The Instigator
kohai
Pro (for)
Losing
3 Points
The Contender
anarcholibertyman
Con (against)
Winning
6 Points

Does absolute truth exist?

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 3 votes the winner is...
anarcholibertyman
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 4/1/2011 Category: Philosophy
Updated: 5 years ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 1,516 times Debate No: 15750
Debate Rounds (4)
Comments (0)
Votes (3)

 

kohai

Pro

Thanks to whoever accepts this debate. I wish my opponent the best of luck.

Rules:
1) You must refute the opponents arguments and provide your own
2) For the voters: please vote, "Tie" for spelling and grammar and conduct, unless either one of us have terrible spelling and grammar, or conduct ourselves in a poor manner.

In my debate, I will argue that absolute truth, does in fact, exist.

Let me start out by defining absolute truth: Absolute truth is defined as inflexible reality: fixed, invariable, unalterable facts.

Allow me to begin my arguments:
1) "Absolute truth does not exist." If you say that, then that is an absolute truth.
2) No matter how much I believe something, that does not make it right. For example, I could believe all I want that there is a fire-breathing dragon in my bedroom that only I can see; however, that does not mean that there is a fire-breathing dragon in my room.

I am anticipating my opponent's reply. Good luck and please, take what I just said and really ponder that.

Good luck! I gladly turn it over to con
anarcholibertyman

Con

1) "Absolute truth does not exist." If you say that, then that is an absolute truth.

I am not making the claim that absolute truth exists. I am taking the agnostic position that it is unknown whether or not absolute truth exists.

2) No matter how much I believe something, that does not make it right. For example, I could believe all I want that there is a fire-breathing dragon in my bedroom that only I can see; however, that does not mean that there is a fire-breathing dragon in my room.

I do not understand this argument or how it pertains to this debate. I ask my opponent to clarify on his position before I reply.
Debate Round No. 1
kohai

Pro

Thank you, con, for accepting this debate.

"I am not making the claim that absolute truth exists. I am taking the agnostic position that it is unknown whether or not absolute truth exists."

You say that it is unknown, however, in some cases, can we not know for a fact that absolute truth exists? For example, the truth that there are no round squares and that there are no square circles is an absolute truth. No matter how much I want to believe that there are round squares, it does not change the fact that there are none.

"I do not understand this argument or how it pertains to this debate. I ask my opponent to clarify on his position before I reply"

What I mean is, no matter how much I sincerely believe something that is wrong, it does not change the fact that my belief is wrong.

Please make your arguments on why absolute truth does not exist, or why we cannot know whether or not it exists.
anarcholibertyman

Con

"You say that it is unknown, however, in some cases, can we not know for a fact that absolute truth exists? For example, the truth that there are no round squares and that there are no square circles is an absolute truth. No matter how much I want to believe that there are round squares, it does not change the fact that there are none."
---We do not know that we do not live in a multiverse. Perhaps there could be a universe where squares are circled and circles are squared. We have no absolute knowledge that this is not the truth while it may be improbable.

My opponent has asked me to provide my own case on why absolute truth does not exist. However as there are logically only two options, it exists or it doesn't, disproving or shedding doubt on whether absolute truth does exist would further my own case.
Debate Round No. 2
kohai

Pro

"---We do not know that we do not live in a multi-universe. Perhaps there could be a universe where squares are circled and circles are squared. We have no absolute knowledge that this is not the truth while it may be improbable."

Okay, but at least in this universe it is an absolute truth.

Other absolute truths:
If you say, "There is no such thing as absolute truth" then that has to be an absolute truth! What is the absolute truth that you say? The absolute truth is that there is no absolute truth.

Whether or not everything is an absolute truth or not is not in question, what is in question is whether or not it could possibly exist or if there are things that are absolute truths. As indicated above, there must be, at least, a possibility of an absolute truth!

Let me define what truth is. Truth is reality. So when you were to say, "There is no such thing as absolute truth" you are saying, "The reality is absolute reality does not exist" which makes no sense.
anarcholibertyman

Con

'Okay, but at least in this universe it is an absolute truth.'

It is not an absolute truth in that it is not true in every situation. It is actually a contingent truth in that it's validity is depedent on the universe.

'If you say, "There is no such thing as absolute truth" then that has to be an absolute truth! What is the absolute truth that you say? The absolute truth is that there is no absolute truth.'

I am not making this claim. As stated earlier I stated that we do not know.
Debate Round No. 3
kohai

Pro

It is not an absolute truth in that it is not true in every situation. It is actually a contingent truth in that it's validity is decedent on the universe."

Okay, but we know that in some situations there is an absolute truth or not. Let me make a few examples.

1) There is or isn't a God

I am not saying yes or no to this question, I'm just making a point. If there is no God, then that has to be true everywhere. If there isn't a God, then that has to be true everywhere.

2) In our solar system, the Sun is larger than the Earth

No matter where you go in the universe or in other universes, if they exist, that still won't change the fact that in this solar system, the Earth is smaller than the Sun.
anarcholibertyman

Con

1) There is or isn't a God

""I am not saying yes or no to this question, I'm just making a point. If there is no God, then that has to be true everywhere. If there isn't a God, then that has to be true everywhere.""

Not necessarily. Again, it depends on what universe. Multiverse theory is credible so if there is a god, he may exist in one universe and not in another.

2) In our solar system, the Sun is larger than the Earth

""No matter where you go in the universe or in other universes, if they exist, that still won't change the fact that in this solar system, the Earth is smaller than the Sun.""

This fact is entirely contingent on what one means by the word 'larger'. To a Brazilian person who speaks Porteguese this word makes no sense and does not represent an absolute truth. The truth of the claim that the sun is larger than the Earth is entirely contingent on what language you are using. Like I may try to convey to someone that 2+2=4. This may be a truth to you and me but say that I speak in complete jibberish. I am still trying to convey the same idea but my actual statement itself does not represent an absolute truth.

I say that voters should vote for me in that I refuted every one of my opponent's examples of a supposed 'absolute truth'.
Debate Round No. 4
No comments have been posted on this debate.
3 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 3 records.
Vote Placed by Cliff.Stamp 5 years ago
Cliff.Stamp
kohaianarcholibertymanTied
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Total points awarded:30 
Reasons for voting decision: "This fact is entirely contingent on what one means by the word 'larger'. " - no it isn't, an objective truth is not rendered invalid if it is unknown so simply because someone might not know what you mean if you say 1 < 2 does not mean it is not a true objective fact, simply consider if this approach is valid then the resolution could be won by simply redefining it
Vote Placed by socialpinko 5 years ago
socialpinko
kohaianarcholibertymanTied
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Reasons for voting decision: Con made a very covincing argument. I am assuming Pro was trying to lead him into a trap where he makes the claim that absolute truth does not exist, but he kind of surprised me and took an agnostic position. Anarcholibertyman's closing arguments blew my mind, well I'm easily amused.
Vote Placed by RougeFox 5 years ago
RougeFox
kohaianarcholibertymanTied
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Reasons for voting decision: Con did a nice job with this one by taking the "we can't know" stance. I might have refuted the examples a little different, but that's okay. It seemed like Pro just assumed that con had to take the position of "absolute truth does not exist" even though con in the debate round never made that claim. The examples were refuted, even though I'm not a big fan of the multi-universe argument. Con could have won without it. Good debate though.