The Instigator
unknown_and_unexpected
Pro (for)
Winning
6 Points
The Contender
diarrhea_of_a_wimpy_kid
Con (against)
Losing
1 Points

Does heavy/angry music contribute to or prevent suicide? (Pro=Prevents, Con=Contributes)

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Post Voting Period
The voting period for this debate has ended.
after 2 votes the winner is...
unknown_and_unexpected
Voting Style: Open Point System: 7 Point
Started: 1/28/2016 Category: Music
Updated: 1 year ago Status: Post Voting Period
Viewed: 656 times Debate No: 85723
Debate Rounds (5)
Comments (0)
Votes (2)

 

unknown_and_unexpected

Pro

People say that heavy or angry music, like screamo, punk, or emo, contributes to suicide. They say it is "crap". Some even say it's not even music, it's "just noise". But who wants to listen to happy music when they're depressed? It would just make them feel worse. Heavy music provides something that these people can relate to. When they have no one and nothing left in their corner, so to speak, music is their release for the pent up anger. Their favorite bands are the only ones who "get" them, who understand them.
diarrhea_of_a_wimpy_kid

Con

Thank you for the opportunity to debate this topic. I found it interesting because I know people who enjoy heavy or angry music and they are perfectly functional with no observable depression or suicidal tendencies. While my taste in music differs, I have no negative bias towards the genre or those who listen to it.

Assumptions:
The population referenced in your opening would be those currently experiencing suicidal thoughts. In other words, Happy Joe Family Guy won't off himself because he puts in Marlyn Manson by mistake and starts thrashing.

So why do I take the con?

There is no direct prevention nor contribution to suicide through heavy/angry music. The underlying causes of suicidal thought or depressions come from much deeper emotional issues and pressures than the music the person listens to. Music provides a short-term effect of empathy and understanding. An angry person responds best when another person expresses outrage for or with them. An angry person can grow more hostile when a compassionate person attempts to sooth them, like it is an invalidation of the experience.

The "contribution" of angry music to suicide comes from the expectation that listening to the music provides a panacea for existing depression. The listener will seek a short-term "fix" of musical empathy rather than address the underlying causes of the suicidal thoughts. It can be used in some cases as a method of escape or avoidance to tune out the underlying conflict, which in extreme case can lead to suicide.

Music offers a fleeting escape from the pain. However, it does not cure it. Much like codeine neither prevents nor causes a sprained ankle. If the ankle is sprained, and the pain is dulled or removed with codeine, then the underlying injury could become more severe when not treated properly.
Debate Round No. 1
unknown_and_unexpected

Pro

In a sense, that is exactly my point. When I say that people believe heavy music contributes to suicide, I am referring to people such as the parents in the case of the two brothers in Reno in 1985 who committed suicide after listening to Judas Priest, or the case of Truman Edley's suicide (Article about Truman Edley - http://www.dailymail.co.uk...), both parents blamed the music the children had been listening to at the time, and sued.

As for the fact that music offers only a temporary relief to the pain, in a sense, depending on your personal position on that topic, you would be right, but to an extent.

I speak from personal experience when I say that music can be used to prevent suicide. I myself have been saved by music, and I have watched the progression of my best friend as she progressed toward and recovered from almost committing suicide. It got to the point where she actually had the gun to her head. Today, we are still closer than close, possibly closer than before. I still have my best friend, thanks to music.

If a person's life is hanging on the line, and the only thing they have to turn to for escape is music, you're darn right it's going to be what saves them. It has been scientifically proven that music has many positive effects on the brain; it even has been proven to heal physical pain, such as headaches). It has been proven to help with depression, as well.

(You're welcome. Glad you took an interest. This is a very personal topic to me, as I mentioned before, it goes deeper than just observations and research. Also, I have been associated with many people who have a very large negative bias toward this type of music, based on the very fact we are debating here.)
diarrhea_of_a_wimpy_kid

Con

I'm going to do something that I don't usually do in a debate; I'm basically going to agree with you.

If I could vote and that little "Who did you agree with before the debate?" question would go in your direction. And Truman Edley's parents were wrong. Stupid lawsuit.

I took the debate for two reasons:
1. I saw a challenge on a good topic. I saw a way to add a nuance to the interpretation and I like to make my brain work.
2. It's a serious topic that deserves a serious discussion. I did not want to see someone else come in and minimize the angst of someone considering suicide.

You're looking all gothy in the avatar and I figured there was a method to this madness (forgive the expression), not just a bored teen being dumb for giggles. So I responded.

Hey I've been there, too. I was saved by a strong soul who took an interest and got me the hell out of the situation I was in. I'm not going to counter-point your personal experience. It's too important. I'm really glad you helped your friend because someone helped me through a tough time. It wasn't music that helped me, but a paradigm shift in my life. There is no wrong way to help someone, and if it worked, I'm genuinely happy for both of you.

I'll be happy to give you a fourm for discussion by letting you fill the last three arguments or we can just post quick ones to wrap it up.
Debate Round No. 2
unknown_and_unexpected

Pro

I rest my case. People are always quick to diss something, and to argue why they believe they are right, but once there is a legitimate argument is offered, nobody can say anything. Not that I'm saying this about you, just a generalization of everyone who I've personally talked to about this. I'll be honest, I didn't expect the debate to end so quickly. I'd like to thank you for accepting my challenge.
diarrhea_of_a_wimpy_kid

Con

I didn't expect it to end quickly either.

I disagreed more with the premise behind the debate than the pro/con I had to argue against/for. I don't see this as a black/white contributing factor to suicide. Unless something is chemically wrong in the brain or there is substance abuse leading to suicide, I see environmental factors playing a much larger role in the depression than musical taste. Music forms an emotional connection on some level based upon experiences. That's why every break-up song ever written was written just for us when we go through a break-up. Likewise, every song of hope applies when we go through joyous events. The music preference reflects our experiences; instead of preventing or contributing to them. There may be a certain amount of circular re-inforcement over time, but I don't see that as a primary contributor. I didn't have that option to debate it that way.

I had no idea how I was supposed to come up with three more rounds of "music didn't help your friend" even though you were there and you said it did. Kind of nowhere else for me to go with it.

Debate Round No. 3
unknown_and_unexpected

Pro

So shall we wrap this up then? Only one more round after this.
Would it be okay if I were to add you as a friend? I have read some of your debates, you could be a good opponent for me. I tend to be a very argumentative person on certain topics.
diarrhea_of_a_wimpy_kid

Con

Yea, let's wrap it up.

Vote pro. Maybe I'll get a conduct point. :-P
Debate Round No. 4
unknown_and_unexpected

Pro

Okay then. Last round.
diarrhea_of_a_wimpy_kid

Con

Take a listen. It'll cheer everyone up.

https://www.youtube.com...
Debate Round No. 5
No comments have been posted on this debate.
2 votes have been placed for this debate. Showing 1 through 2 records.
Vote Placed by kkjnay 1 year ago
kkjnay
unknown_and_unexpecteddiarrhea_of_a_wimpy_kidTied
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Total points awarded:31 
Reasons for voting decision: Probably not the best debate for Con to pick since he doesn't disagree. I've been there though, if you check my only loss, I was arguing a stance I didn't actually agree with. Conduct points to Con for being a good sport. Glad to see that the debaters have become friends. In hindsight you probably would both agree that this should have been a discussion rather than a debate haha
Vote Placed by FlamboGus 1 year ago
FlamboGus
unknown_and_unexpecteddiarrhea_of_a_wimpy_kidTied
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Total points awarded:30 
Reasons for voting decision: Concession by Con.