian boy getting shot by the army.

Conclusion: Israel is based on freedom, democracy, and constitution. It never instills torture. Torture is currently being done by a lot of Muslim countries. Nonetheless, in all absurdity, Israel is so viciously condemned for the action of torture which THEIR OWN LAW PROHIBITS. It is against Israeli law therefore it is a fact Israel does not torture Palestinians. Thank you for an interesting debate and thank you voters for reading.
fadhilaharmen

Pro

fadhilaharmen forfeited this round.
Debate Round No. 3
1 comment has been posted on this debate.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by Ron-Paul 4 years ago
Ron-Paul
LaL36fadhilaharmenTied
Agreed with before the debate:--Vote Checkmark0 points
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Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
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Total points awarded:25 
Reasons for voting decision: Conduct to con for forfeit. S&G to con because it is obvious. Arguments to counter the last vote. Sources because of link in comments.
Vote Placed by truthseeker613 4 years ago
truthseeker613
LaL36fadhilaharmenTied
Agreed with before the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Agreed with after the debate:Vote Checkmark--0 points
Who had better conduct:Vote Checkmark--1 point
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Total points awarded:50 
Reasons for voting decision: I know this may look like a vote bomb. but sometimes one debator really does deserve all the points: Conduct: F.F. S & G : Even though it's not pro's fault as he explained. Never the less his S & G was not good. MCA: F.F. M.R.S. : Pro's sources were in a language which I am not familiar with.